Loading the 55 gr Z-max (green tipped V-max)

Status
Not open for further replies.
SSN Vet

SSN Vet

Member
Joined
Jan 3, 2006
Messages
6,510
Location
The Dark Side of the Moon
New to me bullet... picked up 500 at Midway some time ago when .223 components were scarce... and I'm just loading them up now.

I'm long term baby sitting my brothers re-loading gear, so I thought I'd set up his 550 B and sip the blue Kool-Aid for a while. He has the Dillon .223 die set (which has a standard taper crimp) and I have the Lee .223 FL die set (which uses a collet crimp)


I've always loaded BT bullets and never really belled the cases in the past, but these have a flat base, so I'm going to have to adjust the Dillon powder drop to flare the neck a little.

Also, the Z-max has a cannelure... so my question is this....

Should I taper crimp with the Dillon die or collet crimp with the Lee die.... and more importantly, why?

(If it makes any difference, this will be shot in an AR platform rifle)
 
I have no experience with Dillon equipment. With that said, instead of belling the cases, and having to crimp them, I would lightly chamfer the inside edge instead. That's all that is needed to seat a flat base bullet.

As to crimp, I wouldn't. I have tried it both ways, and no crimp is always more accurate for me.
 
I agree, I load a lot of flat base .223 bullets and a little chamfer on the case is all you need to help the bullets to start into the neck. The only downside is I have to guide the bullet/case up until it starts entering the die (loading on a SS with RCBS dies). I load to magazine length and do not crimp either, if neck tension is good and the rifle feeds smoothly I feel it isn't needed. Thousands of uncrimped rounds fired without an issue to date. But if it makes you feel better to crimp, I'd probably use the Dillon die because I think that crimp profile fits the cannelure better than the Lee FCD collet.
 
I loaded a bunch of those and did not do any belling at all. I seated them to the cannelure and called it good. You do need to lightly chamfer the case mouth, especially if you trimmed the cases.
 
223 Remington

Never heard of belling a 223 case. This is a job for the expander when FL sizing. The case mouth gets a Chamfer. No crimp needed if the bullet expands the neck .002" or more on seating.
 
I never heard of a bottleneck rifle die set that had the capability to bell a case.

Just chamfer the case mouths and seat them.

That's the way it's supposed to work with most all brands of rifle dies ever made.

Rc
 
Up to this point, I've only loaded .223 on my LCT and their the Lee rifle charging die does not have an expanding insert like the pistol expander/charging dies have. When loading flat base bullets in the past, I just placed the bullet on top and guide it in with my fingers..... but I'm concerned that I won't be able to guide the bullet while loading progressively on the 550B.

My policy to date has been that if the bullet has a cannelure, I crimp, and if it doesn't I don't. and the collet crimp on the .223 LFCD has worked just fine.

The Dillon powder drop die has a universal body and a cartridge specific drop tube that comes with the cartridge conversion kit. The drop tube has a funnel profile on the top and the bottom appears to sit on top of the neck and apply a slight bell.

I'm hoping that somebody who loads .223 on a progressive Dillon press will chime in.

I segregated my brass, and trimmed 100% of the batch when there were any that gaged long... I have batches of brass that all gage good, however, and I don't want to go through and chamfer them, just to get the bullet to stay in place if avoidable.
 
Forget the cannelure and the crimp. Just load for the bullet weight.
There is no belling involved with bottle necked cases. That's what the chamfer is for.
 
OK... call me stupid.... but I've loaded 223, 7.62x39 and .30-30 for many years and the only time I've ever chamfered was after trimming..

Are you guys telling me that you chamfer all of your bottle neck rifle brass, all the time, regardless.

I know crimping .223 is one of the hot button issues and many opt to not crimp...

but chamfering all of your cases, all of the time sounds like a royal PITA
 
I chamfer after trimming, or if cases have a blunt edge on the case mouth. No need to do it again until trimming.

I have seated a metric boatload of flat based jacketed bullets with no problems and have never understood the folks who say they prefer boat tail bullets because they are easier to seat. Heck, they are all easy to seat. Assuming the case mouth is chamfered anyway. And actually, some here say they never chamfer even after trimming and have no trouble with seating.
 
Are you guys telling me that you chamfer all of your bottle neck rifle brass, all the time, regardless.
Click to expand...
Yes, I am.
But not all the time every time.

Just the first time, or after trimming.

All the time, every time.

rc
 
223 on a Dillon RL 450

The Dillon powder drop die has a universal body and a cartridge specific drop tube that comes with the cartridge conversion kit. The drop tube has a funnel profile on the top and the bottom appears to sit on top of the neck and apply a slight bell.
Click to expand...
No bell on my 223. Pistol is different, it has the expander/bell/powder funnel. I loaded on a Dillon RL 450 with RCBS 223 dies for an M16 before i sold it. DillonRL-450011.jpg My expanding was done while FL Sizing/priming. Then powder drop, then seat bullet. Chamfer the brass after FL sizing, one time and done. If you trim brass, chamfer again. rifle_and_pistol_funnels_m.jpg Handgun on left.
 
I took the powder drop die apart to look at the insert...

I was in error yesterday... my insert does not look like either of those... and it does not bell the case mouth.

I must have got that idea in my head from the photo in the Dillon instruction manual... which in hindsight, is obviously set up for reloading pistol cartridges.

Here's a pic of the bottom of the insert, which has taper to guide the case, then straight wall with a step, which the case mouth bears upon to lift the powder drop mechanism.

223.jpeg

It is labelled 'A', however.
 
Last edited:
Did I mention that I hate bottle neck case prep...

Even now that I have a Super Swager and an RCBS pencil sharpener at my disposal... (my brother has a nice set up)... it still drives me nuts, it takes so stinin' long.

:barf:

But then again... I'm processing about 700 cases :uhoh:
 
Last edited:
SSN Vet said:
Did I mention that I hate bottle neck case prep...

Even now that I have a Super Swager and an RCBS pencil sharpener at my disposal... (my brother has a nice set up)... it still drives me nuts, it takes so stinin' long.

:barf:

But then again... I'm processing about 700 cases :uhoh:
Click to expand...
In exchange for baby sitting your brother's reloading gear, you should get a Giraud Trimmer...LOL Makes brass prep simple and efficient
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Similar threads

P
  • Locked
NewB Q: Lee "factory crimp" die or Dillon taper crimp die?
Replies
14
Views
3K
gamestalker
G
K
  • Locked
V-max 223
Replies
24
Views
639
kestak
K
S
  • Locked
Taper crimp
Replies
1
Views
347
Walkalong
Walkalong
T
  • Locked
Precision Bullets=Bad Christmas Gift?
Replies
6
Views
461
Tony k
T
J
  • Locked
Correct Lee die set for .223 Remington
Replies
11
Views
2K
cfullgraf
cfullgraf
Back
Top