New Kahr is very disappointing

[AlaskaErik]

I got a new Kahr PM40 to replace my unreliable NAA Guardian 380 because I had heard Kahr was a really good pistol. Well, I now have two unreliable pistols. I fired 250 rounds of FMJ to break the pistol in, using both the five and six round mags. During that time I must had about 15 instances where the round did not chamber properly. If I pulled back on the slide slightly and released it, the round would then enter the chamber, but the slide wouldn't go all the way forward without a push of my thumb. After I did that, the round would fire and eject just fine. Kahr says the pistol needs 200 rounds to break it in. Any ideas what might be causing this?

 

[cobb]

Man, I hate to say this, but good luck with that PM40. I got a PM9 when the first came out years ago and it has been a super pocket gun. My brother was so impressed with the PM9, he got one also, again, a super pocket gun.
So now the PM40's come out and I get one, nothing but problems. Two trips back to the factory, Kahr wouldn't pay for a third, but they did send me some replacement recoil spring assemblies, still would not chamber rounds all of the time. Finally unloaded it cheap to get rid of it, but my PM9 keeps right on chucking lead down range without a hitch.

 

[Alex45ACP]

Have you tried contacting Kahr about this? I remember hearing something about some of their guns being defective, and people had to ship them in to have a part replaced.

 

[timothy75]

Try some high quality ammo, Khars are high quality guns designed with minimal tolerences. Also you can try to strech the recoil spring a little and let relax overnight. Finally make sure you have a firm grip when you shoot and are not limp wristing it. If all that fails send it back and talk to someone in charge.

 

[Mixlesplick]

My Kahr K40 didn't want to fully chamber some ammo eitherl when I first got it. I second the suggestion to buy some high quality ammo. When I looked closely at the ammo I was using I noticed it had bulges in the some of the cases. I also put in a higher power recoil spring but it doesn't look like Wolff makes one for the PM40.

 

[Majic]

Being a lightweight pistol firing the .40SW cartridge are you using a firm grip?

 

[sgtb]

My K-40 occasionally will do the same thing and the slide will not go forward all the way on a fresh round. I have not tried a new recoil spring yet but have used good ammo, Federal Hydra-shocks in 180gr. I plan to try more ammo and a new spring before a trip to Kahr.

 

[AlaskaErik]

Thanks for the suggestions. I shot 50 rounds of UMC 180 gr, 50 rounds of American Eagle 155 gr, another 50 of the UMC, 50 rounds of PMC 180 gr and another 50 rounds of the UMC. No limp wristing for me. Most of my shooting is done in the Weaver stance. I haven't contacted Kahr yet. I'm going to try another 250 rounds when I get a chance, which will be in a few weeks.

 

[halvey]

I test drive a P40 once and had the same problem. It would shoot my lead practice ammo at all, but fed the Win SXT just fine.

Khars are high quality guns designed with minimal tolerences.

I don't understand why gun companies do this (Kahr, Kimber). They build CARRY guns tight. Build them loose or less tight. It makes no sense to have a gun that needs a break in period that one will carry. Any SD shooting with these guns will be at 10 yards or less anyway.

 

[TarpleyG]

Were your malfunctions during the first 200 rounds? I see you shot 250. Kahr states that their guns require a 200 round "break in" period. Are you using the same ammo or have you tried a few different brands? Clean it up, lube it (they like to be a little wetter than most IIRC), and try some factory ball ammo. If you are still having the same problem, then send it back. I have read that the .40 is not the same gun as the 9 in terms of reliability.

edit: I saw your reply. You are mixing it up a bit then. Try cleaning it and give it another go.

Greg

 

[Obiwan]

All the polymer Kahrs have been problematic

They eventually get it right, but being a beta tester for them can be expensive and aggravating

 

[PCRCCW]

Well in all honesty it sounds like a recoil spring issue. Giving the slide a "bump" on a new Kahr is very common, even with a good recoil spring most of the time.

The short slide design of the PM is also picky when new when it comes to bullet shape. My buddies MK 40 had problems with a recoil spring, yes a NIB gun and with Truncated bullets. A new recoil spring, polishing the feedramp and better ammo and hes had over 4000 rnds of trouble free operation.....

He's had to replace the recoil spring every 5-700 rnds but thats what Kahrs do....eat recoil springs. Major power in a short slide cycle will do that.

Shoot well

 

[honkeoki]

2 thoughts

I had a PM9 with similar problems. Take a look at these two possible causes:

1. Ammo -- I was using Wolf FMJ ammo which was a tiny bit longer than UMC. Long enough, it turns out, to sometimes brush the mag release just enough to cause feeding problems.

2. Magazine -- Some people have found 2 floor plates in their magazine (??). Others have found the spring installed upside down.

Best of luck in getting your issues straightened out.

 

[MICHAEL T]

I think I would ship both guns back to their factorys. Both are good pistols with good service departments. But I also wonder about limp wristing as both these weapons would be affected by that. I have a 3" 45 that If I don't give 110% attention each shot will have feeding problem. My full size no trouble.
Have you let other people shoot them to see if they have same trouble.
If after factory checks out still trouble ,might think about a good wheel gun.

 

[Gordon Fink]

Clean it up and try again. Like me, you may notice that the problem has vanished.

~G. Fink

 

[old_ironsights]

Kahr-knack

I reluctantly join the chorus of dissatisfied former Kahr owners.
I found both of mine to have H&K prices, but Llama dependability. I shoulda known better on the 2nd one, but I took it in trade anyway. :banghead:

The last one was a P-40, and God Bless Him, I found someone who traded me a G27 for it. Maybe you'll be that lucky!

 

[Mark13]

I have a K9. I found that the mag design lets the round nose-dive onto the feed ramp when chambering. Sometimes this causes enough drag to cause the slide to not fully close when I am hand-cycling the slide and don't retract the slide fully to the rear.

