key flail.

[Owen Sparks]

The other day I had to borrow a buddies keys to unlock something. He had a big heavy wad of keys on the end of an 18" looped nylon strap that was about an inch wide and printed with the logo and colors of his favorite college football team. It looked a lot like a short dog leash. I see these all the time but never really thought about using them as a weapon until I swung this one a bit. I am not even sure what they are called but since I started noticing, I see all sorts of folks with these key straps hanging out of their pockets and the guy behind me in line at the bank had one around his neck with at least half a pound of keys. This is something you could carry anywhere and would be very effective with enough keys. It deserves further investigation.

P.S. What are they called anyway?

 

[rcmodel]

I don't know the name for them.
I call them Auto Ignition-Switch Wearer-Outers.

My son had two pounds of crap on his key chain for years, and I put more ignition switches in his cars over the years then I could count.

BTW: I have been seeing a lot of the younger KU crowd wearing those long straps with keys lately.
Probably because they don't have any real pants with pockets.
I think it is more a fashon statement to go with the parachute pants or gym shorts everyone wears.

My wife mentioned it might make a good weapon.
I personally think a determined aggressor would probably take it away from me the first swing and choke me down with it!

rc

 

[Carl Levitian]

Ditto what rc said.

My buddy Dan is a mechanic with his own shop, and he's always replacing ignition switches for those folks with big keyring. My own sister in law didn't take his advise, and while driving down the road with the big pound of keys dangling from the ignition, the ignition key sheared off, leaving the key in the slot and the car running. That was a hassle to shut off sand get broken key out of switch.

Then there's the idea of going into a fight swinging my keys to the house, car, and whatever else. Somehow I think that's a real bad idea. Plus I have to question how much real damage some keys on a flexible strap are gonna do. Too easy to black and grab. Then you're fighting over the keys to your house, your car...

 

[Owen Sparks]

Suppose you went to the local locksmith and bought a big hand full of orphan keys and made one of these things specifically to be carried as a weapon? No one would know the difference. It would extend your reach 18" or so and could be very effectice with a little practice.

Again, the point is that you could carry a key flail anywhere that you could not have something better like on an airplane or in the court house. I had to go buy a car tag the other day and a uniformed deputy made me leave my knife at the desk but he let me keep my keys.

 

[rcmodel]

Yes, but straps became known as "Suicide Straps" in the 1930's when cops went about with a leather strap over one shoulder attached to the uniform gun belt on the off side.
Like an old time Mountie!

The thing is, a nylon strap strong enough to be used as a flail is also strong enough to block the swing and take control of the person trying to hang unto it (you) in a fight for your life.

If you have it around your neck during normal everyday carry to support the key load, it is a self-administered handing rope/garrote if the wrong person gets hold of it and you can't get loose.
Then if you do manage to get loose, the other person has your weapon of last resort and will use it on you.

Go ahead and do what you want.
But I'll pass on straps for sure!!

If you want to get into the court house with a fairly effective weapon?
Buy a strong cane and limp when you walk in.
It is against the Federal ADA for them to take it away from you.

rc

 

[AStone]

Owen, I still like the feel of a solid hardwood stick better than a bunch of keys.

 

[Owen Sparks]

rcmodel,

You do not understand. The strap should be in your hand when you swing it at a bad guy, not around your neck. Of course a solid hardwood stick would be better but unless it is long enough to be concidered a 'walking stick' you cannot always have irt with you.
You can carry keys anywhere.

 

[Bikewer]

There's a Japanese martial-arts weapon called a "manriki". Essentially, two weights on the ends of a short chain.
Sometimes called the "ten-thousand powerful chain".

It can be used as flexible impact weapon, as a device to trap, block, or strangle, or the weights themselves can be held like a yawara stick to deliver augmented blows.

Some years ago, Black Belt did an article on a modern variation, the "manriki-key". Essentially, a bunch of old keys on either end of a doggie choke-chain.

Used in the manner of the classic weapon, potentially very effective. Downside..Lots of training required, or it's as dangerous to the user as o the opponent.

 

[AStone]

Owen, as I've said several times before,
I live just west of the Bay of Fundy.

Really, things are different here.
Sticks are not demonized like elsewhere.

I think it has to do with the fact that
Stephen King lives here.

 

[CSC_Saint]

Owen, I think your on the right track. Always have a mindset that can recognize things in your environment that you can use in a pinch. When it comes to your life or theirs, it's all or nothin, and a heavy set of keys may just be what saves your bacon. Argue it one way or the other, we should always look for whatever we can use.

 

[hso]

The mass is too distributed and the impact value is reduced. I consider these to be defensive urban myth.

 

[T Bran]

I wonder if anyone would notice if you brazed all of the keys together with the exception of a couple on each side of the main wad. Otherwise I dont think it would be a good one shot stop type weapon.
I carry a couple pounds of keys daily but they are linked in groups of three or four. I just delink the set I need at the moment. I too have seen my share of destroyed ign switches due to giant wads of keys and other junk hanging from them.

 

[Onward Allusion]

Back in the day, I had a lock attached to one end of my key chain (an actual chain...) and keys on the other end. Nothing like a rectangular lock with semi sharp edges to rip someone's head open.

Keys by themselves - even a nice wad of them, are too loose to be really effective.

 

[MyGreenGuns]

I consider these to be defensive urban myth.

As a flail, I totally agree.

But I did scare off a guy by putting my keys between my fingers like claws and making a fist. He decided that whatever we were arguing about wasn't worth being disfigured.

