Mauser enough for bears?

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KriegHund

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The alaskan bear attack got me thinking.

My father varrys around a .38 western when we go camping, but thats a pea shooter against a bear.

The biggest gun i have is a 8mm Mauser, and what i want to know is will that be enought o stop an attacking bear?

*Edit*
Im not asking is it ebnough for a hunting rifle- where you can calmy make accurate shots. Im talking about close range-its attacking someone-killing.
 
Im not asking is it enough for a hunting rifle
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Actually, you are. In the event of an attack you want to stop the animal as quickly as possible so as to prevent injury to you or your loved ones. Do you want to defend yourself with weapon you wouldn't be willing to hunt that animal with? In my mind I would want MORE gun than I thought I needed to hunt with.

Im talking about close range-its attacking someone-killing.
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How fast can you work the bolt on a bolt action rifle? Work the bolt and fire accurately? Under stress? I'm not saying it can't be done but I will say unless you train to do that it isn't a skill that comes naturally. An 8mm Mauser can also be a heavy thing to lug around. Now maybe you're a bolt gun expert or this is the only gun you've got. Then go for it. Personally I think there are better choices out there but they may involve spending money you don't have.
 
Bears are big and meen. If they are runing at you then your not going to probably line up your shot real well.

I have no experiance with 8mm but if you want to stop the bear with out placing the shot your probably going to need some thing biger. A high power side by side or over under would be good. Maby a lever action though I'm not sure how big they make those.
 
a good bear deterrant is a short barrelled pump or semi auto shotgun loaded with slugs or 00 or 000 buckshot. many tree planters carry em. When I go hiking my scattergun is with me.
 
That is another good pick. I would prefer a full auto shot gun though :D

Speaking of shot guns how much trouble do you get in for sawing one off these days?
 
Itst he largest cal gun i have at the moment :(

And it would be resting inside my tent. So i dont need to owrry baout weight...

I do have a Mini 14 w/ 30 round mags.

Would the mini-4 and more ammo be preferable? The problem is i dont have any ammo for it at the moment, but i could buy a couple dozen rounds before we go.

Also, are hollow points or FMJ preferable for this type of situation? I was thinking of buying some federal hydrashok HP just for this situation, but if FMJ is preferable i will just get some wolf.
 
I have no experiance with 8mm but if you want to stop the bear with out placing the shot your probably going to need some thing biger.
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If you aren't placing your shots you will need a cannon. A round that doesn't hit any vitals won't stop the bear, physiologically. The bear might decide to play somewhere else but a 5.56mm or a .357 round might do the same.

What kind of bear are we talking about? 30-06 seems to be good enough for black bear, so 7.92mm should work fine. I would shy away from American made ammo though. 30-30 performance in a 30-06 class cartridge. S&B has a 198 grain SP load.

Those suggesting a shotgun: I think penetration would be a big concern with black bear. Any defensive shots would likely be from the front. Black bears have big bones and lots of muscles. I'd go for the penetration a rifle can afford.
 
Im not asking is it ebnough for a hunting rifle- where you can calmy make accurate shots.
Click to expand...

Do you want to defend yourself with weapon you wouldn't be willing to hunt that animal with? In my mind I would want MORE gun than I thought I needed to hunt with.
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I think Mr. WarHound understands that he needs more gun than that needed for hunting. That's why he asked the question.
 
"Hollow points are better for defensive situation"

In the case of bear I'd think penetration would trump expansion. Skulls multiple times thicker than human, muscle tougher and denser and thicker, fat and thick fur...

Mini-14 all the way, 5.56 surplus SS109 maybe.

30 rounds, if you're charged you'll probably empty the mag quick-firing without a sight picture. 30 rounds penetrating a (?)couple feet each(?), that would have to do something to something worth something.
 
I'm going to swim against the tide here. Is the 8mm Mauser adequate? YES

Reasons: 1) you have one!
2) The 30-06 is considered ok and the 8mm is its equal---IF

See, what you want is heavy bullets and PENETRATION to break something down in a charge. Factory US made 8mm ammo is underloaded just in case some fool loads it into an older 8mm barrel with the smaller diameter bore the OLD ones used to have. They are uncommon nowadays. So, what you need is some heavy bullets (I have some 220 grain ones on hand for mine) that are loaded to pressure levels that the Mausers were designed to handle and you will be just fine. You can reload it, have a commercial reloader make up some for you or you can buy FOREIGN FACTORY made 8mm ammo that is loaded to the appropriate levels. You may have to look around a little but it is there.

Good luck and let that 8mm make you feel safe.
 
