New Springfield EMP!
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XLMiguel
Member
I picked one up two weeks ago. I put 200 rnds of FMJ (115 gr WWB, S&B, Am Eagle) and a bout 50 rnds of assorted JHP (including Rem 124 gr +P and Fed 147 gr PD), all without a single FTF/FTE, it just ran. The short sight radius takes a bit of getting used to, but my groups tightened up as the session went on. It's a very controlable little gun, sweet trigger, and I like being able to get all my fingers on the grip (I have big hands). So far, so good, looks like a real keeper.
carnaby
Member
I just put the first 100 rounds through my EMP without a hiccup. Excellent accuracy, great feel, and super easy to conceal. Label me happy. 
Wild Deuce
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Don't have all my totals in yet but we're approaching the 500 round count without failures of any kind. Last 100 or so rounds have all been HP defensive ammo ... Black Hills, Hornady TAP, Speer GDHP and Remington Golden Sabre .... all 124 grain except for the Golden Sabres (147 gr). No +P ammo per SA recommendations. The pistol is now tightened up and shooting consistent groupings. Will post pics over the weekend.
brownie0486
Member
Bought an EMP yesterday.
Went to the range today, 300 rds later here's the report on mine.
Rd 32 failed to feed fully, a tap on the slide sent it into battery.
The rest before and after of the 300 rds of ball ammo worked flawlessly.
The mags did not lock the slide back on the last rd until 3 loading of each, then they worked as designed locking the slide on the last round.
I shot at 10 yrds for group on the first 50 rds. Two mags inside 2" at 30 feet, most of them inside 1.4 inches. They shot to POA, not high, low or left and right.
Fired the last 100 rapid fire, the gun worked flawlessly as well.
Threw some Win Ranger 147 loads into two mags, they feed, extract and lock the slide back with no problems.
I tore it down before firing the gun, dremel polished the feed ramp to mirror smooth, lubed the hell out of it with gun slick on the rails, end of barrel, locking lugs, etc. Got home and cleaned and relubed it.
It's good to go, and I have no quams about carrying it.
It's a keeper, runs fine and puts em where I want em.
Brownie
Went to the range today, 300 rds later here's the report on mine.
Rd 32 failed to feed fully, a tap on the slide sent it into battery.
The rest before and after of the 300 rds of ball ammo worked flawlessly.
The mags did not lock the slide back on the last rd until 3 loading of each, then they worked as designed locking the slide on the last round.
I shot at 10 yrds for group on the first 50 rds. Two mags inside 2" at 30 feet, most of them inside 1.4 inches. They shot to POA, not high, low or left and right.
Fired the last 100 rapid fire, the gun worked flawlessly as well.
Threw some Win Ranger 147 loads into two mags, they feed, extract and lock the slide back with no problems.
I tore it down before firing the gun, dremel polished the feed ramp to mirror smooth, lubed the hell out of it with gun slick on the rails, end of barrel, locking lugs, etc. Got home and cleaned and relubed it.
It's good to go, and I have no quams about carrying it.
It's a keeper, runs fine and puts em where I want em.
Brownie
Fistful Of Steel
Member
Good report!
Anyone try any 105gr Federal Premium Personal Defense Low Recoil Expanding FMJ in the EMP? I'm thinking about trying it and assuming it feeds, carrying it concealed.
Anyone try any 105gr Federal Premium Personal Defense Low Recoil Expanding FMJ in the EMP? I'm thinking about trying it and assuming it feeds, carrying it concealed.
brownie0486
Member
I have an IWB for a 4 inch 1911 that it slips into just fine, but the leather being a little longer at the muzzle.
I tried the OWB holster I had made for my g26 and it fits perfectly, though a little loose [ which is fine with me as it comes up and out with speed ]. This is the holster I'll carry it in for now.
Leaving for the Knoxville area on the bike [ 1820 miles ] this Monday for a 9 day IFTS class I'm putting on and the EMP is going along for the ride with an extra mag or two.
Brownie
I tried the OWB holster I had made for my g26 and it fits perfectly, though a little loose [ which is fine with me as it comes up and out with speed ]. This is the holster I'll carry it in for now.
Leaving for the Knoxville area on the bike [ 1820 miles ] this Monday for a 9 day IFTS class I'm putting on and the EMP is going along for the ride with an extra mag or two.
