Hi-Capacity 9's

[BlindJustice]

Discussion: or Debate if anyone findsan error

A time line of Hi-Cap 9's

* First Hi-Cap 9x19 full size Service pistol
1935 - Pistole 35 or P-35 Adopted by the Belgium
Army in 1935 FN Hi Power aka browning High Power BHP
SAO Semi-Auto John Browning began, and FIM's Saive finished,

* First USA made hi-Cap 9x19
1969 - S&W Model 59
DA/SA Semi-Auto

Andalongcame theSuper 9's on of
the first, t

CZ 75 DA/SA -or- SA Cond One capable
14+1

* First Poly frame 'Striker' Fired DAO Semi-AUto 9x19
Glock 17


So, when did the Beretta 92 'begin'
doesn't it have a family tree of going back to
the 1950 Brigadier - SAO Single Stack 9x19?

Any other firsts?

R-

 

[David E]

The Model 59 was introduced in 1971

 

[LNK]

Standard capacity 9's you mean......

LNK

Holy old thread....

 

[BlindJustice]

LNK defines a new norm?

Standard Capacity

Luger P-08 8+1
* First full size DA/SA SSerice Pistol
Walter P-28 8+1 same as the luger
Other 9's of the 30s Vis Radom, and Lahti
were in the 8+1 cap.

1950
- Sig P210 8+1
- Colt Commander 8+1
- Beretta Brigadier? 8+1

 

[9mmepiphany]

* First Poly frame 'Striker' Fired DAO Semi-AUto 9x19
Glock 17

Not quite

The H&K VP70 predated the G17 by 12 years...as the name suggests, introduced in 1970...and it held 18 rounds in a true double stack magazine; also available in a select fire version

 

[horsemen61]

all very cool info guys

 

[JTQ]

Standard capacity 9's you mean......

LNK

LNK defines a new norm?

I don't think so.
Browning Hi-Power standard capacity = 13 rounds.

Glock 17 standard capacity = 17 rounds.

Beretta 92FS standard capacity = 15 rounds.

Magazines available for those pistols with capacities greater than those listed would be high capacity magazines. Magazines for those pistols with fewer rounds would be reduced capacity. As listed, those are standard capacity pistols.

 

[usp9]

Luger P08 with a drum count?

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[TestPilot]

LNK defines a new norm?

...

No.

You are trying to define "high."

The problem starts when people stops describing things for what it is and start describing it with their subjective judgment.

15~18 round magazines are just that: 15~18 round magazines.

"High capacity magazine" is nothing more than a subjective judgment about them which is arbitrary and meaningless. What makes magazine a "Hi-cap"? Sure, P-35 had higher than norm capacity when introduced, but since 15~18 rounds are not higher than norm now, it would not be "Hi-cap" on that line of reasoning. When does it become a "Hi-cap"? 8 rounds ? 9 rounds? 10 rounds? Who decides that?

I believe you were just using what you thought was the norm for describing them. However, the community is sensitive about it because the "hi-cap" term was coined and used mostly for bad reasons. It is either used as a markeding hype, not as much now since there's nothing special about 15~ 18 round magazines now, or used to demonize those pistols by anti-self defense rights groups.

Magazines with increased size than the standard magazine would be "extended magazine," not "Hi-cap." I am not going to think a 6 round pistol magazine extended to hold 8 rounds is "high capacity."

 

[TestPilot]

So, when did the Beretta 92 'begin'
doesn't it have a family tree of going back to
the 1950 Brigadier - SAO Single Stack 9x19?

Its design features were already in full by WWII time. I think Beretta "referenced" P-38 quite a bit.

http://eartist.nl/Exploded view.jpg

http://eartist.nl/waltherp38-5.jpg

Actually, lengthen the open part of the slide and the "dust cover" portion of the frame, and P-38 would look like a Beretta.

 

[tarosean]

Magazines with increased size than the standard magazine would be "extended magazine," not "Hi-cap." I am not going to think a 6 round pistol magazine extended to hold 8 rounds is "high capacity."

awe shucks I was just gonna call the new S&W R8 and the 627PC hi cap revolvers....