Kids, guns and anti parents

[Girlwithagun]

I was at a playgroup today with my kids (ages 21 months and 3)
and they found some toy guns there that of course they picked
up and were playing with. The mother that lived there asked me
if the boys were allowed to play with them and commented that
they seemed to know what to do. I replied that they are allowed
and that they have been instructed of proper gun safety (as much
as they can be for their age) and know not to point even a toy
gun at a person. She said she feels the same way as me but always
asks the parent to make sure.

This got me thinking...How have any of you dealt with these issues?
Should I make a point to put my kids toy guns away out of respect
for those who feel differently? And what about guns in my home?
Do you think I should bring it up only if asked or do I owe it to
the parents to tell them we have guns here? I know and feel confident
in the fact that I am doing everything right for my children but does
the gun issue fall under the category of us all doing what we think
is best for our own children and me just having to respect their
difference of opinion? Please help if you've been through this or
have any suggestions.

 

[Alan Fud]

I wouldn't say anything to other parents about there being guns in the house but I would also make sure that the guns are either your direct control or under lock & key out of reach of little hands. Just because your children have been properly trained to respect firearms, you can't assume that other children have had the same instruction.

 

[Car Knocker]

Let me address your last question first: More children die from drowning than through firearms accidents (read about such an accident in this morning's paper). Do we warn other parents that we have a bathtub or buckets? That we have a wading pool in the back yard? That our toilet seats aren't locked down? Do we ask other parents those same questions?

More children die or are injured through the ingestion of household chemicals than are killed or injured in firearms accidents. Do we warn other parents that we have household chemicals in the house or garage? Do we ask other parents the same question?

These topics usually aren't discussed because we form opinions of the trustworthyness and responsibility of other parents before we allow our children to go into their houses to play with their children. (As an aside, I would bet that most parents are more careful about the security of their guns than they are about chemicals or buckets.) Why shouldn't that trustworthyness extend to include guns? Either you're comfortable with the parents or you're not. If you're not, then your kids shouldn't be playing in their home without your direct supervision.

It's none of their business what you have in your home and neither is it any of your business what they have in theirs.

You ask whether you should put up your kids toy guns out of respect for those parents who feel differently? Well, what about their respect for your beliefs? Don't your practices and beliefs deserve just as much respect? I think this is one of those cases where I would allow play with toy guns in my home and respect differing beliefs when my children are in their homes. If either you or they cannot accept that, then your kids probably shouldn't be playing together. Another though is that by playing with toy guns at your home with proper supervision and instruction, other children will learn proper gun safety and this may well reduce their chances of injury or death in some future incident.

By the way, I'm a retired grandparent and take care of my 1-1/2 y.o. granddaughter 4 days a week.

 

[Leatherneck]

Depends on whether you're an impassioned and ardent supporter, or whether you're just a common-sense Mom that wants her kids to understand basic rights and responsibilities. In Maryland, you can encounter every stripe of person on the gun issues. You just have to kind of feel your way into conversations and react to what you hear. It never hurts for an anti to hear a low-key but firm statement regarding gun rights.

Well...maybe if you're in that part of Maryland it does...

TC
TFL Survivor

 

[Doug444]

After reading this, now I've got to ask for some advice. First off, a little background:

I'm an NRA Certified instructor (Rifle/Shotgun/Muzleloader) and Hunter Education Instructor. Been around guns (real and toys) all my life. Raised my step-son from 5-yrs. old to college with no gun issues. Did the usual "satisfy curiosity under supervision", then BB gun undersupervision, then HE and Boy Scouts (I was the instructor AND Scoutmaster, and probably was tougher on him than anyone else). Mever so much as a stray muzzle. Only visible guns in the house are muzzleloaders on the wall and toys (capguns, water pistols, etc.).