Brownie
Fistful Of Steel
Member
I ordered this holster last month for mine http://www.bulmangunleather.com/pdl.html
Is it safe to say that one needs to order this pistol from SA direct, with the full reliability package? How much did that reliability package cost you Wild Deuce? For a pistol costing a grand, SA really ought to consider just throwing that 'lil old reliability package in with the stock gun
Looks like a sweet gun though, but based on the reports I don't know if I'd buy it without the total reliability package at this point.
Wild Deuce
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Hmmm .... embarassed to say how much it ended up costing me. I'll cut and paste my reply to a similar inquiry earlier (via PM) .....
Final addendum: Took the pistol to a night shoot class two weekends ago. Put over four hundred rounds through the pistol. It was a fair mix of Winchester WB ammo (124 grain) and Remington UMC (147 grain). Also put 50 rounds of Remington Golden Saber (147 grain) and 50 rounds of Speer Gold Dot HP (124 grain). Not one malfunction. The accuracy is phenomenal at 50 feet. From a sandbag rest with 15 rounds, punched out an oval ragged hole about 2.5-3 inches wide and 1.5 inches high with 3 flyers (one from each magazine) crowning the whole thing. I think this pistol is more accurate than I can shoot. It's my wife's favorite ... now she's leaving my Kimber alone. The only remaining issue is that SA doesn't recommend +P ammo. I had an instructor that was intimately involved with testing this pistol for SA, tell me that they only say that for liability reasons. He said the pistol CAN handle the +P loadings and HIGHLY recommends any 124gr or 115gr +p HP ... particularly the Speer GDHP 124gr Short Barrel ammo. He says any +P+ (or higher) loadings will lock up the pistol (whatever that means). I would like to hear from others that ARE putting +P ammo through their EMP's ... how's it holding up? how's it functioning? chronograph comparisons for 124gr regular pressure vs. 124gr +P.
I'll shut up now.
Wild Deuce, thanks very much for the very detailed response and report..darn, if it wasn't so expensive I'd probably go for it with the reliability package! But shame on SA for not providing what I would think should be a basic and standard level of workmanship so that the gun wouldn't require hundreds of dollars more to work the way it should to begin with!
longeyes
member
A "reliability package" that costs as much as a new Glock 19???
Cripes.
Cripes.
My mother's EMP has (supposedly) begun running with some regularity in FMJ now. I need to get her to purchase some defensive ammo to test those rounds, it was an early model and I suspect it may suffers from the barrel issues.
Wild Deuce
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To be fair, please note that I had the front strap and underside of trigger checkered. This also required that the frame be refinished in their "Armory Kote" finish. I also had the ILS removed, a trigger job performed and I ordered six extra magazines. All these items together probably accounted for more than half of the added cost. None of them had anything to do with the reliability. Still, it did hurt the pocket book ..... "cripes" is right.
Milfslapper
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- Jun 5, 2007
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New EMP initial dissapointment
Just took my new EMP to the range. The magazine is extremely hard to get in. You either have to depress the release or hammer it with a sharp hard blow. My Kimbers just slide right in. Secondly, I had numerous jams where the slide would not close completely. It improved some after 500 rounds but still happens. I will be trying different rounds to see if that improves. Right now I have no faith in the EMP as a carry piece. I'll post results of different rounds and check to see if any one particular magazine has more jams.
Just took my new EMP to the range. The magazine is extremely hard to get in. You either have to depress the release or hammer it with a sharp hard blow. My Kimbers just slide right in. Secondly, I had numerous jams where the slide would not close completely. It improved some after 500 rounds but still happens. I will be trying different rounds to see if that improves. Right now I have no faith in the EMP as a carry piece. I'll post results of different rounds and check to see if any one particular magazine has more jams.
brownie0486
Member
Milfslapper,
Your chamber is likely one that was made too tight, it's been an issue with some of the EMP's to date. It goes back to SA and they ream the chamber to specs. It's a PITA to have to send it back, but thats the solution nonetheless.
Have them also check the weapon over completely to include the trigger bow, you'll find that the bow is causing the mags to have difficulty being inserted.
You'll get it back and it will run just fine. Reports such as yours have been mentioned everywhere and the above solutions by SA have been noted. The sooner you send it back the sooner you'll have yourself a reliable compact 9mm.
Mine is in the mid 2400 serial range and has been flawless from day one with the only issue of rd 32 not allowing the slide to go fully into battery. When I bought it, I understood the issues I might have such as yourself and bought one anyway knowing it would be made right if I got one that needed some work, but I lucked out.