I polished the feed ramp with a dremel tool and jewelers compound until it was glass smooth, now I don't have any problems. Maybe yours is too rough and you are getting an exaggerated condition similar to mine?

I really like my K9 and accept the mag flaw I mentioned above because it's perfectly reliable cycling under recoil.

Kahr chambers are also tight it should get reliable the more you shoot it.

 

[wardog]

I had to send my PM9 back to the factory twice before it would reliably go fully into battery.

 

[AlaskaErik]

Mark13

I was wondering about the nose dive issue myself. I noticed that while the top round in the mag is angled with the top of the magazine, the rest of the rounds are more angled with the base plate. The result is a big gap between the top round and the rest of them. My other pistols don't have this gap. I'm going to give it a good cleaning and try again. If that doesn't work, I'll send it to Kahr. If that doesn't work, I'll try the fluff and buff on the feedramp. I still don't think limp wristing is an issue. I'm a pretty big guy and I hold that thing firmly.

 

[onerifle]

Could be a number of things. The PM40's have always seemed iffy;but most of the bugs appear to have been worked out of the polymer 9's. My PM9 rocks.

Call customer service- ask for Stefan. He'll get you squared away.

 

[perrytrails]

My Pm9 and P9 will do the same nose dive into the feed ramp, if you try to sling shot the slide on the first round. The manual says, even though its against what many were taught to do, load mag with slide locked back, and use the slide release to load the first round. Some people don't like this method, but it is what Kahr recommends in the manual. Both of my pistols work flawlessly using the method Kahr states. Both are well over the 2000 rd mark. Maybe I'm lucky.

 

[jetman]

I had a PM9 I ran about 500 rounds through and after it's initial 100 rounds or so worked FLAWLESSLY with name branded ammo. I sold it to buy my PM40 and it is every bit as reliable/accurate as my PM9 was. I've got about 300 rounds through it using Winchester White box and American Eagle with great success. Then I stepped up to the Speer GOld Dot I've been shooting/carrying in it.

The ONLY issues I had with it AT ALL was when I installed the Pearce Grip Extension on the factory 5 round mag. The mag would release itself at least once (of the 5 rounds loaded) each time it was loaded, after a shot. The slide would cycle but with the mag dropped down slightly it wouldn't pick up the next round on the top of the mag. I took off the grip extension and it's back to 100% again!! STRANGE

 

[fastbolt]

I agree with many of the statements and sentiments expressed so far ...

Kahr's go through recoil springs pretty quickly if you shoot often. Follow the factory recommendation on how frequently to replace them, especially with the .40 S&W.

Kahrs seem to like sufficient lubrication, liberally sufficient.

Reduced slide mass, increased slide velocities, short slide travel and a high pressure, hard recoiling caliber ... and then, you're adding a polymer frame to the mix. Don't mistake that using a Weaver 2-handed shooting grip will completely prevent a grip stability issue from being involved. Granted, it's less likely when shooting 2-handed, but I've seen some folks manage to carry it off. Lock your dominant wrist & forearm.

A lot of Kahr owners seem to experience functioning issues until they're past the 200-round minimum break-in period. Big surprise that Kahr recommends a break-in period, huh?

Although, I helped a follow break in his MK40 last year, and his pistol exhibited no functioning issues right out of the box. He brought it to the range still NIB, unfired, to qualify with it as a Secondary & off-duty weapon.

The range was pretty slow at the time, so I offered him the time and free ammunition to fire approx 150-200 rounds, including a qualification string, if he was interested. He was ... and between him & I, we 'broke in' his MK40. Snappy little pistol, and that's with the steel frame, too. As I recall we were shooting mostly Remington Express 180gr JHP's at the time, which have a rather large nose cavity, but his MK40 ran through all of the rounds without a single malfunction. None at all.

The next time I saw him, for another qualification, he said his MK40 was still functioning perfectly reliably, but he was having issues with recovery and controllability ... one hell of an anticipatory flinch ... apparently caused by the .40 S&W caliber in the small pistol. Personally, I find the G27 to have better controllability, for me, than the all-steel MK40. Odd, but there it is ... I'd have no interest in a MK40, myself. I've borrowed a K40 that was much better, overall, except for the weight. It's always something, you know?

I've seen a couple of Kahr polymer .40 S&W's come through the range. One of them was a PM40, I believe, and the owner said his pistol had been functioning fine. It exhibited no problems as he completed the course of fire. We didn't have time to discuss his experiences since first buying the pistol, though, so I have no idea how it functioned for him when it was new.

The other one was a P40, and the owner said it was good pistol, and he liked it ... but that it malfunctioned a lot. He demonstrated that tendency on the range, too. I suggested he return it to Kahr for examination, repair or whatever ...

Clean your PM40, lubricate it well, lock your shooting wrist & forearm ... and try another 100-200 rounds of quality ammunition. If you still have functional reliability issues, beyond the 'break-in' period, call Kahr.

Of course, you do realize that once you've fired enough rounds to have confidence in it, it's probably going to be time to replace the recoil spring, right?

Let us know what happens. Call Kahr anyway, and see what they say. At least let them know that you've exceeded their recommended 'break-in' round count and still have some potential concerns.

 

[Ford]

I am starting to read about a lot of people having problems with the PM series lately. I am sad to see it.
I have put 400-500 rounds through my PM9 without a problem. It is the only non 1911 type pistol that I have ever just fallen in love with.
I have not seen any wear on the frame. No FTF's, FTE's etc..
I am getting ready to trade off my Kimber Tactical Ultra that I keep in my truck and get another PM9.

 

[..]

I had the same problems you did with two different Kahr PM9's. Too finicky for me to trust.