Now, here's my dilema: I now have two god-children ages 1 and 3. The boy's 3, and now has a (what I call) normal interest in weopons. He's got the typical toy swords and ray guns (loves Buzz Lightyear ), and uses the term weopons quite often, according to his parents. The mom's borderline anti, especially when it comes to kids, except she allow's that I'm OK . Dad's generally pro, though doesn't now own any firearms, as mom says "not in my house". He's currently more interested in his career than hunting/fishing, except that he know's he'll need to get back into it sometime with the boy. I've been asked to help them teach the boy the dos and don'ts, which I think is a very good thing, but 2 things kind of complicate the situation:

1) His sister, the 1-year-old, want's to do everything big brother does.
2) I really don't have much experience teaching kids under 5, period.

I've started the process by answering his questions about the muzzleloaders on the wall , and allowed him to play with some of the toy guns while admonishing him NOT to point them at people. To be honest, it's only been one session and it went OK for the 5 minutes he stayed with the toy gun. Then, on to other things (typical). The little sister situation will be pretty easy to handle for now by simply not allowing the boy to play with the toy guns while she's around. Hopefully, by the time she's really an issue I'll have a plan for "tiny tikes" from working with her brother.

To that end, any and all suggestions for how to approch the eductation of 3-year-olds in firearms safety (Beyond Eddie Eagle - we'll be watching that video next time he comes over ) would be greatly appreciated.

 

[Leatherneck]

IMO, three and certainly one are still in the stage of "because I say so." Real education about guns or any other such "grownup" subject is still down the road a bit. So I'd try to instill in them (especially the 3YO) a couple of rules: don't touch, tell a grownup kind of stuff. But nothing yet on tactics, techniques or procedures

TC
TFL Survivor

 

[Chipperman]

I have twin boys, 2 1/2 years old. They have the usual interest in and knowledge about guns, by seeing movies, cartoons, etc. They will often pick up a random object and point it like a gun. So far I have not been too stringent on the rule of not pointing them at anyone else. It's hard enough just to keep them from punching/kicking/biting each other.

They have seen handguns on my belt, but I'm not sure they know it's a gun because I NEVER take it out of the holster in front of them. IMO, they are not ready to see that Daddy carries. The tough part for me is deciding when they are to know that I carry a Real gun, and what that means. I think it's going to be at least another year before I will try to talk to them about it.

 

[ChiefPilot]

My wife informed me a couple of months ago that one of the other parents in her Mom's group doesn't want her children around guns at all. That includes visiting homes where guns (locked up or not) are present. The people in question don't even allow squirt guns; their boy has a "squirt dolphin" . Anyway, she asked me what I would say in her position, and I could only think of three options :

1) (My preferred option) Say that there are guns in the house, and let the chips fall where they may. Even though I disagree with their logic, I do respect the active role they take in protecting their kids. While I would like them to visit our house, I am not going to sell my weapons to facilitate that.

2) Tell them that it's none of their business. This might be how I feel, but it's rude and doesn't really answer the question.

3) Divert the question by asking "Why do you ask?" and then steering the conversation elsewhere. This is basically a kinder, more gentle version of #2.

 

[ReadyontheRight]

ChiefPilot -- I'm in Minnesota as well. Deep in the heart of the Liberal Lakes district (SW Minneapolis - By Lake Harriet). Nice to see another new Gopher-Stater here on THR. Welcome! Hope you're staying warm and your cars are starting. (-20 degrees here last night --- and that's the 'real' temperature. -47 up North).

My children have toy 6-shooters, Buzz Lightyear dart guns, swords, etc. They've also been out shooting BB guns and 22s and have hunted with Dad and Grandpa in the woods. They know weapon rules -- don't touch, tell an adult if you find a gun, don't hit people with toy swords, etc. Of course many of the neighbor kids have no toy guns or swords in their houses. When they come over, some (almost all of the boys) immediately gravitate toward the toy guns and swords.