Brownie
Your chamber is likely one that was made too tight, it's been an issue with some of the EMP's to date. It goes back to SA and they ream the chamber to specs. It's a PITA to have to send it back, but thats the solution nonetheless.
Have them also check the weapon over completely to include the trigger bow, you'll find that the bow is causing the mags to have difficulty being inserted.
You'll get it back and it will run just fine. Reports such as yours have been mentioned everywhere and the above solutions by SA have been noted. The sooner you send it back the sooner you'll have yourself a reliable compact 9mm.
Mine is in the mid 2400 serial range and has been flawless from day one with the only issue of rd 32 not allowing the slide to go fully into battery. When I bought it, I understood the issues I might have such as yourself and bought one anyway knowing it would be made right if I got one that needed some work, but I lucked out.
Brownie
Milfslapper
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EMP
Thanks for the insights Brownie. When I called SA the gal in Customer service suggested I try different ammo and that the magazines were supposed to be that hard to insert. I'll call back tomorrow and get it sent in. Thanks again.
Thanks for the insights Brownie. When I called SA the gal in Customer service suggested I try different ammo and that the magazines were supposed to be that hard to insert. I'll call back tomorrow and get it sent in. Thanks again.
brownie0486
Member
Milfslapper,
My mags meet some resistance ocassionally as well, but not enough to worry about them. From owning 1911's and having them worked on with a problem here or there, the trigger bow is the culprit to the resistance you are experiencing and need to "fitted" properly to avoid that problem on those types of platforms. If you hit the mag release button while inserting the mag, it will fall in with ease.
I don't believe the mags should be hard to insert, nor do I think the problem of FT feeds repeatedly is ammo related. Both are issues that can be corrected and the tight chamber problems with feeding is a known issue as I mentioned above.
You are welcome sir. Let us know when you get it back, it shoudl run like a top.
Brownie
My mags meet some resistance ocassionally as well, but not enough to worry about them. From owning 1911's and having them worked on with a problem here or there, the trigger bow is the culprit to the resistance you are experiencing and need to "fitted" properly to avoid that problem on those types of platforms. If you hit the mag release button while inserting the mag, it will fall in with ease.
I don't believe the mags should be hard to insert, nor do I think the problem of FT feeds repeatedly is ammo related. Both are issues that can be corrected and the tight chamber problems with feeding is a known issue as I mentioned above.
You are welcome sir. Let us know when you get it back, it shoudl run like a top.
Brownie
stogiegila
Member
Not to start a war or anything, but as much as I like the look and feel of the EMP, I would find it unacceptable to have to go through so much breaking in, and service work on a gun that has over a $1,000 price tag.
To me (a total novice) this is just unacceptable, when I consider that my G26 which isn't much bigger worked flawlessly from day one with any ammo I fed it for less than half the cost.
Why should a gun need a break in period? I love the look of the EMP, but I won't part with my hard earned money until they start making them correctly without having to send them back. I would have thought that guns in this price range would have a higher level of quality control and that the gun would be delivered to the store in perfect working condition. What do you get for the extra cost?
To me (a total novice) this is just unacceptable, when I consider that my G26 which isn't much bigger worked flawlessly from day one with any ammo I fed it for less than half the cost.
Why should a gun need a break in period? I love the look of the EMP, but I won't part with my hard earned money until they start making them correctly without having to send them back. I would have thought that guns in this price range would have a higher level of quality control and that the gun would be delivered to the store in perfect working condition. What do you get for the extra cost?
Boarhunter
Member
stogiegila,
Though not necessarily disagreeing with the positions you take regarding the EMP, I would offer a couple of comments.
First, the necessity for a break-in period is not limited to the EMP; in fact, many semi-automatic firearms (particularly those tightly fitted) require a break-in period of some duration. Most "experts" recommend that no gun be carried for self-defense without first running a few hundred rounds through it to seat the parts and ensure reliability. And I agree.
Second, my EMP was one of the earliest manufactured (serial number in the early 4XX range), and I had no problems with it following a brief "break-in" period. But since so many of the early guns did have reliability issues, my guess is that Springfield has "tweaked" the process to eliminate those problems. There does not seem to be as many complaints on more recent guns than there were with the earliest guns.
Finally, there is no reason you should give up a Glock for an EMP, if that is your preference. And whether the gun is worth the money is a decision each person makes for himself. As for me, I like and own Glocks, but I am also a great fan of the 1911 and own many of them, including the EMP. And it is worth every penny. To me. It is one of my favorites. Whether it is worth it to you is a decision you would need to make. But there is no right or wrong answer to that question.
