M16/M4/AR15 Reliability Poll – Mark all that apply

[JKimball]

I understand this subject has been hashed out a time or two, but after doing a quick search I couldn’t find any polls on the subject. I’m hoping a lot of people will participate in the poll, but the intent isn’t to start a new thread to hash it out, as that can be found elsewhere.

Also, if your experience with the M16 was during the Viet Nam war or prior to initial improvements, please comment.

 

[RNB65]

My AR's tend to be very reliable thru about 300 rnds, then they need a squirt of CLP on the bolt carrier to keep from jamming. This is based on range shooting from sitting/standing positions with no dirt or sand getting into the receiver.

 

[brentn]

I went 500 rounds in about 2 hours. The prep was only CLP the day before and no lubing during or immediatly before shooting.
No jams, stoppages, double feeds etc, all rounds went through without a hitch. I was using RRA LAR 10 round pistol magazines only, I was doing some rapid fire for a while, and I was also doing some slow fire too.

When I got the rifle home and cleaned it, fouling was caked onto the ridges of the bolt and inside the bolt carrier, very little lube was left at all.

Range time only, wasn't out in the sticks or anything.

 

[jpwilly]

My M4gery DPMS AR-15 has only experianced stopages due to some cheap pro mag magazines and once while shooting wolf steel case ammo...we got the rifle so hot a fired case stuck in the chamber. This was on the 9th mag (30rnders) of steel case wolf in less than 15min. Otherwise the rifle has been reliable even when not cleaned or lubed between range sessions of 200-300rnds per session. I"m partway through my 4th 1000rnd case of wolf with it.

 

[Fast Frank]

My S&W M&P15 hasn't been in the jungle, or the desert, and probably never will.

It lives a clean and pampered life in the safe, and goes to the range to play on occasion.



I've never had any sort of malfunction whatsoever with this rifle.

It's fired about two thousand rounds of whatever is cheap and available, but no steel cases so far.

It's fired Winchester white box, Federal, PMC, Monarch, Remington, and some reloads bought at the gun show.

It would be pretty bizarre for it to jam up and act stupid tonight if the bad guys kicked down my door, after coming up roses for the last two years of range time wouldn't it?

I trust it.

 

[mp510]

I know that early M-16 furniture had a repertoir for breaking easily, and that one of the fixes with the A2 was a better plastic for the stock. I think it worked. I slammed an M-16A2 butt-stock into a tree, pretty hard, with no ill effect.

 

[siglite]

I needed a choice for "I have used one in combat" between "completely reliable" and "unsatisfactory."

I've had a failures, but they were my fault for not cleaning. You only make that mistake once, unless you're a very very stupid individual. You might only make that mistake once because you're dead. Either way, it's a mistake to be avoided.

While the failures shook my confidence in the rifle, I didn't consider it "unsatisfactory."

 

[RockyMtnTactical]

Been shooting/building/fixing AR15's for years. Own several, shoot them often, in all conditions, and find them to be completely trustworthy as long as they are made from quality parts from reputable manufacturers.

 

[MutinousDoug]

I have used an M16-A1 in combat. I trust it. I use an AR15 in High Power and have since 1998. Occasionally I have had failures to chamber a round during a rapid fire string. Not more than two or three times. (probably cost me a few points, though). This over the course of more than 3000 rounds shot in competition and some 2000 round practice. The gun is less problematic than my Garands (which I have more than 3000 round through).

 

[rero360]

Colt M4 and M203 from April 2007 till Oct 2007 (had a SAW for the begining of the tour) while living at FOB Rustamiah, south east part of Baghdad, Iraq, completed over 200 combat patrols. I didn't have one malfuntion the entire time.

Now I've had malfuntions in the past with M16s, but all because of blanks.

We did have a number of individuals who experienced malfuntions with their M4s while we were Mobing at Ft. Dix. but all of them were due to the individuals not taking care of their weapons. Its funny everyone who had issues were former cage kickers from a certain territory, all of us that were former ground pounders didn't have any issues.

Actually I did have one issue, the metal piece that houses the foreward asist got dented in alittle causing the FA to stick, a little elbow greese fixed it no problem.

