My thoughts on OC Spray
- Thread starter mercop
- Start date
- Status
Another impact weapon that civilians can carry legally everywhere is a cane. In Canada you can take them anywhere, even on an airplane.
I have a stylish, hickory heart cane from Cane Masters (Mark Shuey). Not cheap but neither is the safetyof my family. It is a formidable baton. I have to learn how to limp a bit better
I have a stylish, hickory heart cane from Cane Masters (Mark Shuey). Not cheap but neither is the safetyof my family. It is a formidable baton. I have to learn how to limp a bit better
OC for Road Rage
I have been in at least once situation where a hostile individual got out of their car and came to my window, wanting to start a fight. This is usually a crazed individual who may or may not have tried to run you off the road, or may have followed you. I always thought OC would be a good tool in this situation. It isn't a situation where you can pull out your .40 S&W and shoot him dead on the street. How about rolling the window down half way and giving him a face full of OC, then driving off while he crawls around rubbing his eyes?
I have been in at least once situation where a hostile individual got out of their car and came to my window, wanting to start a fight. This is usually a crazed individual who may or may not have tried to run you off the road, or may have followed you. I always thought OC would be a good tool in this situation. It isn't a situation where you can pull out your .40 S&W and shoot him dead on the street. How about rolling the window down half way and giving him a face full of OC, then driving off while he crawls around rubbing his eyes?
I've been in law enforcement for over 21 yrs now, with 14yrs and 11 months spent working in a large jail prior to going out on the street (and yes I did actually enjoy it, kind of a sadist i guess), anyways I couldn't begin to guess how many times I was "spontaneously" attacked and I responded with pepper spray (10% solution), I will tell you it was more than once, and in both the spontaneous and the "prepared" responses it only failed once to assist me in subduing the "BG" and that was traced back to a bad batch from the factory (as we had several non-performance instances from that same case of spray).
Yes I do agree that you have to train in both the use (what reactions to expect from the "sprayee") and how to deal with the overspray (for when you and your partners get to experience it at the same time), but it is a great tool, when used properly.
I also feel that for someone who isn't prepared to, or wants to, carry a firearm it again is a lot better than nothing. Not everyone (civilian, or for those who want to be politically correct, non-law enforcement) can or is willing to train for impact weapons or empty handed defense. So as long as they are willing to realize that there is no "perfect weapon" and that it is a tool with limitations, I again think it can be a great option for them.
On a side note when I first started back in 1987 we used CS spray and that I found did have a lot of failures when using it on combative intoxicated (alcohol/narcotics) or mentally impared inmates. In the 90's we (the sheriff's dept) switched to the 10% pepper spray and the city P.D. switched to a 5%, with the city experiencing alot of failures (so much that when they brought in a combative inmate who they had sprayed they were still fighting, but when we hit them with ours they immdiately would cease, and it only took one time). Every time after that when they would return to our facility as soon as they entered into the Lock Up they stopped fighting. I couldn't tell you how many times I heard " I don't want any of that **it"
Yes I do agree that you have to train in both the use (what reactions to expect from the "sprayee") and how to deal with the overspray (for when you and your partners get to experience it at the same time), but it is a great tool, when used properly.
I also feel that for someone who isn't prepared to, or wants to, carry a firearm it again is a lot better than nothing. Not everyone (civilian, or for those who want to be politically correct, non-law enforcement) can or is willing to train for impact weapons or empty handed defense. So as long as they are willing to realize that there is no "perfect weapon" and that it is a tool with limitations, I again think it can be a great option for them.
On a side note when I first started back in 1987 we used CS spray and that I found did have a lot of failures when using it on combative intoxicated (alcohol/narcotics) or mentally impared inmates. In the 90's we (the sheriff's dept) switched to the 10% pepper spray and the city P.D. switched to a 5%, with the city experiencing alot of failures (so much that when they brought in a combative inmate who they had sprayed they were still fighting, but when we hit them with ours they immdiately would cease, and it only took one time). Every time after that when they would return to our facility as soon as they entered into the Lock Up they stopped fighting. I couldn't tell you how many times I heard " I don't want any of that **it"
ChCx2744
Member
- Joined
- Sep 12, 2008
- Messages
- 1,228
I agree. CS is not ANYWHERE close to nasty and vile as OC. We have to train with CS gas during Tactical Response Team excersizes (Riot Control for those non-LEO). OC is just flat out nasty. I do not doubt it's stopping power or effectiveness. Simply put, it is SO nasty to the point I do not want to become cross-contaminated with the stuff. I would rather switch to another UOF option than to use OC; and MANY LEO will vouch for this.
csmkersh
Member
What I don't like about CS is that it can settle in your clothes and be an aggrivation for several hours. And if your armpits or crotch is damp, a big aggrivation. I've had less problems regaining my eyesight with CS and with OC/capsaicin sprays.
mercop
Member.
