my first and last DPMS

[TexasPatriot.308]

the upper and lower are marked DPMS, I don't think anyone but the DPMS machinist had anything to do with anything else, unless some of you guys know how to alter them by making the magazine well out of spec or shrinking the built in picatinny rail out of spec too....

 

[JO JO]

the lower would still be stamped DPMS but to convert an A2 fixed stock to a collapsible stock some lower parts need to be changed out with the rifle mounted in a vise . The AR 15 is like lego blocks strips down way past field striping thats why there is so many mismatched home builds out there with brand name parts mixed in or altered. If you look at an AR parts list you will see different parts mounted to a same lower for the two different stocks, just info for
you may or may not be your issue please let us know what the smith says

 

[Deaf Smith]

I am a Colt owner. I have 3 Preban Colts. That said, last March Sports Warehouse ran a sale on the DPMS M 4 5.56 carbines. I bought one,it lives in my Jeep CJ.
It is a perfect little rifle. Well made and shoots and functions at -20 or 90+ clean or dirty.

I noticed at a pawn shop, in the glass display, a AR with a stainless 16 inch bbl and muzzle brake. Looked mint. Asked to see it and the first thing I noticed was it was tight. Bolt felt like greese was in it. Nice and slick. Had an off set BUIS and magpull furniture. Very good trigger. DPMS was the make. $500 the asking price. Bought it right there. Turned out to be a 3G2 competition model. Not a scratch on it. Even came with a P-Mag 30!

Shot very well on range. And yes, it's a keeper.

Deaf

 

[Dog Soldier]

I noticed at a pawn shop, in the glass display, a AR with a stainless 16 inch bbl and muzzle brake. Looked mint. Asked to see it and the first thing I noticed was it was tight. Bolt felt like greese was in it. Nice and slick. Had an off set BUIS and magpull furniture. Very good trigger. DPMS was the make. $500 the asking price. Bought it right there. Turned out to be a 3G2 competition model. Not a scratch on it. Even came with a P-Mag 30!

Shot very well on range. And yes, it's a keeper.



Deaf

Hey Deaf! What a buy. I am noticing AR-15 prices are dropping.It seems many dealers are stuck with too many. The slow oil market has many guys laid off. I expect the pawn shops have many coming out of pawn.
You did good my man.

 

[Deaf Smith]

Hey Deaf! What a buy. I am noticing AR-15 prices are dropping.It seems many dealers are stuck with too many. The slow oil market has many guys laid off. I expect the pawn shops have many coming out of pawn.
You did good my man.

So am I seeing prices drop. I haunt the paw shops. Tons of plastic pistols (Taurus, Glocks, Springfield Armories, etc.) But now and then a nice S&W six shooter or levergun.

Yes ARs do seem to be awfully plentiful. Even Colt made one's. I just feel it's kind of ridiculous to spend $1000+ on a rifle AND another $1000+ on optics!

I'm now bidding my time for an ACOG on that 3G2. Sooner or later I'll find one cheap.

Deaf

 

[Ibmikey]

A round stuck in the chamber is indicative of an incorrectly sized case and not a rifle problem, if you were shooting reloads the mystery is solved if factory ammo do all cases stick or is this the only one? It just seems like your ammo in this case is the problem.

 

[jmorris]

I don't think anyone but the DPMS machinist had anything to do with anything else,

These days "machinist" is a guy or gal that presses a button, more often than not. They should be doing some basic QC on the part(s) that just came out of the machine while its working on a fresh set. If they are performing that task they could have caught such things and compensated for the tool erosion, that as they get smaller would cut an internal dimension that is too small and an external dimension that is too large.
No matter how the product was made, a "bad" one getting out the door is the fault of the QC dept or lack of one.

 

[Dog Soldier]

So am I seeing prices drop. I haunt the paw shops. Tons of plastic pistols (Taurus, Glocks, Springfield Armories, etc.) But now and then a nice S&W six shooter or levergun.

Yes ARs do seem to be awfully plentiful. Even Colt made one's. I just feel it's kind of ridiculous to spend $1000+ on a rifle AND another $1000+ on optics!

I'm now bidding my time for an ACOG on that 3G2. Sooner or later I'll find one cheap.

Deaf

Yes, There are more bargains every week. The cost of reloading supplies are dropping as well. I am looking for a buy on an AR 10.

 

[MistWolf]

These days "machinist" is a guy or gal that presses a button, more often than not. They should be doing some basic QC on the part(s) that just came out of the machine while its working on a fresh set. If they are performing that task they could have caught such things and compensated for the tool erosion, that as they get smaller would cut an internal dimension that is too small and an external dimension that is too large.
No matter how the product was made, a "bad" one getting out the door is the fault of the QC dept or lack of one.

When the part comes out of the machine, it's too late for quality control. Quality control is in the hands of the person making the parts.

Assuring the proper processes were performed afterwards is the job of Quality Assurance. Quality can't be inspected into a part

Let me add that when a part is out of spec, that is a failure of Quality Control. When an out of spec part makes it out the door, that is a failure of Quality Assurance

 

[jmorris]

When the part comes out of the machine, it's too late for quality control.

I guess we are using different definitions.

noun: quality control

1. a system of maintaining standards in manufactured products by testing a sample of the output against the specification.

The machine that machined the part is also not going to be the last step in the process either. It might be tumbled for deburr or blasted before finishing, etc.

 

[MistWolf]

The point being, the person making the part, controls the quality, not the inspector. It's an important distinction both to the culture of the company and to the people who actually make the part.