Neighbors know I hunt, so the subject of guns in the house sometimes comes up. The answer from my wife and I is that we have a gun safe -- no big deal. We've probably got a few kids not coming back over when the fact that we have !GASP! !GUNS! in the house comes up, but I guess both my wife and I figure "good riddance". Most folks just act a little bemused and usually somewhat interested.

I see no need to tell half-truths or change the subject. I feel that I can move understanding of RKBA forward by being straighforward and truthful about gun ownership.

Knowing kids -- and how me and my friends acted as kids -- every gun in my house is either trigger-locked, in the safe, incapacitated with the bolt in the safe or locked in a quick-access safe.

I can train my own children. But when a Mom or Dad comes over with their kid and he or she can only smile, say "stop Honey" and laugh when her kid (who's never benn allowed to own toy sword) wacks another kids with my son's plastic sword, I know I can't ever trust other people's kids at all.

Unless the subject comes up naturally, I don't think it makes any sense to bring up gun ownership at all.

 

[ChiefPilot]

I see no need to tell half-truths or change the subject. I feel that I can move understanding of RKBA forward by being straighforward and truthful about gun ownership.

I agree, but unfortunately my wife is ambivalent on the issue. It is kind of fun to wear my Bushmaster and Springfield Armory shirts around this particular couple, though.

Concerned Parent: "Does your shirt say Bushmaster?"
Me: "Yes, it does."
Concerned Parent: "Isn't that the kind of gun used by the sniper last year?"
Me: "Yes, it was, unfortunately."
Concerned Parent: "Doesn't that bother you?"
Me: "Well, I still like Boeing T-Shirts, and they've been used to kill several thousand people more than my Bushmaster has."

Nice to see another new Gopher-Stater here on THR.

I was surprised how many there are - but then again, when it's this cold out, there's not really much for us all to do besides sit in front of the computer and try to stay warm .

-Brad

 

[artherd]

Age 3 is early enough to get an exposure, but not early enough for any kind of reliance on their behavior.

Keep it simple like you have, NEVER point it at people, but otherwise have a good time with it. That's one rule. (and if they follow it, it is really the only rule they will ever need.)

As they grow, expand on that basis.



I would not volenteer info to parents. Do you say "Oh, but I have a car. It could start itself up and go on a rampage, still ok for Billy to come over and play?"

If they find out, or ask and seem open, invite them in and SHOW them how you secure your weapons, explain your no-tolerance for any deviation from "In my hand or in my safe"

 

[einstein]

kids and guns

Interesting thread for me as this came up a few days ago.

My daughter is 20 months old. My wife is working now. I'm not. I take my daughter to a weekly Mom's club - 2 hours in the morning at someone's house, rotate houses each week.

I'm in Los Angeles.

There's about half a dozen Moms with kids. I've come to like some of them and feel comfortable with them all.

I was picking up a new gun from my FFL. I was complaining about the hassle and paperwork involved - not being pissy to the FFL, just ranting in a conversational way.

During my rant it struck me how successful the anti-gun movement is at creating a sense of embarassment about being a gun owner.

I was talking about this Mom's club thing and, being an NRA certified safety and pistol instructor and an HSC instructor (Handgun Safety Certificate. CA law says that a certified HSC instructor has to give a test to a potential gun buyer which must be passed in order to buy a gun) I thought of how likely it was that two or three of the families in the Mom's club probably have a gun in the house (just hypothesizing) and they might be interested in knowing (if they don't already) how to safely store their gun.

But I'm embarrassed and/or afraid of the repercussions to my wife and daughter.

The FFL (who is my daughter's honorary Grandfather/Godfather said, (and I paraphrase) "Just think how bad you'd feel if there was a gun accident that could have been prevented if you had said something".

Haven't done anything yet.

Seems relevant to this thread.

einstein

 

[Girlwithagun]

Thank you all for your help! Hopefully if the subject comes up, I'll be able to handle it the way I should.

P.S. My 3 year old helped shoot the .22 for the first time this weekend! Daddy and Mommy were both proud.