I had been recommending to folks, for use in the M1a, H4895. This was based on information that H4895 was shorter cut than IMR 4895. Based on a recent visual examination of H4895, I was unable to notice any dimensional differences between the powders. The only differences I saw were that IMR 4895 is a tube, H4895 is a cylinder, and H4895 is green.
If there are differences in the powders, it has to be in the chemistry of the powders.
The comparison was made with Military Surplus IMR 4895 to new H 4895.
I tested some H4895 loads in my recently rebarreled M1a, and in my Ruger M77.
As match bullets have gotten hideously expensive, I decided to shoot some of my pulled 174 FMJBT bullets. These bullets vary considerably by weight, and I sorted them into two categories: bullets which weighed more than 174 grains, and bullets less than 174 grains!. By comparison, a Sierra Matchking seldom varies by 0.2 of a grain.
I was just looking for velocity comparisons and potential group diameters.
I also shot some of my old “White Box” M118 308 Match ammo. This stuff was loaded with the old 174 FMJ. Even though I was looking at the box yesterday, I cannot remember if the printed velocity was 2550 fps or higher. Anyway, out of my M1a, LC79 M118 chronographed at exactly 2550 fps.
For me, this provides a basis for comparison. I know the LC match was pressure tested both for breech pressure and port pressure and is completely compatible with the M14 action. So I figure if my loads with H4895 are close to M118, I am not stressing my rifle.
Due to small sample size, I had a funny: in the M1a, the velocity average of 41.0 grains of H4895 was exactly the same as 41.5 grains. However with the 26” Ruger barrel, the data does show a difference.
If I start trying this powder with 168’s, based on velocities, I think 41.0 grains would be close to a maximum target load for 100 F days in August at Camp Perry. Velocities were slightly higher with this load than M118, so it likely to be a little higher pressure. For target shooting out to 300 yards, you don’t have to push the 168’s all that fast. Perhaps at 600 yards, and with more experience with this powder, I would bump up the charge.
Until I shoot up a bunch of this stuff, I cannot say it is any better than IMR 4895 or AA2495. I have shot kegs of those powders and found they provided consistent target grade performance in the .223/308/30-06. And since there is no short cut advantage to H4895, future buys are going to be based on whatever powders are cheaper.
Still, it looks like it has potential.
M1a, new 22” Douglas 1:10 six groove barrel.
174 FMJBT 40.5 grs H4895 wtd, lot 4501 LC mixed WLR
OAL 2.800"
18 May 2008 T = 71 °F
Ave Vel = 2524
Std Dev = 36
ES = 90
High = 2587
Low = 2497
N = 5
good group
174 FMJBT 41.0 grs H4895 wtd, lot 4501 LC mixed WLR
OAL 2.800"
18 May 2008 T = 71 °F
Ave Vel = 2594
Std Dev = 14
ES = 30
High = 2609
Low = 2579
N = 5
174 FMJBT 41.5 grs H4895 wtd, lot 4501 LC mixed WLR
OAL 2.800"
18 May 2008 T = 71 °F
Ave Vel = 2593
Std Dev = 15
ES = 42
High = 2613
Low = 2571
N = 5
Best group
174 FMJBT LC79 Match M118 White Box
18 May 2008 T = 71 °F
Ave Vel = 2550
Std Dev = 16
ES = 41
High = 2564
Low = 2523
N = 5
Ruger M77 MKII Factory 26 " Barrel 1:10 twist
174 FMJBT 40.5 grs H4895 wtd, lot 4501 LC mixed WLR
OAL 2.800"
18 May 2008 T = 71 °F
Ave Vel = 2559
Std Dev = 14
ES = 50
High = 2589
Low = 2539
N = 11
good group
174 FMJBT 41.0 grs H4895 wtd, lot 4501 LC mixed WLR
OAL 2.800"
18 May 2008 T = 71 °F
Ave Vel = 2634
Std Dev = 19
ES = 50
High = 2657
Low = 2607
N = 6
good group
174 FMJBT 41.5 grs H4895 wtd, lot 4501 LC mixed WLR
OAL 2.800"
18 May 2008 T = 71 °F
Ave Vel = 2670
Std Dev = 3
ES = 9
High = 2675
Low = 2666
N = 5
good group
174 FMJBT LC79 Match M118 White Box
18 May 2008 T = 71 °F
Ave Vel = 2590
Std Dev = 11
ES = 35
High = 2609
Low = 2574
N = 9
Excellent group
If there are differences in the powders, it has to be in the chemistry of the powders.
