M1a as long range hunter

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mshootnit

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If you were going to set up a standard M1a rifle as a walking long range hunter/ tactical,
Which accessories would you use? I am thinking along the lines something comparable in weight and profile to an SVD. Just a lot more American. A walking rifle so not to set it up as an overboard 15 lb sniper.
I am thinking it would include a scope with the tactical style adjustable knobs, mount, and cheek riser? I am not too big on 30mm scopes, something moderate in weight. Low profile too.
 
Not an expert on m1a's the only one I've shot had a stainless match barrel and irons but I think with optics it would be a hefty gun to walk with.
 
When set up as a "long range hunter" it is gonna be a hefty load. In most states hunting rifles are limited to 5 or 10 rounds too. My M1a from early 80s was converted to standard weight NM by Smith enterprises in late 80s. recently because of degenerating vision I scoped it with a Sadlak mount (which you need a cheek riser) and a Night Force NXS 2.5-10x32 which I have had for a while and while heavy is compact. If you want to carry it get a nice heavyduty sling , my set up with bipod is 11.5 pounds with mag but unloaded. It is just over 1 MOA accurate with Federal Gold Match so call it good to go at 600 yards for hunting .
 
Scoping M1As is always a bit iffy, but if you want a hunting scope with increased long range capability for relatively little additional weight, the Leupold VX-3i CDS scopes give you an exposed elevation turret and only weighs 13 oz. You can get side focus parallax for 17 oz.

A cheek riser is probably mandatory.
 
In NRA high power competition, long range is 800 to 1000 yards

In hunting, it's an emotional thing that varies with people and the game they want to take.
 
As said it's heavy, but a lot of hunting was done in Vietnam.
I prefer the Basset low mount with a Leupold of choice or Night Force if you can afford it. Mil dot. I also like the Bradley removable cheek rest. I only have 200yds so I use irons mostly with the M1A NM. Great iron sights.
Scope & mount on and off with no loss of zero. At least not at 200yds.
 
I love hunting with M1a's, but they're heavy, no two ways around that.

Connecting with game at ranges beyond 600yrds is always much more about the shooter than the rifle. Of course, the rifle has to be capable of delivering sub-MOA 100% of the time (i.e. a 10" group at 1,000yrds doesn't count as ethical accuracy for deer hunting in my book), but the shooter is most commonly the weakest link.

I am not too big on 30mm scopes

Not many folks like 30mm tubes, but if you're thinking long range with a 308win, they do offer a convincing advantage. 1" tubes will kill game at long ranges too, but often require a little more planning in your gear than 30mm tubes.
 
I used to have a National Match M1A. As for a long range hunting rifle my comments are:

1. There are rifles that are much more convinient to put a scope on.
2. There are rifle more convinient to put a bipod on; a bipod is quite useful for long range shooting.
3. As far as accuracy goes, I wasn't quite satisfied the the 1 MOA or so I got.
4. For long range shooting, ballistic turrets/reticles are nice and for those, you may need to go with a 30mm tube.

If it were me and I felt the need of a semiautomatic 308 Winchester for hunting I'd go for an AR style rifle.
 
There is a reason most folks don't use an M1a as a walking around deer rifle. Almost any centerfire rifle would be better, and much cheaper.
 
I n keeping with the question posed... what I did with mine was: I bought Springfields plastic (?) stock removed the metal buttplate and added in it's place, a recoil pad with 1 extra inch. I next added an ARMS #18 scope mount, topped that off with a Leupold 40mm objective 4.5 -14 with custom M1 dials and quick release rings. I added a Coyote tactical strap on cheek riser tuned the gas system with Fulton armory shims, clipped on a US web sling and never looked back. After replacing the very nice wood stock and loosing the steel buttplate, with the mount and optic the rifle weighs maybe 1 lb more than it did originally. Mine is the lite match version and is pretty accurate, it runs around 3/4 -1 minute which is very repeatable after dismounting the optic, which by the way was simple to install, and very robust. Hope this helps you, I'm very satisfied with the rifle, both before and after I put it on a diet to hump around elk hunting.
 