 

[a_half_minute]

With proper maintenance, I have had no problems with the M4 platform. Key words "With Proper Maintenance." The AR-15/M4 platform is one helluva weapon in everyway, but when I see what an AK can go through and still go boom I get a lil envious. What the AR needs is that AK/Glock reliability to go along with its modularity and accuracy.
I am trying to change that, or at least give myself the option of that extra reliability in some of the new Gas Piston AR's. Currently I am shooting a P.O.F. 415, LWRC, and the Bushy gas piston AR's. I also ordered a Sig 556 today. I am very pleased with my results so far, the P.O.F. chews up and spits out anything. I have yet to clean any of them aside from barrel break in, an they have all put about 2,000 rounds downrange with no problems. I expected this and much cleaner and cooler bolt action (which I got). I am still not sold just yet though because of the Gas-Piston system itself. While other parts run cooler and cleaner that piston and gas rod gets ULTRA HOT. Instead of somewhat equal distribution of heat, it takes the brunt... that's all fine and dandy because we all know that piston will withstand more abuse than the bolt will before rendering you combat innefective. BUT when it does blow and it comes to replacing one in the field that can be next to impossible, so I am gonna make damn sure I can make all that is gonna go wrong go wrong on the range first.
If anyone else has any input on Piston AR's (that owns one) I would lke to hear about it.

 

[possum]

i have used them in combat and i trust thier reliability, and i also own and have used many ar15's and never have had any issues form any of them, they do need to be kept clean, but why go into a fight with a weapon that ain't i am an infantry guy though so maybe that is my personal opinion but i think it is a good one.

 

[Dienekes]

First had one in SEA in 1966, but the armory did the maintenance and cleaning on them, plus loaded and issued the mags on a daily basis. The one time I did fire it I had a jam--don't remember the nature of it. I wasn't real happy about it but in retrospect I think if I had been maintaining it and the mags, that might not have happened.

Had a Colt CAR-15 in the mid 80s, and don't remember any failures with it at all. I do remember busting my rear falling down a long set of stone steps, with the Colt taking its licks along the way. It survived better than I did.

Picked up a Bushmaster M4gery with A1 upper, about 18 months ago. Am now up to about 1800 rounds with one failure to extract around the 1200 round mark. Put in a D-Fender and the problem went away.

As currently set up, it has good sights (compact ACOG), a good trigger (Jard aftermarket) and is .9994445 % reliable as I write.

I can live with that. I am very fond of the M1 and M14/M1A .30 caliber rifles, but the ARs will do their part if I do mine.

 

[Ragnar Danneskjold]

Virtually all of the negativity about the AR-15/M16 platform stem from it's initial problems in the Vietnam War, as well as from old timers who considered the new weapon's polymer components "toy-like" and substandard to the wood and blued steel they were used to.

The AR-15/M16 based weapons of today are some of the most reliable and versatile weapons ever made. They are simply not the same problematic guns of decades past.

Personally, I used an M16 during Basic/AIT and did not experiance a single problem during any of the times I fired my weapons, live rounds or blanks. I also bought a brand new M4gery when I got back and had a few problems in my first 200 rounds, but none since breaking it in.

 

[Acheron]

IMO the AR is a great and reliable rifle as long as you clean it every 500 rds or so. After that the rifle starts to have some troubles-mostly little jams that are easy to clear. But the problems really start to pile up after you go more than 1000 rds without cleaning.

The reason why this causes the AR to lose some points in my book is because there are several other modern rifles that can go much longer without cleaning. The reason why troops nowadays aren't having troubles with ARs like the old-timers did is twofold:

1) The rifle has been substantially improved since it was first issued


2) Most troops now are fighting in low-intensity conflicts that are characterised by short periods of intense combat and then large blocks of uneasy peacetime. This gives soldiers time to clean and care for their weapons and make sure that their weapons are in top shape. If our troops were involved in a major high-intensity conflict (a major war) then I think that serious issues with the M16 system would rear their ugly head.


Truth be told, it's a great rifle for civilians or for a peacetime military. The problem is that it still s**ts where it eats which is a terrible way to design a military arm. I understand the reasoning behind the use of the direct-impingement system, but I also know that there are better ways to build a rifle.

