Keeping The Bar Raised.

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I must side with sm on this one. But my absense has been much longer than 24 hours. I am only now lurking around again and being very selectful of the posts I choose to read.

The gamers (ones whose only knowledge of firearms comes from video games), TEOTWAWKI folks, Cop bashers, Zombie threads, Knowitalls, "Operators", and trolls has run me off for weeks at a time.

Maybe I just needed a break.

Smoke
 
You have breathed MY Air too long to disrupt THR and TFL Standards

Years ago, I had significant tenure on a internet forum of similar layout but dealing with an entirely different subject. After nearly 10,000 posts, I realized I still didn't have any more say or sway than a member with, say, 10 posts. I grew frustrated and while I didn't resort to claiming the analagous "air" for myself, I can kind of understand where you are coming from. But then I realized that it's just the internet! Chill out my friend.

Integrity is one thing, but such discussions are not needed to preserve it IMO. BTW I ended up getting banned from the aforementioned forum because I questioned their integrity. Some people just can't handle carterbeauford I guess. If you don't like something, stop reading it.
 
Generalizations aren't the issue - bad behavior is.

Regardless of whether the bluster and BS and bad behavior is spawned from mythical experiences gained in CS or has it roots elsewhere, the message is the same - it doesn't belong on THR. Singling out CS as a root cause misses the point.

No its not the issue but when you say all CS people have bad Integrity- Ethics- Morals, and Principals and should leave, it makes it an issue. And hurts all the people who play CS, and DO have manners, Morals, Ethics, Principals.


I am sorry but i was taught Generalizing IS bad behavior. And to go around saying I am all Ethical and great, then to go group a whole bunch of people (like CS player) into a Generalization, and say how they are below me and not Ethical and not great. Kind of shows who has the bad manners


ps i dont take anything i have "learned" from CS and apply it to real life, I can keep fiction from non-fiction
 
Everyone who posted a response but has been here less than a year or two..

STOP

and

THINK

for just a second.... instead of posting.

Think of this as a learnable moment..

-z
 
While I won't be joing the 24 hour standdown, I wholeheartedly agree with the sentiment. Incivility seems to be a hallmark of the net. I guess that's what can be expected from a venue in which anyone can say anything, and often does.

It think the gain is worth the cost, but I understand the frustration. The L&P forums seem to be the center of it, but a little respect for reasoned, but differing, opinions goes a long way. On the net, and in real life. Sometimes, agreeing to disagree isn't wishy-washy or PC, it's just the polite thing to do.

We should all try to avoid typing things we wouldn't say.

--Shannon
 
And hurts all the people who play CS
So now we're hurt. Come on. Steve was talking about those who take their experiences from games and try to apply them to real life. If that doesn't apply to you, you can feel free to ignore it.
Think of this as a learnable moment..
Wise advice.

Now let me say this, FWIW. I have met Steve and spent some time with him, enough to call him a good friend. He learned his lessons in the School of Hard Knocks, and he is trying to pass those lessons along. He bears listening to, believe me.
 
Everyone who posted a response but has been here less than a year or two..

Oh, so now because you've been here longer than me, your opinion is more valuable?

You're not arrogant -- O RLY?

Come on. Steve was talking about those who take their experiences from games and try to apply them to real life. If that doesn't apply to you, you can feel free to ignore it.

If that's what Steve meant, than that's what he should have said. I can't be blamed for his lack of communication skills.

Generalizing a group of people because of a game they play is not fair.

I also don't like that he suggests I be excluded because I don't like the police and I enjoy discussing TEOTWAWKI. I could say that I don't like listening to him support the police, and that he should be banned for it, but I respect that he can hold an opinion I disagree with and still be allowed to post. Obviously, he doesn't show the same respect towards me.

I find the holier-than-thou attitude of his/your post(s) to be disgusting. From what I've seen, you are arrogant, bigotted, disrespectful, brainwashed, Republican old men. But that's a generalization I keep to myself. I don't go suggesting that you get banned for it.
 
Now let me say this, FWIW. I have met Steve and spent some time with him, enough to call him a good friend. He learned his lessons in the School of Hard Knocks, and he is trying to pass those lessons along. He bears listening to, believe me.

If he truly bore listening to, his posts would suggest that.

Telling me to "believe you" is useless since I don't know you and have no idea if you're worth believing.
 
