Legal Carrying WITHOUT a license, is it feasible?

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Sean Dempsey

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I am going on a 3 day trip with my wife to a ski resort, but I have not received my CFP in the mail yet, its due any day. I haven't been carrying any weapons illegally, in utah, the law says that a weapon in a vehicle must be unloaded, locked up somehow, and seperate from ammunition. And on your person, it must be locked and unloaded.

I don't travel much, so this hasn't been a concern. but now, I am sitting here looking at my RSC full of handguns, and wondering if I should bother taking one or not.

I can pack it illegal, legal, or not at all. If I take one legal, it'll be in a handgun case with a cable lock through the barrel, and magazines in the glovebox. Or, I can pack it illegal, and have it loaded and in a discrete area.

Or I could not carry it at all. I've survived 25 years without carrying a gun, I don't think this weekend will be any different.

What would you do?
 
And on your person, it must be locked and unloaded.
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I believe open carry is legal without a CFP if, in an auto, the chamber is empty, and in a revolver if the chamber under the hammer and the next chamber up is empty.
 
thats what my dad used to say about revolvers, he has always carried a big one in his truck, legal or not... pre 94 when utah got a CFP.

he said that it had to go "click click boom" meaning, the third trigger pull gives you a live round.

that is NOT the case in a car though, anymore.

Car/Gun law summary

Date updated: Jul 31, 2005 @ 2:59 pm

Only a peace officer in the performance of his duty or a person with a valid permit to carry may carry a loaded firearm in a vehicle.

It is lawful to carry a firearm in a vehicle without a permit if: the firearm is unloaded; securely encased (not including a glove box or console box) and is not readily accessible for immediate use.

Federal Law on the Transportation of Firearms. Title 18 U.S.C. Section 926A
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I can't find anywhere that talks about on-person carry.
 
You may have an unloaded weapon in your vehicle. In Utah "Unloaded" means two mechanical actions away from firing.

So if you have a semi-auto, with a loaded magazine in it, but an empty chamber, you are fine.

Do not carry the gun in your glove box. The way the law is written you should not keep a gun in there.

You do not need to keep the gun locked, or stored seperately from the ammunition.

You may openly carry a firearm without a permit. However same rules apply. If you are on a public street you should be two mechanical actions away from firing.

This does not apply once you receive your permit, as the gun can now be fully loaded and on your person. Do not put it in your glove box, permit or not.

These are all things that your CCW instructor should have explained to you.
 
You may openly carry a firearm without a permit. However same rules apply. If you are on a public street you should be two mechanical actions away from firing.
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So how about carrying a single action revolver...? (cock, squeeze, boom!)


I guess we didn't know anything about such laws many years ago while crossing Utah in a pickup & camper. And there was one really scary incident at a roadside rest stop in SE Utah ... :uhoh:
 
So how about carrying a single action revolver...? (cock, squeeze, boom!)
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76-10-502. When weapon deemed loaded.
(1) For the purpose of this chapter, any pistol, revolver, shotgun, rifle, or other weapon described in this part shall be deemed to be loaded when there is an unexpended cartridge, shell, or projectile in the firing position.
(2) Pistols and revolvers shall also be deemed to be loaded when an unexpended cartridge, shell, or projectile is in a position whereby the manual operation of any mechanism once would cause the unexpended cartridge, shell, or projectile to be fired.
(3) A muzzle loading firearm shall be deemed to be loaded when it is capped or primed and has a powder charge and ball or shot in the barrel or cylinders.
 
I really don't know. Logic and politics are often strangers to each other. When you think about it, the revolver provision makes even less sense than the autoloader restriction.
 
In my state, if you get caught carrying without a license, you never get to ccw again.....Not worth it...
 
