Man shoots self in leg at gun show

[Slamfire]

I wish I had collected all the accidental discharges at Gun Shows that I have heard about.

Locally, Gun Shows were held at the largest building in town, the City Convention Center, until a man shot himself just outside the gun show.

He had purchased a S&W auto, magazines, and ammunition. Upon leaving the gun show, but still inside the convention center, he put a loaded magazine in the pistol, cut the cable tie strap around the trigger, and somehow got an accidental discharge. The muzzle was aimed at his midsection.

The shot severed his spine and that man is in a wheel chair, with tube to his urine bag.

It did not help things to have this guy bleeding all over the place in full view of the general public, and there was a Religious Event going on in other parts of the Convention Center. The City decided they had too much fun with gun nuts and that was the last we had a show in the Convention Center. That was at least 20 years ago.

Accidental discharges at gun shows are just fodder for Gun Control advocates, and yet irresponsible people act foolishly and endanger us all.

 

[opsman]

To say accidents happen is pure B.S. This guy violated the first rule of safe gun handling. ALWAYS KEEP IT POINTED IN A SAFE DIRECTION. Unless his leg is made out of armor plate, of which I seriously doubt then he was a PURE DUMB A@@.

 

[aaronu]

I'm not liking the apologist point of view. The guy shot himself because those evil anti-gunners put him in the position of having to reload in the parking lot. For reals?

No, he violated basic firearms safety rules and in the process injured himself and made himself out to be a jacka$$. And in the process, he tarred us all with the same brush.

Sheesh.

 

[billdeserthills]

I was at the Mesa AZ show last ND, a seller got in a hurry & put a loaded handgun into a box & apparently a buyer was just reaching around in the box without looking first & then boom! Now the police get to go thru every vendor's stuff looking for potential accidents, sure made me not want to do any more gunshows in Mesa. I can't say the police presence does much to guarantee future safety but it definately was a money-loser for my business.

 

[maskedman504]

Irresponsible handling of a firearm.

/thread

 

[JRH6856]

Too many people just don't think before they act. Get as many people in one place as were at the show Saturday, and you have too many people that don't think in one place. People standing in front of the tables and more moving both ways in aisles that were maybe 6ft wide. It was a lot of people. It's a good thing they were checking for unloaded guns, because they couldn't check for unloaded brains.

At one table, guns were laid out, slides tied, security alarm cable looped through the trigger guards; Bubba walks up, picks up a pistol, turns and starts sighting at the ceiling lights...half the guns on the table are now hanging from the security cable that Bubba is tugging on. Looked like he was running a trotline.

I watched one guy buying an AR. He asked the vendor to cut the tie so he could check the action. Then he opens a bag of ammo he had from another table and asked for a magazine. The vendor refused, took the gun back and replaced the tie and told the guy it would be best if he moved along. It only takes one idiot and in a crowd like that there were more than one.

 

[Mike1234567]

...

 

[guyfromohio]

Why do we assume someone is capable of following a "no loaded firearms allowed" sign and not a "keep it concealed" sign? If you step back from the screen, you'll see echoes of our struggle to carry concealed. I guess the morons are too stupid to carry legally and safely.

 

[JRH6856]

Why do we assume someone is capable of following a "no loaded firearms allowed" sign and not a "keep it concealed" sign?

I, for one, don't make that assumption. I assume some people are negligent and will do dumb things even when they know better. The guy loading the AR realized the mistake he was trying to make and was somewhat embarrassed. He just wasn't thinking which means he was being negligent. All the signs can do is raise awareness and hopefully reduce the number of opportunities for negligence.

If you step back from the screen, you'll see echoes of our struggle to carry concealed. I guess the morons are too stupid to carry legally and safely.

Unfortunately, some people are too stupid to carry safely, legally or not. Liberty has a price. That price is responsibility. As a society, we have tried to relieve individuals of the price of personal responsibility for their mistakes by limiting their liberty to make those mistakes. Now, more people are demanding the restoration of those liberties, but I'm not sure everyone making those demands is ready for the responsibility that comes with it. Some of the things I see at gun shows and shooting ranges just plain scare me. Especially when I realize that most of these people actually have CHLs and carry. One of the reasons I go armed is I feel a need to protect myself from them.

 

[Owen Sparks]

Police say he was re-loading the pistol in the parking lot because loaded guns weren't allowed inside the gun show.