Oh, so now because you've been here longer than me, your opinion is more valuable?
No - it implies only that we've taken the time to hang around and learn the rules of the site. Being here for a few months and ignoring the stated rules implies that you're either unwilling to learn by example, that you need more time to learn, or that you're willfully disrespectful of the site's owner. <shrug> You get to decide which of those shoes fit.

I also don't like that he suggests I be excluded because I don't like the police and I enjoy discussing TEOTWAWKI.
But why does it matter WHAT you like if the rules of the forum state 'no police bashing' and 'no TEOTWAWKI' role-playing? Why should your wants outweigh the stated rules of the owner of the site? Here's a clue - they don't.

find the holier-than-thou attitude of his/your post(s) to be disgusting. From what I've seen, you are arrogant, bigotted, disrespectful, brainwashed, Republican old men. But that's a generalization I keep to myself.
Uh, not any more. And likely deliberately so.

Telling me to "believe you" is useless since I don't know you and have no idea if you're worth believing.
I was raised to believe that (just as all men are innocent until proven guilty) all opinions are worth hearing until proven to be full of dookie. It must be quite a burden upon your young soul to have to pass judgment on so many given so little data and in such a short span of time.
 
Personaly i would like to thank Hellenistic Riot for the fine example of the "keyboard kommando" in question , the illistration is i am shure helpfull to many of us
 
I don't come around much any more.
I can deal with the jerks, but I prefer the folks who are interested in civil conversation.

Bad information and misinformation have discouraged my regular participation here. Don't get me wrong, there are many friendly and knowledgeable folks here. However, sometimes I feel like the voices of the "gotcha" experts and the ignorati drown out any meaningful discussion.

This is the natural result of THR's explosive growth. I do wish the mods were a little more liberal with their use of the "ban button", but that's their job, not mine.

JH
 
Personaly i would like to thank Hellenistic Riot for the fine example of the "keyboard kommando" in question , the illistration is i am shure helpfull to many of us

You're a fine example of a young man with the spelling/grammar skills of a 2nd grader.

No - it implies only that we've taken the time to hang around and learn the rules of the site. Being here for a few months and ignoring the stated rules implies that you're either unwilling to learn by example, that you need more time to learn, or that you're willfully disrespectful of the site's owner. <shrug> You get to decide which of those shoes fit.

Well, I've been here long enough to know the rules of the site, and I just looked at them again (http://www.thehighroad.org/code-of-conduct.html) and I don't seem to be in violation of any of them. But hey, if your cup of tea is making up rules (the ones you claim I'm in violation of in your post), then go ahead and make my day.

But why does it matter WHAT you like if the rules of the forum state 'no police bashing' and 'no TEOTWAWKI' role-playing? Why should your wants outweigh the stated rules of the owner of the site? Here's a clue - they don't.

Nowhere has it been clearly stated that police bashing and TEOTWAWKI are against the rules of the forum. I again redirect you to http://www.thehighroad.org/code-of-conduct.html .

Uh, not any more. And likely deliberately so.

I kept it to myself in that I didn't cite people who fit my generalization as people who should be banned. I'm sorry for using that example, I don't truly believe that's what your average forum-goer here is, but I could see why someone else would think so.

I was raised to believe that (just as all men are innocent until proven guilty) all opinions are worth hearing until proven to be full of dookie. It must be quite a burden upon your young soul to have to pass judgment on so many given so little data and in such a short span of time.

Anyone who takes what they hear on the internet completely seriously is headed for a big disappointment/loss. Generally I believe the people on this forum to be honest. But I'd be a fool to believe it all without further verification. I don't have any quick or easy way of verifying that what this guy has to say is worth hearing. Feel free to suggest one.
 
STOP.

I am policing my own thread.

Members of THR / TFL are known to police respectful forums.

~

Yes this should have been in Technical - I skirted ever so close General Discussion Rules of "Firearm" or "Civil Liberties" subject matter by referencing Rules of Conduct.
 
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it's almost 24 hours

I support your sentiment/point, sm.

but, um, may I have a few thread references? I'm trying to see what instigated this thread.
 
This thread is patently stupid. No offense to anyone in particular, but it's nothing more than a bunch of pots calling the kettles 'black'.

Some folks think they get to interpret the rules or the intent of certain forums and then chastise others for not living up to those standards, that's a bunch of crap.