In my opinion the .308 Win cartridge should be limited to mid-range at most (around 600 yards) for deer and smaller game and no more than about 300 yards for large game animals. That being said, I love the M1A rifle and have three of them and the one that I use for hunting (to include elk and moose) is my SOCOM. I modified it quite heavily with an eye making it accurate and light. I took my elk this year with it at 110 yards with open sights using a 168gr TTSX hand load. I have a rail on top that allows me to attach and detach optics very easily and quickly but I don't usually use my Nikon 2.5-8 power scope because most of my shots are within 200 yards.
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I n keeping with the question posed... what I did with mine was: I bought Springfields plastic (?) stock removed the metal buttplate and added in it's place, a recoil pad with 1 extra inch. I next added an ARMS #18 scope mount, topped that off with a Leupold 40mm objective 4.5 -14 with custom M1 dials and quick release rings. I added a Coyote tactical strap on cheek riser tuned the gas system with Fulton armory shims, clipped on a US web sling and never looked back. After replacing the very nice wood stock and loosing the steel buttplate, with the mount and optic the rifle weighs maybe 1 lb more than it did originally. Mine is the lite match version and is pretty accurate, it runs around 3/4 -1 minute which is very repeatable after dismounting the optic, which by the way was simple to install, and very robust. Hope this helps you, I'm very satisfied with the rifle, both before and after I put it on a diet to hump around elk hunting.
You like that ARMS mount?
 
I really do like the ARMS 18. Its simple to det up and very solid. Dont have experience with Sadlack so I cant comment about them, the Springfield aluminium ones however leavee very unimpressed. The ARMS, sans optic has plenty of room to see the irons over the top. If you use it as a base keep in mind the eyepiece diameter of your optic cant be too latge, as it would interfere with the rear sight
 
While I shot the M-14 well, after I humped one in the Army, I swore I'd never carry one again. I still shoot a .308, but it's now in a light weight, but still accurate, scoped Browning BLR that weighs maybe 2/3's of the M-1A.
 
If you were going to set up a standard M1a rifle as a walking long range hunter/ tactical,
Which accessories would you use? I am thinking along the lines something comparable in weight and profile to an SVD. Just a lot more American. A walking rifle so not to set it up as an overboard 15 lb sniper.
I am thinking it would include a scope with the tactical style adjustable knobs, mount, and cheek riser? I am not too big on 30mm scopes, something moderate in weight. Low profile too.
I used to own a Springfield National Match M1A for years and years. After I left Los Angeles for Arizona in the 90's it was one of the first rifles I bought. Once we made it to Texas and the guys at the fire station introduced me to hog hunting it was the first gun I brought out there thinking that it would be a good rifle for that, I was both right and wrong. It depended greatly on what type of hunting we were doing.

Before using the M1A for hog hunting the only place I'd ever really carried that rifle was to the firing line at the range (which was like 50 feet from the parking lot) and in the desert basically shooting off the tailgate of my truck using that as a table for Mags and ammo.

At the time it was basically the most accurate rifle I owned. In its stock configuration it was heavy, but doable. But to squeeze every bit of accuracy out of it I scoped it with a fixed 6x S.A. scope, then later a 3-9x40 Leupold variable and used an ARMS mount and rings on it. This increased its weight a great deal. Accurate as all get out, but that kind of put it past the tipping point and made it a complete pig.

If I was hunting out of a stand or stalking from watering hole to watering hole for just one or two nights it was fine. Totally worked, but we'd go out there and eradicate hogs for like 5 days at a time and literally hunt all night and by the morning of the 3rd day it was frigging heavy. Before people start with the calls to 'Lift Weights' or 'Do you even lift brah?' I'll just point out that I did, at the time I was benching 300 lbs. It was just somewhat of a cumulative effect and this was also during the summer.

Eventually I had to sell it. Just needed the money.

Here it is ...
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I used an ARMS mount and rings, bomb proof ... but heavy

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I just recently bought another semi .308, but it's a PTR-91. I made sure not to repeat the same mistake that I did with the M1A and when looking at optics I took weight into way more consideration than I did with that M1A.

With just the iron sights the weight wasn't bad though. A conventional fixed 6x or variable scope, rings and mounts just made it too heavy for an almost week long hunt. It also screwed with the balance and made it top heavy.

