Many agree that amsec/strudy are equal

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I get it, its a contest for the longest thread.

Arguments are going round & round!

I'll sum it up.

Sturdy owners very happy!

AmSec owners very happy!

All the questions have been asked, answered and debated (ad nauseam).

Make a decision! You will be happy either way.

Good luck.

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I'LL BE HAPPY IF YOU BUY ME BOTH :cuss: THEN THE THREAD WILL END----BY THE WAY, I WONDER IF YOURS IS ON THE WAY SO YOU CAN GIVE SOME DETAILS---THANKS---AND YOU ARE RIGHT BUT I MUST MAKE THE RIGHT DECISION---AND JUST FOR THE RECORD (SOME SAY THAT AN AX CAN KNOCK A HOLE IN YOUR SAFE) THAT WHAT IS CAUSING THE BACK AND FORTH
 
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UL rates gun safes with an RSC designation. I personally don't think that it means a thing, and there are a number of gun safes on the market that don't want to waste their money testing them.

Even though some are tested and some are not, you're still in the same ball park when it comes to physical resistance. UL says the resistance of a typical gun safe is against a small hammer (3 lbs or less in weight, 18 inches or less in length), and a pry bar (18 inches or less in length), for a period of 5 minutes. There is some more involved, but this is essentially what the discussion is about.

So yes, your average gun safe will buy you at least 5 minutes against a small hammer and small pry bar. This includes AMSEC, Browning, Cannon, Champion, Fort Knox, Liberty, Sturdy, Winchester, etc, etc.
 
But didn't someone post a picture of an ax attack with no entry
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I could tell you about burglars that used high explosives and cutting torches that were not successful, and I could tell you about burglars that used frozen turkeys that were successful.

It's not so much the tools as it is the person using them. I can assure you that a guy like me would have much better luck, knowing what I know, than your average thief. So in this respect, you should consider your particular situation, and decided whether or not you need to prepare for a worse case scenario or not.
 
Are you a safe dealer or a technician
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Me?

I'm the real deal. I buy, sell, trade, and refurbish all makes and models. I deal with everything from 20 pound wall safes up to 20 ton bank vault doors. I move, install, and repair all makes and models. I open safes and vaults due to malfunction or lost combination. I also do warranty work for a wide array of manufacturers.

There are guys that sell safes, and then there are guys like me that actually know what they're talking about. ;)
 
Do you have any bf for sell new or used------6032
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Between myself and my distributors, we probably have about 300 of them that would be ready to ship. Anything I don't have I can send directly from AMSEC.

Feel free to click on the link in my signature and contact me through my website. If you include your zip code, I can quote you a price with shipping.
 
Here is the link to the private video for you guys to see how 10 gauge will perform against a fire axe.
We had a 10 gauge steel sheet that was set up too close to the welding table. Our axe went through the ten gauge and hit the one inch plate, causing the handle to break. We did get a decent size hole for the 35 seconds we attacked it.

The man swinging the axe is our welder, not a pro axe thrower, so you can tell he was not very skilled (he kept hitting the already exposed hole over and over again). Had the strikes been more strategic, he would have made a much bigger hole for the amount of time spent. That's why we wont post this video on our website. We intend to do it over again, but for now, it gives you an idea of how 10 gauge will perform vs. a fire axe (assuming these other safe mfg use a 10 gauge A36 or better).
 
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Our axe went through the ten gauge and hit the one inch plate, causing the handle to break. We did get a decent size hole for the 35 seconds we attacked it.
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Another great video Alyssa! Gee too bad you had to ruin a perfectly good fire ax handle now. That A36 sheet even looked like pretty good quality steel too and it didn't hold up for very long.
 
Here is the link to the private video for you guys to see how 10 gauge will perform against a fire axe.
We had a 10 gauge steel sheet that was set up too close to the welding table. Our axe went through the ten gauge and hit the one inch plate, causing the handle to break. We did get a decent size hole for the 35 seconds we attacked it.

The man swinging the axe is our welder, not a pro axe thrower, so you can tell he was not very skilled (he kept hitting the already exposed hole over and over again). Had the strikes been more strategic, he would have made a much bigger hole for the amount of time spent. That's why we wont post this video on our website. We intend to do it over again, but for now, it gives you an idea of how 10 gauge will perform vs. a fire axe (assuming these other safe mfg use a 10 gauge A36 or better).
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Your kidding me right? I don't want to see what a fire ax does to 10 gauge steel. Grab some of your 7 gauge steel that you use on your safes and do the same video. I dare ya! This is like a political commercial where a candidate talks bad about the opposition, instead of showing what they got.