THR has MODs, very good MODs, they're doing a fine job, let them police the boards, I could care less what a member has to say about it no matter how long they've been here or how many posts they have. When the MODs see an issue, they deal with it, that's the way it should be...thankfully, that's the way it is.
 
THR and TFL are Sister Sites.
Yes there are other Sister Sites, for sake of simplicity I will just use THR/ TFL.

We are Global Resources for Reponsible Firearm Ownership. We grew out of TFL as stated in my original post.

Here is MY deal. I was born in 1955 and raised a certain way. I was attracted to a certain way of living as well - I wanted what I call my Mentors & Elders lived.

These Mentors & Elders lived Responsible Firearm Ownership and Civil Liberties. This was evident in how they conducted their affairs and carried themselves. Including those matters where Firearms or Civil Liberties was the subject matter.

My role is to pass forward as passed to me. I have always done so and will continue to. When I finally learned computers and Internet - a new medium was afforded me to use.

I made mistakes. If we wanted to post all my shortcomings and skeletons in the closet I have made in my life, and on THR/TFL - Oleg and Rich do not have enough bandwith.

I am no big deal, never will be - I know that. Heck I share that folks all the time!

All I have are my experiences to share. All I have are my elephants I have faced. There are many members that have faced more and bigger elephants than I - my elephants were real, and I own them. Just as the others with more and bigger own them.

For those that know, bear with me as I share for that do not.

The stories I share - the reason?

I grew up reading Ruark, I couldn't wait to get ahold of a Field & Stream and read Ruark first. Then I got the book " The Old Man And The Boy".

That book shares a LOT in being a responsible firearm owner, hunting, dealing with people, civil liberties, ethics, respect, morals, values, life lessons, principals and so much more - than a grandkid and grandpa.

I can't write, my expression is in my heart and soul - by the time it gets to typed words - I admit it, I cannot express myself well. That is what I am attempting to do in them dumb stories.

Ruark's Book, THR and TFL are akin to that book to ME.

I have given so many of those books out over the years, cases of them. I have read that book to many young boys and girls, to parents, to adults and grandparents.

You may have gotten one in a raffle I donated. You may have bid on one I donated. You may again soon this month, and Mr, Ayoob has agreed to sign it if you attend Monkyleg's even in WI.

You see, I do not tell everything I know or do.

I gave that book once to a single mom and little girl going thru abuse. I was one of others assisting in getting this mom and little girl safe. I read to them both, and the mom read to the child.
The abusive male tore up that book and burned it. The mom and child cried, them got mad. I and others got mad,and I gave them another book once they were safe.

Like that copy of Ruark's book - just like THR/TFL are Resources akin to that book - I get a bit upset when THR/ TFL are torn and burned.

--
Here is how I was raised.

I am an invited guest in Oleg's and Rich's home and property. I abide by their rules. I wipe my feet, and use a coaster for my coffee on the coffee table.

Out on the property I leave the gates open / closed as instructed. I do not hunt where asked not to hunt, I catch release the bass from the pond and keep only the bream I will eat.

If a brick-bat is tossed and breaks a front window - I do not have to be told - I pitch in. I assist in putting up plywood, and take my turn at watch so others can get some shut-eye.

If for some reason I am asked to babysit the house and property - I do as instructed.

Now if the barn catches fire, I don't have to told to open the barn to let the horses free. I have to make a judgement call on something not covered, and let a gate be open that is otherwise supposed to be closed. Safety of the horses is paramount. I take repsonsibility for opening a closed gate.

Folks that invited then later abuse the invite are not welcome. Nor are they to invite other Rowdy friends to break house and property rules.

--
An ill wind had been blowing too long. I know another front is coming in to clear the air. Rich alluded to it earlier.

My sentiments are expressed by Rich in this quote:

http://www.thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=212814

Is there a part of that which needs further explanation?

I find it funny how people can take a Free Service and develop a sense of birthright that they should be allowed to use it on their own terms. Last I checked, this was a Private Board. Last I checked, I pay for this service and Staff puts in the voluntary effort to make it work. Seems to me we have a bit of a right to set the rules and revoke the invites.

Seems to me, the last time some Twinkie visited here for the first and last time, 24 hours before he attempted murder and committed suicide, the investigative heat came down on me and this Staff.

Seems to me, the last time a Twinkie decided he was gonna do something about our Rules, he reported an LEO Staff Member here to his department for "misuse of public equipment". That was lots of fun for the Staff Member involved.