If I had it to do over again and was going to hunt with an M1A what I'd do is buy and install one of the lighter weight Trijicon ACOG's. Something like a TA-33 calibrated for .308 Win. I have a TA-33 for one of my AR's and what you get out of that tiny lightweight package is amazing. You can also use the horse-shoe reticle kind of like a dot by keeping both eyes open. At the ranges that most people hunt deer and hog at that would have given me more precision at distance and have given me an illuminated reticle for hog hunting in poor light and at night, but wouldn't have made it such a pig.

So I'd personally forget about using a variable scope. That's just me though. Depends on if you'll be hunting out of a stand or not too. While throwing on a variable scope will mess with the balance at least it won't weigh you down while you're having to walk if you're exclusively hunting out of a stand.

As far as semi .308's/x51 NATO rifles go I grew up with an H&K 91, I've owned two FAL's, two PTR's, a BM-59, an AR-10 and that M1A and out of them all the M1A is the easiest to make an out of balance mess by throwing a scope on. Just not really made to be scoped. So with the the M1A I'd measure a few times and cut once in regards to installing an optic.

For accessories I used one of those padded leather run of the mill cheek pieces with the bottom laces and a VTAC sling. The fact that sling was padded helped a great deal.
 
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Bassett and Sadlak mounts are the only two mounts that I like, ARMS works but they aren't as universal as the first two and Bassett is the most universal of the three. The ARMS mount is the lowest of the three, if it fits (it's not the mount that causes the problem, it's very slight variations in the receiver). The Bassett is the easiest and the quickest to install and uninstall and the Sadlak is the most solid mechanically. I've had a Sadlak installed for over 5 years on my M1A Loaded model and it's never moved. I have friends that use the Bassett and the ARMS mounts and nobody with the Bassett has ever complained while a couple of the guys with the ARMS mounts have quit using them because they just couldn't get them to fit properly and they had elevation problems or the mounts would work loose after a while.

My modified SOCOM only weighs a little over 9 pounds with a fully loaded 10 round mag and no optics. Most ARs weigh more than that after people install all the gadgets that they seem to like nowadays but even a stripped down AR will only weigh a couple pounds less so I don't mind the extra weight since I also get more flexibility in potential loads and more knockdown power. ARs limit you to only a few bullet weights, 50 grains to 70 something but my SOCOM does well with bullets weighing from 110 grains to 175 grains and I can use it for varmints to moose.

As I mentioned earlier, I don't like to use the .308 past about 300 or so yards for big game because the bullet doesn't carry that much energy. I use a 168gr TTSX most often and you can increase the bullet weight to get more energy but the rifle isn't really designed for bullets that are heavier than 175gr so my 168gr hunting bullets are a compromise, they are faster and flatter out of the SOCOM than I can get the 175gr bullets but they don't have quite as much knock down power. That's also why I use a TTSX bullet, it makes up for any shortcoming of the lighter bullet by virtue of it's design. With my hand loads I'd probably have no problem with taking a shot on an elk out to 600 yards but only if it were under extreme circumstances like my family being out of food but I wont do it for sport. The SOCOM is fully capable of holding 2 MOA out to 400 yards so a 600 yards shot would be a stretch. On the other hand, I've used the Loaded model for long range target shooting out to 1100 yards and did quite well, not as good as the guys I was shooting against but not bad for a semi-automatic service rifle that wasn't tweaked by an expert gunsmith.
 
Have a semi'd Winchester M-14 that has the issue fibreglass stock on it. Felt recoil is non-existent. Easiest carrying rifle I have. No scope. Never bothered weighing it, but SA Inc. says their Standard(higher end models are heavy. A Loaded with the synthetic stock is 9.3 pounds. Not ugly, but will be by 2 or 3 o'clock.) with their synthetic weighs 8.8 pounds.
However, it's not about the M1A being a suitable long range hunting rifle(it mostly is). It's about the .308's remaining energy and the bullet drop with hunting bullets. Think a 165 hunting bullet. Best weight for hunting anything with the .308. Hornady InterLock SP's in their American Whitetail brand, sighted in 2" high at 100, will be on target at 200, 8.6" low at 300, 25.10" low at 400 and 50.8" low at 500. Assuming you can hit the proverbial 9" pie plate, every time, at those distances, the remaining energy is ok at 400, but marginal at 500.
 
I've been looking into using my M1A for hunting as well. Not long range like the op, but just run of the mill moose hunting. One of the main changes I'm going to do is install an adjustable gas plug, not for accuracy but to ease the stress on my rifle.
 
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