Yeah, I hate getting sprayed with it like I hate stubbing my toe in the dark, but neither prevent me from fighting.
mercop
Member.
Good stuff, anyone that is carrying any type of spray should know how they will be affected by it under controlled circumstances.
I have used OC spray to assist a police officer who was being attacked. At the time I used Body Guard LE 10 in stream spray. The guy I sprayed was drunk, was mentally unfit to stand trial and was very large. The stream hit the guy square in the eyes and face. It worked great! They guys eyes were closed shut and he locked up and quit trying to throw punches.
The second incident I used the Counter Assault OC 10 Fogger pepper spray. It not only stopped the people fighting but it cleared out the bar parking lot.
Before I ever had to use OC spray I was about 13 when a group of about 8 older teenagers came out from behind a gas station and started yelling that they were going to jump me. As they started walking towards me I pulled out a can of Sabre Red and shook it in front of them. They said “he gots mace!" and went back to where they came from.
OC Spray is not 100% effective but it works about 80-90% of the time and it’s even more effective when Civilians use it because they use it to distract the assailant in order to buy seconds to run away. Most of the time you don’t even have to deploy the spray. Just the threat to use it stops most attacks.
Don’t buy a key ring canister. Key ring units empty about 11 grams of OC in 4 seconds while the larger police size canisters empty 60 grams in 6 seconds. With the 2 ounce can you will hose them down and have enough left over to stop multiple aggressors. You don’t see police packing little key ring units. Get in the habit of carrying it in hand when walking alone or in dangerous situations.
If you want something for the key chain get a Kubotan and learn how to use it. The Kubotan is one of the best tools to carry because it is universally legal and it can do some serious damage. It is also a visual deterrent because it tells an assailant that you are serious about defending yourself. For most people with little training it is easier to use the Kubotan as a handle and swipe at the eyes with the keys. You can also drive the end of the baton into the eyes, throat use it to escape a bear hug and choke hold or remove someone who has just grabbed the front of your clothing or arm.
Here is the best advice I have heard on OC sprays. http://www.corneredcat.com/Gear/pepperspray.aspx
I also keep this on my keys.
http://www.defensedevices.com/persuader-metal-aluminum-kubaton.html
This is my choice of OC Spray
http://www.defensedevices.com/fox-labs-pepper-spray-cone-fog.html
http://www.sabrered.com/servlet/the-template/LawEnforcement-dsh-OCCanisterReferenceGuide/Page
The second incident I used the Counter Assault OC 10 Fogger pepper spray. It not only stopped the people fighting but it cleared out the bar parking lot.
Before I ever had to use OC spray I was about 13 when a group of about 8 older teenagers came out from behind a gas station and started yelling that they were going to jump me. As they started walking towards me I pulled out a can of Sabre Red and shook it in front of them. They said “he gots mace!" and went back to where they came from.
OC Spray is not 100% effective but it works about 80-90% of the time and it’s even more effective when Civilians use it because they use it to distract the assailant in order to buy seconds to run away. Most of the time you don’t even have to deploy the spray. Just the threat to use it stops most attacks.
Don’t buy a key ring canister. Key ring units empty about 11 grams of OC in 4 seconds while the larger police size canisters empty 60 grams in 6 seconds. With the 2 ounce can you will hose them down and have enough left over to stop multiple aggressors. You don’t see police packing little key ring units. Get in the habit of carrying it in hand when walking alone or in dangerous situations.
If you want something for the key chain get a Kubotan and learn how to use it. The Kubotan is one of the best tools to carry because it is universally legal and it can do some serious damage. It is also a visual deterrent because it tells an assailant that you are serious about defending yourself. For most people with little training it is easier to use the Kubotan as a handle and swipe at the eyes with the keys. You can also drive the end of the baton into the eyes, throat use it to escape a bear hug and choke hold or remove someone who has just grabbed the front of your clothing or arm.
Here is the best advice I have heard on OC sprays. http://www.corneredcat.com/Gear/pepperspray.aspx
I also keep this on my keys.
http://www.defensedevices.com/persuader-metal-aluminum-kubaton.html
This is my choice of OC Spray
http://www.defensedevices.com/fox-labs-pepper-spray-cone-fog.html
http://www.sabrered.com/servlet/the-template/LawEnforcement-dsh-OCCanisterReferenceGuide/Page
nopardaid
Member
I've seen a lot of talk in here and I will just state for the record that I would rather be punched un-relentlessly for 60 seconds than to be pepper sprayed again.
Being OC'd was one of the worst experiences of my life and it dropped me and 50% of the class with the first shot, everyone else was severely incapacitated.
Being OC'd was one of the worst experiences of my life and it dropped me and 50% of the class with the first shot, everyone else was severely incapacitated.
- Status