"We don't build a 10 gauge safe". You're right you don't, you build a 7 gauge safe, so why are you using 10 gauge in the video? Why wasn't this demo done on 7 gauge steel? I can tell you why. Because the results would be the same. If you think .050" extra is going to keep that fire ax from doing the same thing, then you're fooling yourself.
 
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If the story can be told without breaching anyone's confidential information, I'd love to hear that one!
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It was a 4,000 pound or better round door money chest in a grocery store. Even though there were pallet jacks and forklifts parked nearby, I guess the bad guys figured they would make too much noise.

They raided the frozen turkey aisle and placed them in front of the safe on the pedestal. They then shoved the safe off of the pedestal and onto the frozen turkeys. They used the Turkeys in a similar fashion to the golf balls people often bring up when asking about moving gun safes.

Apparently frozen turkeys slide well on commercial tile floors, even with a few thousand pounds on them. They pushed the safe out of the office, down the hallways, through the stock room, out the rear loading dock door onto a waiting trailer all under turkey power.
 
I also was wondering that too----if you use 7 ga for your product why no show it
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Two reasons. They used 10 gauge steel because they know AMSEC uses this thickness. It's a way to make a stab at AMSEC without saying their name. The HUGE thing they are leaving out, is that AMSEC has drylite fill, and an inner layer of steel as well.

The 2nd reason they used 10 gauge and not their own 7 gauge is because they know it would have the same results. And, on one of their non fire lined safes, once that hole is there.....you're in.....there is no concrete fill or 2nd layer of inner steel. Like I already mentioned, If you think .050" extra is going to keep that fire ax from doing the same thing, then you're fooling yourself. If anyone claims that .050" will indeed keep the fire ax from going through, then that makes AMSEC exempt from the demo because they have that extra .050 + of steel in their inner panel.

In short, Sturdy basically made a video on how to break into one of their own safes in minutes. And, they are putting it on the internet for all to see.
 
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True Keizer.
And that Drylite fill is another two inches thick before the axe makes contact with the inner steel liner.
Some say the Drylite is not that hard but all I can say is the sample I have seen on display at where I bought my BF was pretty hard and certainly harder than sheetrock which any of use could punch through with our own fist or some spongy insulating material.
I know I would not punch on that wall of Drylite with my fist!!
 
Amsec uses 11 gauge.
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Not my earlier AMSEC.

Anyway, for the time being, lets just leave makes and models out of the conversation, and just talk about gauge steel. I saw the video using 10 gauge steel, and want to see the same video using 7 gauge. I know what the outcome will be. I just want to see the surprise factor that hits those with less experience.
 
And that Drylite fill is another two inches thick before the axe makes contact with the inner steel liner.
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That drylight material as we have seen from the photos is a low density insulating material and won't provide much resistance.

I don't doubt that after multiple hits using the pickax end of fire ax hitting the same spot on 7ga that holes will start to emerge on the plate but the level of effort and time required will certainly exhaust the person to the point that they will likely give up shortly after starting. In addition, since we are comparing against an AMSEC BF here we will compare against the fire lined Sturdy. The ceramic fiber insulation has an extremely strong tensile strength, in fact some manufacturers combine Kevlar and glass fiber for their equivalent use material. So what this means is after getting through the first 7ga layer you have a blanket of extremely strong material protecting the 14ga inner liner so now you have to create a hole large enough to pull out the blanket first before even starting to work against the inner liner. This same high strength fiber will also tangle up drill bits pretty effectively as well. But if you still don't like the thought of someone making holes in your gun safe, spend a few hundred bucks or so and double plates the sides to have 3/8" of steel or if you're bolting it down in a corner so that only one side is exposed, just double plate the one side for 1/2 the price. Also, you can upgrade the inner liner to 10ga with Sturdy and have a thicker inner liner than the AMSEC BF has as an outer shell. Lot's of options with Sturdy and all using high quality materials and workmanship at a reasonable price.
 
I don't doubt that after multiple hits using the pickax end of fire ax hitting the same spot on 7ga that holes will start to emerge on the plate
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I'm glad you have the foresight to be able to admit this without seeing it first hand. But, I still want to see them make the same video using their 7 gauge steel. All of their videos showed tests done on their specific safes. Why in this last video did they not use their 7 gauge steel?

I honestly don't think the 7 gauge would take a bunch more hits to breach it, than what you saw with the 10 gauge. It's just not thick enough.
 
I can poke my finger through 1 stiffened sheet of paper. Add a few layers and it won't work. Same principle. More steel of same quality = better than less steel.
 
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