The 8 will do anything the '06 will do, and it does it with more style. :D
If you want penetration over expansion, and I would almost lean that way, you'd be hard pressed to beat old Turk surplus. That stuff is hotter than any commercial load out there, and abit warmer than I'll reload to.
 
anecdotal evidence

I was watching a show called "Globe Trekker" one day, and the "trekker", Irish kid named Ian, was in Norway. Part of his trip was to go camping overnight on a glacier high above the Arctic Circle. To prepare for this night out and the possibility of a polar bear visit, the state official trained him to set a flair line around his tent and how to shoot a nicely preserved K98 Mauser in 8mm. Pretty cool when the state makes you learn to shoot a weapon they believe will stop a polar bear. I came to conclusion that 8mm is fine for any bear in world and has become my big game round of choice, until I can afford a more modern caliber weapon.

I personally would carry a shotgun loaded with 2 slugs then 00 the rest of the way if in Grizzle county.

Ps: Why dont people set the same flair lines around their tents in Griz country is beyond me. Seems a simple and effective detterent for night visitors.
 
Will a 8mm Mauser kill a bear? Sure it will. Will it reliably stop a charging bear attack? Heck, a 50BMG probably couldn't do that. The key is, as always, shot placement. That requires nerves and time, something that's gonna be in short supply under a bear attack. Don't place your shot well, and I don't care what the chambering is - you're NOT gonna stop that bear. Of course, you're far more likely to have a piano fall on your head than you are to be the victim of a bear attack. But that's small comfort when the woods come alive at night... :eek:

Me? I carry a small hand cannon. It's less obtrusive to tote about, and as a result I'm far more likely to have it at hand when I might need it than would be the case with a long rifle. But if a 8mm Mauser is what you've got and you REALLY, REALLY feel the need to tote something about - sure, take it along. If you do your part, it is capable of being fully effective on bear-type game when stoked with the appropriate rounds (solids or very tough SPs).

A key point here would be to always make sure that it's OK to be packing wherever you go 'packing. Sure does suck to get hauled in by the Park Po-leeece for a weapons violation.
 
Yes, the 8mm will do fine. It's like any other weapon, you have to place the bullet, and you have to have a good bullet to do the job. The S&B stuff mentioned before is probably the best way to go. FMJ ammo usually isn't allowed for hunting, and might be very hard to explain carrying it while traipsing the woods. But yes, the 8mm has enough power to do the job.
 
Go to boxoftruth.com. Shotgun slugs penetrate comparable to buffalo hunting rounds. It should be plenty for bear.
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BoT test #3, a shotgun slug went through 12 sheetrock boards and bounced off a water jug. Another only barely penetrated. Test #4, a .45-70 hardcast round went through 12 boards of sheetrock, one water jug, two pine boards and a brick. The .45-70 round went through the BoT, the shotgun rounds were stopped. How is that comparable?

A .308 165 grain TAP round went through 12 sheetrock boards, a water jug, and bounced off a pine board. A South African 7.62 ball round went through all that, plus the first pine board and broke a brick. Both the .45-70 and .308/7.62 loads penetrated further than the slug, in construction material at least.
 
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What kind of slug? If it was an old-style foster, soft lead it isn't the right choice. We're talking about the hard-cast Brennake and the like.

Use the 8mm in a modern heavy load. Smaller, light bullets won't reliably reach deep enough and have enough terminal effect to do what you want them to, which is break the charge and/or disable the bear. You want a heavy, solid round that will penetrate to the vitals and hopefully break some bones on the way.

Brain shot or break the shoulder, that's the key.
 
How about mag extensions on shotguns for bear defense?

If you carry a shotgun for self defense in the woods, does it need to have a "hunting" magazine capacity?

In particular, my 870 HD is 6+1 with the factory mag extension. Is that more of a problem if I end up shooting a bear, or I'm just walking the woods with it? As opposed to a 5 shot?
 
Probably depends on location. Up here. if you have a shotgun with slugs or buck in the hills without duck accoutrement's there isn't a fish and game guy, state or fed. who'd give you any trouble.
 
Fella's & Krieghund;

Smart people don't 'saw off' shotgun barrels anymore. They buy the Remington Home Defense, or Mossie equivalent. Ipso-Doh! Everything's legal, short barrel, extended magazine & the basic reliability of a bucket of rocks.

Can the 8mm kill big bad bears? Yes. Is the rifle the way to go? Not if a shottie is available. As has been mentioned, rifles tend to be long & heavy. Not what you want to rapidly bring into action in close quarters. If you're 20 feet away from the tent, that rifle might just as well be on the moon. Yes, you might have time to get it, but to plan that you will? Bad planning.

A mini-14? No thank you. WAY no thank you very much.

Now then. Are you going to be out & about in Alaska? If not, then where? What kind of bears are inhabiting your particular neck of the woods?

If you're in reality going to meet something other than grizzly, polar, or Alaskan brown bears, get the good pepper spray, keep a regulation clean camp site, & use large doses of common sense. Do that & you'll be fine.

I live, hike, camp, & hunt in Montana bear country. Been there, done that.

900F
 
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