Open carry. Just not loaded in your car. It's totally legal., but make sure to check out this site to get some more info on the rules before you do: http://opencarry.mywowbb.com/

It takes a little getting used to, but open carry is actually really comfortable, and completely legal without a license (in 43 states, some places require a CCW, check your local laws). Let's not get into a debate about the tactics of OCW vs CCW, I'm just giving a suggestion of how to legally carry without a permit.

In my state, if you get caught Concealed carrying without a license, you never get to ccw again.....Not worth it...
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fixed it for you.
 
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If the hammer is down on empty #1, doesn't pulling the trigger rotate the cylinder such that the hammer will fall on empty #2 (click)? Doesn't the next trigger pull drop the hammer on a live round (boom)?
 
Just confirming that what I asked about was correct and that two empties would result in "click, boom", not "click, click, boom" as was said earlier.
 
(1) For the purpose of this chapter, any pistol, revolver, shotgun, rifle, or other weapon described in this part shall be deemed to be loaded when there is an unexpended cartridge, shell, or projectile in the firing position.
(2) Pistols and revolvers shall also be deemed to be loaded when an unexpended cartridge, shell, or projectile is in a position whereby the manual operation of any mechanism once would cause the unexpended cartridge, shell, or projectile to be fired.
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Well, the cartridge under the hammer in a revolver really isn't in the "firing position" (well, unless it is an "old style" action loaded with six rounds and you drop it on the hammer :p )

No matter how it is loaded, a single action revolver requires at least two operations in order for it to be fired.

Just goes to show that lawmakers are idiots :rolleyes:
 
Correia is not only correct, the police who stopped me on occasion before I had my permit asked me if I had anything in the car they should know about, I told them I had a pistol in the door pocket of the driver's side. They took it, checked it to see if there was a round chambered, and gave it back. The police seem to agree as well.

As far as "click, click, bang," goes, no. It does not mean you have to have TWO chambers in the cylinder empty.

By the way, I asked a guy in my guard unit today who is UHP, because I wasn't sure, when you get pulled over, they do not know if you are a permit holder from running your plate. They DO know when they run your driver's license. It is NOT in your interests to hold back from them if you are a permit holder and you are carrying.
 
El T, I know many of the lawmakers. The amount of information that they know about guns can be held in a thimble.

Sadly that puts us about 110% ahead of most other states. :p

There's no logic in this statute.
 
One of the real cool things about Colorado is that CCW in your car without a license is legal here (YMMV in Denver).

:D
 
If hunting and fishing, it may be okay to CCW w/o permit

One of the real cool things about Colorado is that CCW in your car without a license is legal here
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That's nice to know, I ran all over CO in the spring on a snowboarding trip. I was nervous about it, but there was still a 10mm and 45ACP within arms length at all times. A couple of Colorado milk jugs weren't to happy about it.

In my Oregon CCW course, the instructor stated that if you going to or from hunting or fishing, you can legally concealed carry. And of course you could carry while conducting said hunting or fishing. However, you cannot legally enter ANY public building this way. So no going into 7-11 while packing, you are then in violation of the law w/o CCW permit in Oregon this way. The instructor gave another odd scenario or two, and then stated, just get your permit, it's much easier and signals to an officer on a traffic stop that your "one of the good guys" when you offer your permit with your license. Your not required to provide the permit to the officer, but it was suggested to be done to reduce the hackles status of the officer pulling you over. Particularly at night when they have more time to drudge up the details about you in the computer system, which has your CCW status if applicable.

jeepmor
 
It would appear from several responses that the responders are assuming the ski resort will be in Utah. I realize that Utah has some excellent ski resorts and this is a likely assumption, but it is nonetheless an assumption. Mr. Dempsey, could you confirm whether or not your trip will keep you within Utah? If not, all bets are off and new criteria will apply.

Personally, the legal consequences are too draconian for me to risk being caught carrying illegally. YMMV.
 
Tallpine,

This is open carry for those who don't possess a CFP. CFP holders aren't hampered by these illogical restrictions and may carry firearms as they were designed to be carried.
 
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