Interested in a Range Run

[rjk2475]

for recreational and therapeutic shooting; .223 or 7.62x39 would be nice, however, from what I read and hear, you roll the dice on good accuracy out of the box. I'm not a gunsmith and don't want to rebed, replace triggers, mess with hand loads--just shoot. Can you lay reasonable money down and do this?(sub MOA of course)

 

[Robert]

for recreational and therapeutic shooting; .223 or 7.62x39 would be nice, however, from what I read and hear, you roll the dice on good accuracy out of the box. I'm not a gunsmith and don't want to rebed, replace triggers, mess with hand loads--just shoot. Can you lay reasonable money down and do this?(sub MOA of course)

What is reasonable money?

 

[Bushpilot]

You will do it easier, cheaper and with a greater selection of rifles with the .223 then you will with the 7.62x39. I've shot a CZ in 7.62x39 that was pretty accurate. I don't know whether it was sub-moa or not but it shot surprisingly well. As far as the 223 is concerned, most of the good, heavy barrel, bolt action varmint models with good ammo are probably going to shoot at the levels you are interested in.

 

[someguy2800]

223 is an extreamly accurate cartridge, just not with the cheapest ammo on the shelf. My AR15 is sub moa with Hornady steel match ammo which is $22 per 50. For cheap accurate shooting I would get a bolt gun like a Ruger American, Tikka T3, Savage, TC compass, ect... whatever feels good to you in 223 and find a factory match ammo it likes. 6.5 creedmore, 308, and 243 also have good factory match ammo for relatively cheap, but 223 will be by far the cheapest to shoot.

 

[Geno]

Are you looking for a bolt-action, or a semi-auto?

Geno

 

[Swifty Morgan]

If you can live with rimfire, the .17 HMR will shoot sub-MOA with cheap factory ammo. But it doesn't work on windy days.

 

[rjk2475]

bolt action

 

[Geno]

There are several contemporary, heavy-barreled rifles manufactured that will achieve sub-MOA accuracy. The next logical question is how much you are willing to expend for the purchase.

I suggest you anticipate at least an equal expenditure for your optic, rings and base. Good leads: Winchester, Ruger, Savage, Remington, Weatherby, others. As to chambering, .223 Remington.

As to optics, wow, they can get expensive fast! Do not go cheap on your optic or mounting. Nikon, Leupold have nice entry glass.

I know you do not reload...yet! You will, eventually when the “accuracy-bug” bites you. And it will...eventually...

Geno

 

[adcoch1]

On a budget, I'd get a Savage in 223, a bigger budget a cz in 223. My cz 7.62x39 is sub moa but good ammo isn't cheap unless you reload. 223 quality ammo can be had for reasonable cost

 

[someguy2800]

One thing I will add to this is that I have several rifles that have no problem shooting sub MOA with sporter weight barrels. Barrel weight does not equal accuracy. I just don't see any need for a long heavy varmint barrel for a 223.

 

[rjk2475]

which rifles do you have?

 

[rjk2475]

Tikka or Howa?

 

[ExAgoradzo]

So, this is where I am right now. I plan to purchase one before end of summer. I will buy the CZ American M1. There is a carbine version of that floats your boat. 1-9”, 21 7/8” barrel.

The other option is the Ruger M77. I can’t remember the model, but it MSRPs for $1200 or so. I’ll take the 1/2 price CZ. Having said that I love all my Rugers. I just don’t have that change at the moment without selling some stuff...

Those where the best options I found.

I’ll top it with a Vortex.

YMMV
Greg

 

[rjk2475]

Nice choice; do you plan to shoot factory ammo or reload?

 

[jmr40]

Here ya go. Around $400 out the door.

https://ruger.com/products/americanRiflePredator/specSheets/26944.html

https://shop.whittakerguns.com/product/47491

Takes AR magazines and every one of the Americans I've shot was excellent. I own this rifle in 308 and 6.5 Creedmoor and a standard rifle in 223. They are the most accurate rifles in my safe. Unlike most bolt action 223's this one is twisted for the heavier target ammo. Most bolt 223's are not designed for bullets over 50-55 gr.

 

[CoalTrain49]

Here ya go. Around $400 out the door.

https://ruger.com/products/americanRiflePredator/specSheets/26944.html

https://shop.whittakerguns.com/product/47491

Takes AR magazines and every one of the Americans I've shot was excellent. I own this rifle in 308 and 6.5 Creedmoor and a standard rifle in 223. They are the most accurate rifles in my safe. Unlike most bolt action 223's this one is twisted for the heavier target ammo. Most bolt 223's are not designed for bullets over 50-55 gr.

I have to disagree with that. My 1:9 Howas actually prefers 62's.

The Ruger American has a 1:8 twist which is not real common in .223 bolt guns as most are 1:9 these days. 1:8 would allow one to use bullets in the 50-80. 1:9 would allow you to use bullets in the 45-75 grain range. The most common bullet weights for .223 fall in the 50 and 60 grain range. Around here you have to look pretty hard to find anything heavier than 62 and it gets real expensive when you do find it.

There's a good reason most bolt guns have 1:9 twist. It hits the sweet spot for most .223 shooters which is around 53-62 grains. Varmint hunters actually prefer lighter bullets. If you want to shoot a heavier bullet for matches than a 1:8 twist would be a good choice but for most shooters 1:9 is optimal as it will stabilize the 40 grain bullets that most varmint hunters like.

I think Savage may be your best bet here. Howa and CZ are two more good ones to look at.

Please note that I'm not talking about AR's or 5.65 x 45. Those are generally going to have 1:7 for a military ammo.

 

[ExAgoradzo]

Nice choice; do you plan to shoot factory ammo or reload?

I’m sorry...I plan to shoot M193 probably almost solely. Because then whatever manufacturer I find it will be consistent and I don’t need to reload myself. If I do move up in grains I might reload those because they will be more expensive.
But that American listed above looks mighty nice as well... have to check into it...

Greg

 

[CoalTrain49]

One thing I will add to this is that I have several rifles that have no problem shooting sub MOA with sporter weight barrels. Barrel weight does not equal accuracy. I just don't see any need for a long heavy varmint barrel for a 223.

I have to disagree with some of this. Barrel weight does increase the stiffens or rigidity of a barrel. Barrel length usually doesn't help with that and a longer barrel can actually make a barrel less stiff. The contour of a barrel is also an import fact to achieve a stiffer barrel. Short heavy barrels with a varmint type contour ( think fat) are very stiff. I have one (20'') and it's a much better configuration than a light 22" sporter contour regarding accuracy. Of course it's a much heavier rifle and used for benchrest, but in terms of accuracy it really isn't much of a contest.

I guess it has a lot to do with how you want to use the rifle but comparing the accuracy of the two is futile. I certainly wouldn't want to pack that heavy varmint rifle very far. The sporter is a 1 MOA rifle so it works pretty well for it's intended purpose. There are many of these available.

http://riflebarrels.com/a-look-at-the-rigidity-of-benchrest-barrels/