Boarhunter
Though not necessarily disagreeing with the positions you take regarding the EMP, I would offer a couple of comments.
First, the necessity for a break-in period is not limited to the EMP; in fact, many semi-automatic firearms (particularly those tightly fitted) require a break-in period of some duration. Most "experts" recommend that no gun be carried for self-defense without first running a few hundred rounds through it to seat the parts and ensure reliability. And I agree.
Second, my EMP was one of the earliest manufactured (serial number in the early 4XX range), and I had no problems with it following a brief "break-in" period. But since so many of the early guns did have reliability issues, my guess is that Springfield has "tweaked" the process to eliminate those problems. There does not seem to be as many complaints on more recent guns than there were with the earliest guns.
Finally, there is no reason you should give up a Glock for an EMP, if that is your preference. And whether the gun is worth the money is a decision each person makes for himself. As for me, I like and own Glocks, but I am also a great fan of the 1911 and own many of them, including the EMP. And it is worth every penny. To me. It is one of my favorites. Whether it is worth it to you is a decision you would need to make. But there is no right or wrong answer to that question.
Boarhunter
fletcher
Member
I could see breaking it in to confirm that a gun is reliable, but I wouldn't think it would make it reliable. Is there any evidence to support that a break-in increases reliability?
i don't think there was any inference that breaking in a gun would increase reliability. the break-in is just to seat parts and detect any flaws
i could see your concern if you were asked to pay $1k for a glock, but the 1911 platform is a completely different animal. when you consider all the design work that went into the EMP, i'm was surprised they were able to hold the price where they did...it must be modern manufacturing.
i was trying to explain, on another forum, the culture of the the 1911...why folks add so much stuff to them after the purchase...and likened it to a small block chevy (old school) or honda civic (new school), where you buy the basic platform and then personalize it. $1k is pretty basic for a working 1911...i just found my ultimate production 1911 for $2600
Are you referring to 1911s in particular or weapons in general? While I don't care for Condition 2 in 1911s personally, other weapons (the original Beretta 92 and the CZ-75 are prime examples) are intended for use with that method and dont' have decockers. Lowering a hammer is relatively simple and safe if done properly.
stogiegila
Member
Boarhunter,
I understand your point. I have always loved the look of the 1911 platform, and actually owned two of them (a SA GI, and S&W Commander). However, I sold both just because I felt the gun was too big for me, especially for carrying purposes. However, both of these guns ran flawlessly from day one and were much less expensive than the EMP. The S&W, cost me $800, so it was close.
I guess, my big question is understanding the high cost of this platform in general and why it wouldn't come ready to perform right out of the box. To send the gun back to SA for their reliability package at an extra cost, IMHO means that they are charging you more for them to correct what should have been done in the first place.
No disrepect to 1911 lovers, but of all the threads I have read regarding reliability and finicky ammo choices, they predominently seem to be around the 1911 platform (or a variation of one). For a gun that has been around for so long, it seems odd that they can't be mass produced reliably in this day and age, especially when the cost of them is factored in.
Now having said that, remember I've owned two 1911s so far. I love the feel of the gun, the trigger and the look and will definitely get one that's smaller in size down the road. It just frightens me to pay that price and then have to go through hoops before it functions as designed.
I understand your point. I have always loved the look of the 1911 platform, and actually owned two of them (a SA GI, and S&W Commander). However, I sold both just because I felt the gun was too big for me, especially for carrying purposes. However, both of these guns ran flawlessly from day one and were much less expensive than the EMP. The S&W, cost me $800, so it was close.
I guess, my big question is understanding the high cost of this platform in general and why it wouldn't come ready to perform right out of the box. To send the gun back to SA for their reliability package at an extra cost, IMHO means that they are charging you more for them to correct what should have been done in the first place.
No disrepect to 1911 lovers, but of all the threads I have read regarding reliability and finicky ammo choices, they predominently seem to be around the 1911 platform (or a variation of one). For a gun that has been around for so long, it seems odd that they can't be mass produced reliably in this day and age, especially when the cost of them is factored in.
Now having said that, remember I've owned two 1911s so far. I love the feel of the gun, the trigger and the look and will definitely get one that's smaller in size down the road. It just frightens me to pay that price and then have to go through hoops before it functions as designed.
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