 

[navajo]

reliable

Only malfunctions I have had with personal AR-15s were mag related.

I had one malfunction with an M-16, case seperated in the chamber, just about in half. This was an A-1. I do not blame the weapon for that. However, I was a school trained armorer and knew what made it run.

My biggest complaint with the M-16 was the caliber. .22 centerfires just don't do anything for me. Which is why I own five 7.62X51 rifles and I am picking up another today.

 

[mljdeckard]

One of the questions I consider to be irrelvant- whether or not the rifle is clean. I always keep the rifle reasonably clean, even if it's an old beat-up SKS. I've never tried to get one really dirty and still use it.

 

[Tin Gizel]

Here's what I have to say:

1. Not all AR's/M16/4's are created equal. Some run better than others.
2. Mine, if greased, will run 100% all day or up to 800 rounds. - Most I've put through it in a day...Grease works for me, liquids do not.
3. Ammo and mags have induced all malfunctions I've ever had - minus those from liquid lube. Wolf will get stuck in my chamber when it gets HOT....no anti tilt followers will cause me FTF.

 

[The Gunman]

I had one malfunction with an M-16, case seperated in the chamber, just about in half.-navajo

What ammunition were you shooting, .223 Remington or 5.56 Nato?
What is the weapon chambered for?

 

[Crow1108]

I have about 3 different experiences with the AR-15/M-16.

1) Basic Training. The M-16s we were issued in CATM were used and abused, to say the least. Mine kept getting double-feeds (probably due to the magazine).

2) Regular qualification: These M-16s seem to have been taken better care of. I hardly ever get jams with these.

3) My Bushmaster M4gery: Never had a hicup out of it, and I've put maybe 800 rounds through it. Of course, after every trip to the range, I break out the picks, rags, toothbrush, and CLP and give it a good cleaning.

It's just like anything else, take care of it, and it will serve you well.

By the way Acheron, the book you quoted in your sig is awesome.

 

[kcmarine]

Finally, a poll to get the truth. Thank you.

 

[brighamr]

Here's my experience:

M16A2 - rented at the range (FA). Wasn't perfectly clean, but wasn't "dirty". several FTEs. using Remmington ammo and OEM mags. FTEs doing single and burst fire.

Bushmaster AR15 - brother owns it. 2000 rnds so far. Cleans it every few hundred rounds. Had a few FTEs during breakin, but none since.

AR10 - brother owns it. 1500 rnds so far. Cleans it every 200 rounds on the dot. Has yet to have an FTF or FTE.

I agree the platform is modular, accurate, and very fun. Would I rely on an AR in a prolonged shtf situation where I couldn't take time to clean it every few hundred rounds? probably not. BUT if I had 2 of them and could switch every few hundred rounds while someone else cleaned the previously used rifle, then that would be fine.

 

[navajo]

reliability

In addition;

Of the seven M1As I have owned, not one malfunction of any kind. Ever.
The one I have left is pushing 30 years old. Not one malfunction.
This is with surplus, commercial and hand loads.

Of the three AR 10s I own, one malfunction which was mag related. Five minute fix and no more malfunctions.

 

[MudPuppy]

I had problems with my issued weapon with the tiny little extractor leaving the empty in the chamber. At the range, it got the back of my head slapped by the DI for not confirming the chamber was empty. In training, I got to hear what the MILES alarm sounded like after ambushing an "enemy" squad from the rear and firing exactly ONE shot. I've not been in combat, so I don't have an interesting story about it jamming then...

My olympic and dpms AR-15s run fine, but put me in the distrustful of the platform's reliability. (And I'm not sure how much a piston would have helped with any of the jams I experienced.) It's a very ergonomic and modular platform, it's a joy to shoot. It's very accurate as well, I just have had it eff me.

 

[Chris Rhines]

I have never been in combat, but I have extensive experience with both the M16/M4 and the AR15. I consider both very reliable.
I have witnessed parts breakage in the M16/M4/AR15 during normal use.
My experience has been that the M16/M4/AR15 is reliable even when dirty.

- Chris