The comparison was made with Military Surplus IMR 4895 to new H 4895.
I tested some H4895 loads in my recently rebarreled M1a, and in my Ruger M77.
As match bullets have gotten hideously expensive, I decided to shoot some of my pulled 174 FMJBT bullets. These bullets vary considerably by weight, and I sorted them into two categories: bullets which weighed more than 174 grains, and bullets less than 174 grains!. By comparison, a Sierra Matchking seldom varies by 0.2 of a grain.
I was just looking for velocity comparisons and potential group diameters.
I also shot some of my old “White Box” M118 308 Match ammo. This stuff was loaded with the old 174 FMJ. Even though I was looking at the box yesterday, I cannot remember if the printed velocity was 2550 fps or higher. Anyway, out of my M1a, LC79 M118 chronographed at exactly 2550 fps.
For me, this provides a basis for comparison. I know the LC match was pressure tested both for breech pressure and port pressure and is completely compatible with the M14 action. So I figure if my loads with H4895 are close to M118, I am not stressing my rifle.
Due to small sample size, I had a funny: in the M1a, the velocity average of 41.0 grains of H4895 was exactly the same as 41.5 grains. However with the 26” Ruger barrel, the data does show a difference.
If I start trying this powder with 168’s, based on velocities, I think 41.0 grains would be close to a maximum target load for 100 F days in August at Camp Perry. Velocities were slightly higher with this load than M118, so it likely to be a little higher pressure. For target shooting out to 300 yards, you don’t have to push the 168’s all that fast. Perhaps at 600 yards, and with more experience with this powder, I would bump up the charge.
Until I shoot up a bunch of this stuff, I cannot say it is any better than IMR 4895 or AA2495. I have shot kegs of those powders and found they provided consistent target grade performance in the .223/308/30-06. And since there is no short cut advantage to H4895, future buys are going to be based on whatever powders are cheaper.
Still, it looks like it has potential.
M1a, new 22” Douglas 1:10 six groove barrel.
174 FMJBT 40.5 grs H4895 wtd, lot 4501 LC mixed WLR
OAL 2.800"
18 May 2008 T = 71 °F
Ave Vel = 2524
Std Dev = 36
ES = 90
High = 2587
Low = 2497
N = 5
good group
174 FMJBT 41.0 grs H4895 wtd, lot 4501 LC mixed WLR
OAL 2.800"
18 May 2008 T = 71 °F
Ave Vel = 2594
Std Dev = 14
ES = 30
High = 2609
Low = 2579
N = 5
174 FMJBT 41.5 grs H4895 wtd, lot 4501 LC mixed WLR
OAL 2.800"
18 May 2008 T = 71 °F
Ave Vel = 2593
Std Dev = 15
ES = 42
High = 2613
Low = 2571
N = 5
Best group
174 FMJBT LC79 Match M118 White Box
18 May 2008 T = 71 °F
Ave Vel = 2550
Std Dev = 16
ES = 41
High = 2564
Low = 2523
N = 5
Ruger M77 MKII Factory 26 " Barrel 1:10 twist
174 FMJBT 40.5 grs H4895 wtd, lot 4501 LC mixed WLR
OAL 2.800"
18 May 2008 T = 71 °F
Ave Vel = 2559
Std Dev = 14
ES = 50
High = 2589
Low = 2539
N = 11
good group
174 FMJBT 41.0 grs H4895 wtd, lot 4501 LC mixed WLR
OAL 2.800"
18 May 2008 T = 71 °F
Ave Vel = 2634
Std Dev = 19
ES = 50
High = 2657
Low = 2607
N = 6
good group
174 FMJBT 41.5 grs H4895 wtd, lot 4501 LC mixed WLR
OAL 2.800"
18 May 2008 T = 71 °F
Ave Vel = 2670
Std Dev = 3
ES = 9
High = 2675
Low = 2666
N = 5
good group
174 FMJBT LC79 Match M118 White Box
18 May 2008 T = 71 °F
Ave Vel = 2590
Std Dev = 11
ES = 35
High = 2609
Low = 2574
N = 9
Excellent group