So he really did not shoot himself "at" a gun show. He shot himself in a parking lot.

 

[JFrame]

Let's face it -- we see what incredibly stupid things people do with 3,000-pound weapons every day...


.

 

[Lex Luthier]

Gun shows in MN are actually a refreshing place to visit. Upon entering, you are asked if you are carrying a loaded weapon. You say yes, and have the opportunity to draw it slowly and eject the mag, open the slide to confirm it is empty, you put the mag in one pocket and the pistol back in the holster.

I can say that everyone I've had dealings with are mature and aware of their surroundings to the degree that if someone is acting out of turn, he/ she will be noticed and properly policed. Clearly this guy was an idiot.

 

[Sam1911]

Liberty has a price. That price is responsibility.

Not just responsibility.

Liberty also carries the price of being "messy" and not terribly safe. Exercising your liberty, and allowing others to exercise theirs does require that you, on some level, accept that you and/or your loved ones may be injured or die due to someone else's negligence while exercising their freedom to do whatever.

Of course, we have laws and courts to try and assign blame and provide some degree of recompense after the fact, but at its heart, liberty is dangerous.

 

[X-Rap]

There have been enough posts to prove to me that there are indeed people that will feel the need to draw their carry weapon to do all the typical things, test holsters, compare triggers, or just show off how individual their gun is.
This is clearly the reason for loaded carry prohibition at some shows and shops, ND's do happen and you don't have to go far to find someone who has witnessed one if you haven't seen it with your own eyes.
There is no intelligence test at the door and at the shows and shops I frequent it is not unusual to be covered by the muzzle of a gun and the door is not the place for clearing weapons unless there is a booth/barrel that can contain a discharge but then you have to assume the brains to use that properly.
If you have only one gun for PD and it needs to be handled at a show or shop the parking lot is really the only place to unload or load with the minimum chance of endangering the public but as has been suggested a much better way would be to use an alternate gun and keep it holstered and under concealment at all times.

 

[Double Naught Spy]

Oh, and by the way.... no loaded firearms allowed because you can't be trusted.

Considering some of the mental midgets that I saw at the gun show Saturday, that seems like an extremely wise policy.

I have found this to be quite the interesting dichotomy. We don't trust our fellow gun owners at gun shops and gun shows, but we expect the rest of the public to trust us with guns in the work place, private business, etc. We claim we need to be able to carry a gun into other people's businesses and have guns in public places for safety. Then we also claim that we can't have folks with loaded guns at gun shows and some gun shops. Why? For safety. If we don't trust ourselves, then I really don't see why we should expect others to trust us.

The OP example is but one reason businesses have no-guns policies. Contrary to most of our thinking, the business owner knows full well that a sign won't stop a criminal from carrying a gun into the business. The signs are to stop law-abiding "mental midgets" from carrying a gun into the business and then having a ND.

 

[X-Rap]

If you pulled your gun and cleared, fondled, checked trigger pull, passed around to others in a theater, hardware store, grocery, or restaurant you could/would likely be arrested under some type of brandishing law. That same criteria probably wouldn't stand up at a show or shop that deals specifically with firearms in the first place.
I don't have statistics but I am betting that ND's are much higher in businesses that deal in firearms than in others and that lands squarely on the fact that guns are handled in those places and just carried in others.

 

[newbuckeye]

D.N.S, I think it's different. Taking a CCW to work or into public, you aren't taking it out to try on a new holster. As has been stated before, you holster it in the morning, unholster it in the evening. Period. gun shows and stores are for the fondling of firearms, and the few that violate the 4 basics resulting in ND at shows and in stores form the rules for the rest of us.

 

[JRH6856]

…the business owner knows full well that a sign won't stop a criminal from carrying a gun into the business. The signs are to stop law-abiding "mental midgets" from carrying a gun into the business and then having a ND.

The business owner (and gun show organizer, and event hall operator) also knows that if there is a ND in his store and someone gets hurt, he will likely be named in the damage suit. Lawyers can get very creative when they go looking for deep pockets. If the person that has the ND doesn't have deep enough pockets, they'll try to shift responsibility to the property owner/ business operator for not prohibiting guns at the location.

It may be only a matter of time before some states start requiring a minimum "proof of responsibility" in the form of personal bond or personal liability insurance to get a CHL as is now the case with a driver's license.