So, please....don't feel it's all about you.
Rich

--

Post Counts: Personally I hate them.
In my real life I am quiet, observant, aware most times. I open up to those I choose to let into my circle. I have my reasons and comes from a type of work(s) I have done/ do.

I have done a lot behind the monitor , always have, be it landline, PM or Email. On-line posts - I opened up more , reasons vary.

My Mentors & Elders spoke of dimensions, I better understand what these are. The reality hit hard not long ago - I am the only one left alive of an original bunch of folks that did something.
Now I am the only one to pass forward to some kinfolks and friends what we did. Always been one to not shoot, instead pull targets, assist a new shooter, give instruction, cook on the grill...this bit my Mentors & Elders could not put into words or share how to handle so to speak. I just have to stumble thru best can.

Personal Emails are going to some folks in the near future. In the meantime I just took upon myself another project or three. Got some personal matters to attend to as well.

While I have at Galt's Gulch, carried a Cancer friend of mine into the house, gave shotgun lessons to a lady, Shot Red Ryder BB guns with a kid, got two folks assisting with shotguns on-line.

Oh that kid, had some money he was saving for something, instead he did a RKBA donation with some of it - bought his grandpa Ruark's book.

What one does - how raised.


Steve
 
Can’t we all just get along?
Rodney King

You're a fine example of a young man with the spelling/grammar skills of a 2nd grader

Forgive those that did not learn their ABC’s or their 123’s in school. Forgive those that were not fortunate enough to go to collage and get educated. Every body has certainer skills just some are different then others. have some compassion for those less fortunate.

I’ve always said the THR has a lot of good knowledgeable people here. BUT THIS TAKES THE CAKE, come-on, why would you judge someone because they play “video games” or because they don’t “spell” up to your standards. I thought this was a gun forum.

People sitting on the fence
This should be a good thing I would think. This gives THR the opportunity to educate the fence sitter and help them crossover. But posts like this just encourage the anti’s to continue. They see stuff like this and think they succeeded in stirring up turmoil. Isn't that their purpose. Quit being so gullible.

Thanks to the MOD’s I think you all do a great job.
 
I have noticed, in my short time being a member, that THR has indeed taken on a bit of tarnish.

While THR is nowhere near becoming another "GlockTalk", the amount of nastiness has certainly seemed to increase during the last couple of years.

That being said, THR is still the gun-forum to go to - I've learned much while exploring the site, and I believe that the Mods are doing an excellent job!
 
Introspective

Since this thread seems to have opened up to posts despite the original request, I’ll have my say if ya’ll don’t mind. :)

I remember coming to THR a couple months after it opened, and being amazed at the level of civil discourse, intellectual honesty, and love of liberty. As I’ve spent the last several years here, I’ve tried to hold the bar as high as it was originally set. But I’m sure I’ve let it slip. As the blood boils over topics of contention, sometimes we let the bar slide down a bit. Still others here never seemed to notice where that bar was in the first place, and don’t care where it ends up.

Well, I can’t do anything about the other members here. I can’t stop somebody from callin’ the poster next to him a nasty name, or behaving in another asinine manner. I can, however, police myself. So instead of stepping away from THR for 24 hours, I think tomorrow, instead of surfing and posting, I’ll take a look back through my own posts. I’ll see where I faltered, where I could have risen to a higher standard. We often best learn from our own mistakes, and I aim to do so.

I may not be able to fix the problem, but I can work to make sure I’m not part of it, and help set the example.
 
Thanks SM.
Thoughts and points well taken.
Glad to have THR available. Thankful to be able to participate and learn.
 
While I think that THR may have strayed just a tiny bit. I still believe that it is one of the best forums out on the internet!:D
There is a wealth of valid gun information on here. And some VERY good people.
Please don't let a few folks with their own agendas ruin it for everyone else.
Hopefully we are all here because of an affection for firearms and I also hope that everyone can at least agree on that and maybe get going back in the right direction, which should be trying to ensure that we promote responsible gun ownership without personal attacks on each other.
 
I find this to be an odd little section of the forum universe. I have lurked here many a time and have only posted VERY selectively recently. I have to say that it does seem that there is more sniping and trolls here than some other nameless boards which I am a member of. Never the less I feel there is some useful info shared on this board and that is why I stick around.
 
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