This tip was told to me by a female friend who was taking a self defense class.

EDIT: I dont carry enough keys to make a flail useful.

 

[JShirley]

I actually have spent many hours of practice with a weighted chain. It was a requirement for the belt test I was preparing to take, around the time my first wife and I split. I spent quite a few hours in the woods in the woods around Duluth, GA, attacking dead trees.

As mentioned, flexibles like this take a lot of practice to use well.

Instead of all the weight on one end, the method I've used is a large carabiner on one end, with my keys on the other. This means you have a heavy weight to impact with, but it doesn't pull on your ignition. My flexible "chain" has been woven paracord, so you get strength without a lot of weight. I've also taken it through many areas that wouldn't allow chain of any type, such as some nightclubs and through multiple airports.

I think I've posted pictures before, but I used about 20" of braided paracord. This arrangement also is very useful in daily life, as the carabiner can be clipped onto a belt loop, or elsewhere. Since I always carry a keychain light, as well, the carabiner and light can be arranged to project light on a project you're working on in dark areas, too.

John

 

[hso]

I've carried a steel carabiner with keys on the other end as well back in my more active days. That is a competent mass that will make an impression on someone.

Brazing keys together crosses the line into manufacturing a weapon instead of using what is naturally at hand. It degrades some of the point of having something useful with you all the time that can double as a defensive tool.

We go far too far from the point when we start manufacturing weapons that appear at first glance to be a normal item to carry instead of looking at what we normally carry as useful for self defense.

 

[seeker_two]

Unless you're attaching something like a monkey fist or a padlock to your keychain, the flail idea is not very effective....

I have one of those push-apart key rings for my car keys & other keys. I detach my ignition key from the rest when I use it. Saves the switch wear & tear. I also use one to connect my pocket flashlight to my Leatherman Squirt. Detach to use either.

http://www.homedepot.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay?storeId=10051&langId=-1&catalogId=10053&productId=100157443&R=100157443

 

[Bikewer]

Note as well... Many state laws still carry as prohibited such things as "slung shots". A slung shot is an old sailor's weapon, a "shot" (a round of grapeshot) tied inside a monkey's fist and used as a cosh.
Although essentially unknown nowadays (save to old fossils like me) the definition covers all sorts of equivalent weapons like the biker-favorite padlock-on-the-end-of-a-kerchief or weighted sock...
Most of us old coppers are familiar with all variations.

 

[sm]

Nem wrote:

Owen, I still like the feel of a solid hardwood stick better than a bunch of keys.

Agreed.

John has training. I respect John, his training and take on things.
Like hso, I too found a lanyard full of keys to have mass not distributed well nor the impact of great value.

Yeah, I played with this and in private lessons I was the "victim" and a mentor the "aggressor".

I was using a drug store, inexpensive, aluminum cane. WE were doing some testing for some folks we assisted.

I bested the mentor. He "flailed" once but I had distance, still I stopped the "flail" with the cane. The keys
lanyard actually wrapped around the cane, still I went in, putting my foot onto his and going in, as fast and hard as I could ( and he was a tad bigger and heavier). Losing his balance and me still exerting force while he was going, going down, I "could have" really put the hurt on him going up hard with the top of the cane up under his chin.

When he was down, I went for a concealed handgun ( again something to do, trying to figure out how to assist some folks with concerns).

I do not have the training hso or John has, I have told both I would be humbled and honored to spend time with them, to learn from them.

Steve, whom has a $12 hickory cattle cane.

 

[AStone]

Interesting stuff, Steve.

 

[Deltaboy1984]

Mass says they are great for Jailers in his book on Impact Weapons.

http://www.amazon.com/Fundamentals-Modern-Police-Impact-Weapons/dp/0936279028

I got my copy about 2 years ago and it is full of good ideas.

 

[leadcounsel]

hokey and ineffective. and i'm not willing to carry 3 lbs of jingling keys around on the off chance that they may be marginally useful as a flail...

that's like the old lady beating a man with a purse or a frying pan...great for comical relief, not effective in reality.

thinking of a person not consistently being stopped by a 9x19 or even a .45 slug, even a solid hit with a couple pounds of keys would likely do nothing to a serious aggressor...

 

[AStone]

that's like the old lady beating a man with a purse or a frying pan...
great for comical relief, not effective in reality.

<Stand up comedian>

A 20-something guy was driving his custom Italian sports car into the mall,
looking for a place to park it. He saw one, and sped to it,
then waited for the car pulling out to exit.

On the other side of the space, and older woman in an '88 Cadillac waited.

The car holding the space pulled out in her direction.

The kid gunned it, taking the space. No contest.

He exited said customized Italian sports car -
for which his father paid 5 figures,
and walked toward the mall.

As he walked past the Caddie,
he said to the older woman,
smirking, "I'm younger and fast."

He heard a crash.
He turned around to see
his Italian car crushed by a Caddie.

The older woman walked past him
and said, "I'm older and very rich."

 

[AStone]

PS: The Cadillac was a stick shift.

{sound track}

 

[JShirley]

hokey and ineffective. and i'm not willing to carry 3 lbs of jingling keys around on the off chance that they may be marginally useful as a flail...

As I very carefully explained, what is effective, is a heavy weight at the end opposite the keys. And the concept of a "flail" is pathetic. A high-velocity piece of steel to a temple, on the other hand, is rather not "hokey and ineffective".