 

[Owen Sparks]

And that will be the begining of the end of our liberty.

 

[bbuddtec]

...what Sam said...

And not for nothin', but carrying the gun you just bought yesterday at the gunshow???

 

[JRH6856]

And that will be the begining of the end of our liberty.

Liberty is a fragile and fleeting thing in any society. Enjoy it while you have it.

 

[gym]

I zip tie my guns prior to etering the show, as half the people who work the entrance don't know how many guns operate, and can put a nice scratch on your prized possesion. Also here is no reason to bring a gun in, unless you are looking to sell it. I take a less expensive gun with me that day, because unless I am looking to trade or purchase a weapon, it can sit in the car, with the slide removed. My car is usually up front because of a dissability, so it's pretty safe. But why even take your gun in unless you are looking to trade or sell it.
As far as droping the hammer on a live round, unless it was a 1911, and he was carrying it with a round in the chamber and hammer either half cocked or on the round, it's hard to figure out how he could be that careless. Even a striker fired pistol had to be fired by pulling the trigger as with all guns. guns won't fire unless it's trigger is pulled unless it's a single action and you don't have a decocker like a 1911. I bet he got confused being a new gun, and dropped the hammer thinking he had a decocker, instead of a safety, but he still pulled the trigger. Soomeone should invent a part that you can slide in between the hammer of a single action auto, making it safe to drop thr hammer without firing, for such people. Obviouslly they aren't able to do this themselves using thumb and forfinger as a two pronged safety measure. I always use a second finger, to block the firing pin even though I have done this for decades now. It only takes a split second to slip off the hammer. Only when using a fanny pack and I can't see if the manual safety has possibly disengaged from rubbing against my person.Otherwise it's cocked an locked.

 

[Double Naught Spy]

D.N.S, I think it's different. Taking a CCW to work or into public, you aren't taking it out to try on a new holster. As has been stated before, you holster it in the morning, unholster it in the evening. Period. gun shows and stores are for the fondling of firearms, and the few that violate the 4 basics resulting in ND at shows and in stores form the rules for the rest of us.

No, it isn't different at all. Gun shops and and gun shows that don't allow folks to carry loaded guns show a definite lack of trust that gun owners are responsible in the handling of their guns. When I go to a gun store, I go there like everywhere else and go armed. The gun stores I go to don't keep me from conceal carrying. I don't stupidly take out my loaded carry gun and try fitting it into holsters or try mounting a light on its rail, but there are apparently enough people who are morons who will do that and who have accidents. There have been several NDs posted on this forum and elsewhere about CCW folks having NDs in businesses, sometimes because they were fiddling with their guns, sometimes because of poor carry choices. So the problem is real, but gun owners like to demand entry to other people's businesses while armed, but don't see a problem with not being able to carry a loaded and functional gun into a gun show because gun owners can't be trusted to be safe? Come on.

As I have seen repeatedly written and heard repeatedly stated by pro gun folks when a private property owner doesn't want to allow CCW in their business, what part of "shall not be infringed" don't gun stores and gun shows understand?

As a business owner concerned about liability or even as an anti, would you not find it very interesting that gun shows and some gun shops don't trust people with loaded guns? If the people selling guns to us don't trust us to have loaded guns, why would anybody else trust us?

Also here is no reason to bring a gun in, unless you are looking to sell it.

Wow. No reason? So you probably don't have any reason to carry a gun anywhere else then either.

So while you may feel you need to CCW everywhere else, gun shows are magically safer places where you don't need a gun for protection?

We seem to be making a pretty clear double standard here. The funny part is that we don't recognize a private property/business owner's concerns about safety, but apparently some of us think those concerns are valid and think that disarming (or being made non-functional) is valid at gun shows and some gun shops despite rights being trampled as we claim happens with non-gun private businesses/properties.

 

[JRH6856]

As I have seen repeatedly written and heard repeatedly stated by pro gun folks when a private property owner doesn't want to allow CCW in their business, what part of "shall not be infringed" don't gun stores and gun shows understand?

Perhaps the stores and shows are wondering what part of "well regulated" do gun owners not understand?

 

[mortablunt]

Thus, I am a fan of manual safeties and not putting my fingers near my triggers when I'm just doing routine handling.