New 1911 with optics - 45ACP or 10mm or 40S&W?
- Thread starter Derek Zeanah
- Start date
I haven't considered 38 Super since the first Colt I owned when it was still head spacing on the semi-rim. Surely they've addressed that short coming by now in production 1911s...used to be a custom thing to change head spacing to the mouth when competitors were loading them hot.
I think my favorite non-standard caliber from that time was the 356 TSW
benEzra
Moderator Emeritus
Do try shooting the irons in low light though, and make sure you can shoot them as well under challenging lighting conditions. Out-of-focus sights are a lot harder to see when dimly lit than when brightly lit.
I had an epiphany recently when I shot an IDPA-style night match at an indoor range, shooting my EDC from concealment. For background, I am 53, wear glasses, my corrected vision is 20/15 in one eye and 20/20 in the other, and I was shooting a 3913LS with tritium Novaks that are still usable but getting dim.
We shot the course once with the lights on (I did fine, all A-zone hits except for maybe one B), then again with the lights off except for some police strobes at one end of the range, and a personal light to illuminate the targets (I used my EDC Streamlight with a Harries hold, though some of the competitors actually had weapon-mounted lights).
In the low-light iteration, I still had A-zone hits on the close targets and even hit most of the bowling pins at 15-20 yards (it’s easy to see even a fuzzy, dimly-lit iron sight against white plastic), but there was one target at 10-15 yards shooting from a pitch dark corridor where my 53-year-old eyes absolutely could not pick up my black iron sights against the cardboard IDPA target illuminated only by my handheld light, even though I could see the target fine. Much to my chagrin, I had zero hits in the vital zones of that target even though I could hit a bowling pin from further away under the same conditions. (My shots were on the cardboard, but near the edges and one was actually in the nonscoring margin.)
That got me experimenting more after the match, and it dawned on me that there is a huge difference between how aging eyes see iron sights on a brightly-lit range, vs. how they see iron sights under less-than-ideal lighting. I could see the target plenty well enough to shoot, but not my sights well enough to aim if there was no ambient light on the sights or the target didn’t offer much contrast. I could not directly illuminate my sights with the handheld light without the backsplash off the gun obscuring the target. And I couldn’t see the sights silhouetted against the target because I couldn’t focus close enough with my distance prescription to make the sights out in light that dim against a non-contrasting target, even though the target itself was clear and in focus.
That realization finally pushed me toward the red-dot train, so I’m shopping for an optics-ready EDC now (probably a 365XL, but we’ll see).
My last night IDPA was long ago, but your concerns seem valid. I gather that the lighting was sufficient to ID the target, but not sufficient to use the iron sights. Do you think that the type of iron sights might have made a difference? I currently use fiber optic, non-tritium sites that are pretty good at picking up light in all, but the dimmest conditions.
We changed from ER to ED many years ago. Emergency Department, vs Emergency Room.Just so you know, I'm laughin' at ED . . . even if you meant to write ER.
chicharrones
needs more ammo
chicharrones
needs more ammo
I can't speak for @benEzra , but some replacement sights do help me in some conditions. Still not as easy to see as a red dot, but easier to learn than a red dot. https://www.thehighroad.org/index.php?threads/glock-night-sights-poll.926909/page-3#post-12812462
Howland937
Member
I definitely like 38 Super better, but I only own it in full size all-steel 1911. I have the same gun in 9mm and basically the same in .45. Also have commander size Dan Wesson in 9mm and carry an officer size SIG in .45.
I had an aluminum frame full size in 38 Super and hot loads were beating it to death. Switched to steel frame and all good. Just not for carrying. I know they made the DW Guardian in 38 Super too, and thought about converting mine from 9mm for carrying and not hot rodding.
Actually it does. If you poke it with something small, it'll just leak out. Something bigger and it'll fly around by air propulsion. Something really big and it'll deflate instantly. Though I don't know what round would cause a person to deflate instantly, I can only guess it's not suitable for carry.
1350 for a 124gr bullet (assuming 5" barrel) is just scratching the surface.Y'all had to mention 38 Super, didn't you?
I've been jonesing for a 357 Sig because I like the ballistics of 124 grain / 1450fps a lot. But it's expensive and maybe dying.
Then I saw this the other day from Dick Fairburn:
The Super 9s: Great for Self-Defense!