If you tell the person who actually makes the part that the inspector is quality control, they'll let you know that the inspector does nothing but look at the part and finish the paperwork

 

[jmorris]

The point being, the person making the part, controls the quality, not the inspector.

I suppose if they are sculpting it by hand from clay. There are parts "scrapped" (or should be if caught) everyday all over the world because of one problem or another due to factors beyond any "operators" control, like raw material or tooling anomalys. If the person "making" the part is also tasked with the job of making sure it is within specifications (QC), then of course they control the quality that is moved on to the next step.

Like the guy at 3:27 in this video is not the one that cut the aluminum, mounted it to the fixture or pressed the buttons on the machine but is doing some very basic QC measurements.



Then there are other much more expensive and thorough post machining QC measured that can be taken as well like this AR upper.

 

[JO JO]

This rifle has been taken apart and modified the rifle is not in its DPMS factory build condition,the issues may not have anything to do with DPMS quality
I do not own a DPMS but whenever a factory product is altered or modified and has issues I keep an open mind as to the fault !
Has the OP returned and shared what the gunsmith said yet ?

 

[JO JO]

http://gundigest.com/how-to/gunsmithing/gunsmithing-the-ar-3-tips-for-buffers-recoil-springs

Here is a good read for the OP , it may give him some insight on how the buffer system works and different parts involved in the Rifle/Carbine stock and buffer system,
we don't know how or what his friend did to convert this rifle from a Factory build Rifle
to a carbine system and or if the rifle was damaged in the conversion.

 

[outlawjw]

I have two DPMS RIFLES & love both of them. I would have had to spend a lot more money to have gotten as good a guns as I got. 4 lb trigger crisp 1/2" groups or less most of the time , never a failure .

 

[ClickClickD'oh]

Replaced the stock and foreend and now the magwell is out of spec and the top rail is buggered?

Someone didn't use an action block and F'd the receiver.

Seen it happen too many times

I'm betting DPMS didn't screw the gun, bubba did.

 

[LoonWulf]

Lets see what his smith says. Im inclined to believe that the previous user likely caused the error as they modified the gun and if it wouldnt take a mag or properly chamber a round i dont think they would have messed with it.

That said things do happen, as do damage during shipping, or poor machining, last unit of they day/week kinda stuff. Id be surprised if an upper AND lower were both machined out of spec, and both got stuck together when being pulled off the parts rack, but it could happen....
another possibility is previous owner bought alot of dpms stuff found a couple pieces he didnt like/didnt work and just put them together into a "dump" build, just enought shiny the guy didnt need, to bring the price up on all the parts he didnt want. Ive seen that done with cars, paintball guns, and alot of stuff on craigslist actually.......

 

[JO JO]

c

Replaced the stock and foreend and now the magwell is out of spec and the top rail is buggered?

Someone didn't use an action block and F'd the receiver.

Seen it happen too many times

I'm betting DPMS didn't screw the gun, bubba did.

This is exactly what I have been saying !!
maybe the OP will return with updates

 

[JO JO]

another possibility is previous owner bought alot of dpms stuff found a couple pieces he didnt like/didnt work and just put them together into a "dump" build, just enought shiny the guy didnt need, to bring the price up on all the parts he didnt want

This too !!
I feel there is more to this rifles history then we know

 

[i loves my gun]

Never seen so much love for DPMS before. Every other place I've seen them mentioned they are always bracketed in the lower tier in regards to quality. Although, I guess you cant believe everything that you read and I have no personal experience with them.

 

[cdb1]

I don't know enough about AR's to tell the difference between high end and low end by just examining them. About the only thing I know to do is check to make sure the gas key is properly staked. I also know every low end(which is what my son and I have, a DPMS and Stag) AR I've fired or dry fired had a horrible trigger. First thing I did was order Timney's. I also don't get hot and bothered over a 1:7 twist, 1:9 works for anything I'm going too shoot. It also doesn't matter to me whether the upper, lower, middle, high or low is machined from billet, forged, cast or deep fried to a golden brown, and don't know how to tell the difference. I know it matters a lot to others though.

 

[Jackal]

DPMS is lower tier in the AR15 market. They also generally work perfectly well. I've had a few issues with DPMS rifles over the years. I've also had issues with a dozen other brands of rifles/pistol, many well respected. Every company ships a turd.

 

[ClickClickD'oh]

Every other place I've seen them mentioned they are always bracketed in the lower tier in regards to quality.

DPMS aren't low quality guns, they just don't have some of the features that other makes have. Most of those features aren't really important for people who aren't professionally stacking. The average guy who buys an AR and goes to the range to shoot it once a month or so is likely to never notice. They are good entry level ARs.

 

[Nuclear]

Back when ARs first started being used in non-traditional competitions, DPMS was one of the few companies that would build your rifle to order (I know, you build them yourself now) so they were very popular. They can't be too low of quality as a company, they started out providing parts to the US military.

I still have one, no problems that required a trip to a gunsmith, factory or even replacing parts.

 

[Jackal]

Back when ARs first started being used in non-traditional competitions, DPMS was one of the few companies that would build your rifle to order (I know, you build them yourself now) so they were very popular. They can't be too low of quality as a company, they started out providing parts to the US military.

I still have one, no problems that required a trip to a gunsmith, factory or even replacing parts.

I remember made to order AR's. Back before parts and tools were readily available and the internet was a phone call away.