The HOT 9mm semi-auto cartridges can be excellent choices for self-defense, though few shooters choose them. From the old .38 Super to the Winchester 9x23mm...www.youtube.com
And I just looked at ammoseek and there's Buffalo Bore 38 Super rated at 1350fps with a 124gr bullet.
Decisions, decisions.
CapnMac
Member
It's been "Emergent Medicine" for several decades now.
(Emergent is the Latin adjective to give us "emergency" as a noun.)
CapnMac
Member
Well, yes, your Poll did not include "Yes, I want the one available today in the gun case" as a possible answer.
And, to the point, there are some striking examples of 38supers with outstanding damasquene work, both as engraving and inlay. More modern versions would probably respond to custom Cerekote to some good end.
LV Gun
Member
What a beautiful gunLove this .38 Super, and it has a red dot, but it's a bit big for carry.
Of course I could always have it cut for a reflex type red dot....................
View attachment 1193686
.38 Special
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I went through the same basic decision process a year or so ago, and went with the 10mm. I had been noting the uptick of mass shooters in body armor picking people off with rifles, so had a long think about concealable handguns which might allow for 50+ yard head shots. The optic was an obvious solution, and I chose the 10mm with the idea of using a light, fast, flat shooting bullet to help ease trajectory concerns.
That's obviously a pretty niche application, but there you go.
That's obviously a pretty niche application, but there you go.
Have you ever tried to make a head shot at that distance while under pressure...to say nothing about it likely being a moving target
Howland937
Member
I have enough trouble hitting stationary bowling pins at 25' quickly and consistently with the only pressure being the dude shooting against me.
Having never been shot in any manner, I've often wondered if a heavy projectile with decent energy would offer any advantage against body armor. Knowing it won't penetrate, but possibly have enough thump maybe buy a moment or two.
Test against body armor has shown it does not
.38 Special
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I have quite a bit of competition experience involving approximately head sized targets at 50 yards. Obviously that's not the same level of pressure as a gunfight, and no, they never moved. And frankly, I do not like my odds, if I ever have to go up against a rifleman with a handgun at 50+ yard ranges.
I like my odds even less with, say, an iron-sighted compact, though, so...
OP
OP
Well, I hate to disappoint but I changed direction.
I kept juggling this pistol (in various calibers), a discounted RMR ready custom 1911 in 9mm from Fusion (but I've already got a couple of steel 9mm commanders), and was struggling until...
So I'm sure I'll come back Stealth Arms later (in 10mm, 40S&W, or 38 Super), but for now, while I figure out the red dot stuff, I'll keep playing with them on the KDS9C (which I'm still unsure about - shoots great, but I really prefer a thinner grip) and this thing before I buy another optics ready pistol.
Thanks for all the advice.
I kept juggling this pistol (in various calibers), a discounted RMR ready custom 1911 in 9mm from Fusion (but I've already got a couple of steel 9mm commanders), and was struggling until...
- I found options that would allow me to send a 1911 slide off to have it converted for optics for a few hundred dollars. I'll hold off on that until I know a pistol mounted optic is for me, and I know what sort of optics I like. At that point I've got a bunch of candidates to send off.
- I realized the Alpha Foxtrot S15 exists, and the reviews appear to suggest they're reliable and shoot reasonably well for what they are. I've already got a spare Holosun I can put on it, it should fit my existing line of holsters (at least one ought to fit, anyway), it takes 15rd Glock compatible mags and is the thickness of a standard 1911 which really works for me. While I can shoot double-stack pistols well there's something about the size of a 1911 that just feels "right" in my hands - if the tip of my thumb isn't touching the first joint on my middle finger the pistol feels too bulky for me. Plus the flatness of the 1911 carries really well on my hip. This double-stack looks like it'll feel right.
So I'm sure I'll come back Stealth Arms later (in 10mm, 40S&W, or 38 Super), but for now, while I figure out the red dot stuff, I'll keep playing with them on the KDS9C (which I'm still unsure about - shoots great, but I really prefer a thinner grip) and this thing before I buy another optics ready pistol.
Thanks for all the advice.
Ooo, that's nice!
OP
OP
I've got one of the others on that page. It's a sweeeeeet shooting 1911. It's got maybe 200 rounds through it so far, and I wish it had a ramped barrel, but Fusion knows how to build nice pistols at a reasonable price.
Unfortunately, unlike some other 1911 makers, there appears to be a break-in period.
Unfortunately, unlike some other 1911 makers, there appears to be a break-in period.
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