New to reloading: .44 magnum

[sequins]

Hello friends,

I'm just getting into reloading and the first cartridge I want to reload is going to be the legendary .44 magnum. I estimate my savings will be extraordinary by loading .44 magnum myself, and I can load more accurate cartridges with heavier loads as a bonus.

I've done some research on the various accoutrements for reloading and have some equipment on the way, but I now need to decide what components I want to order and ultimately assemble. Based on my readings I've wound up with more questions than answers and I'm hoping this forum can help set me straight. Here are a few of my questions:

- How important is using the exact primer from a given recipe? For example, if the recipe calls for a "CCI 300 large pistol primer" can I use a Sellior & Bellot large pistol primer in it's place? What about magnum vs. standard? Based on what I've read using "whatever primer is most affordable" is not advised by anyone but is generally done by just about everyone. I am partially reloading to reduce cost so I'm interested in using whatever brand of primer is most affordable (or on sale) if I can get away with that- What say you?

- How important is using the exact bullet from a given recipe? For example, if I have a recipe in my Lee loading manual that says "240 grain jacketed bullet" with no further elaboration what bullet are those recipes referring to? Obviously lead vs. jacketed is a substantial difference that requires different loads, but what about jsp vs. jhp? Could I use the same "240 grain jacketed bullet" load for either bullet type that I got a better deal on bulk?

- Is "Copper plated" it's own thing, or should I be using lead loads, or "light" jacketed loads, or what? I can get copper jacketed rounds (diameter .429) or exposed lead rounds (diameter .431), and then just to make things interesting I can get copper plated rounds which have special loads in some manuals, no specific loads in others, and which are advised for "low velocity" from their manufacturer

- All the "jacketed" rounds I've seen have been .429, except for one set of JSP .431 rounds sold from Everglades Ammunition. What's the deal with .431 JSP? Why is jacketed ammo traditionally .429 while lead is .431, with plated at .430 or .431? Is .431 JSP safe to fire in my Redhawk revolver, and can I load it to the high velocity high pressure loads I aspire to in my manuals?

Sorry for all the questions but I figured if I get an answer to even a few of these bullets I'll know a lot more than I did before. Happy New Years everyone!

 

[Jack B.]

I'm sure you will get a lot more advise from others but as far as primers go I only use Winchester Large Pistol Primers in my 44 Magnums that way it eliminates the question as to weather one needs magnum or non magnum primers. Also I've never used .431 jacketed bullets only .429 &.430. I've never seen a recommendation for.431 jacketed bullets only lead. If you are planning on loading to max pressures I'd stay away from lead and plated bullets. Sorry I wasn't more help.

 

[243winxb]

Primer- some powders like 296 will need a magnum primer. The WLP will work for all powders. All ball powderS need a magnum primer. IMO.

Bullet- pick a bullet that fits the use. Humting vs target can be very different.

Bullet diameter- jacketed from .429" .4295" and .430" are available from major manufactures. To me, jacketed diameter means little. Use a starting load and work up with the bullet of your choice.
Lead bullet diameter should be picked to work best with firearm. Cast lswc's at .430" have worked well for me in many revolvers.

No experence with plated.

 

[drband]

I use coated lead bullets for light special loads (Unique) and full magnum loads (W296) with no issues. They are sized @ .430 but run a little larger.
Enjoy your .44!

 

[murf]

happy new year to you, too!

if you want accurate rounds:

make them all the same: same bullet, same primer, same case manufacturer (starline for accuracy), fully size the case to prevent a base bulge, at least .004" neck/bullet tension, same crimp (heavy (trim to same length if necessary)), seat and crimp in separate steps.

ask a lot of questions.

match the primer to the powder.

exact recipe with a bullet? not so much.

copper plated is its own thing depending on thickness and plating process. each manufacturer should tell which load data to use with their bullets. if not, ask here. some bullets have thin plating and require low velocity lead load data. again, keep asking questions.

the varied bullet diameters don't matter much. just start low on the reloading chart and work up.

work up to those "high velocity high pressure loads" and be patient, imo.

luck,

murf

 

[Axis II]

44 rifle or handgun? For rifle my manuals say .430 for jacketed and .431 for lead. In handgun section it says .429 for jacketed. https://www.thehighroad.org/index.php?threads/429-vs-430-dia-for-jacketed-44-mag.538019/

I would watch for Winchester or cci primers on sale i'm not a fan of S&B. I've had too many issues with small pistol primers.

Plated bullets you use lead or light jacketed data. Plated manufactures will list their max velocity so start at min and workup for accuracy, pressure and try not to go over the manufactures velocity.

JSP VS JHP-doesn't matter as long as the weight is the same for the data in the book.

You asked how important the bullet weight is for a given recipe? Its very important because you cant use say 23gr of one powder for say a 240gr bullet and then change to a 300gr bullet and use the same. Always follow the books data for the bullet weight or make/model.

 

[FROGO207]

All good advise so far. The jacketed bullets are the easiest to get to shoot accurately (at first). You need to get a handle on this before jumping to lead IMHO. Be advised that the OAL (over all length) of JSP will be different than JHP for ammo that will produce the same pressure. The hollow point will make the bullet longer so if you were to use the same OAL it would be pushed into the case more and produce a higher pressure. You will be crimping into the crimp groove anyway but be mindfull of where that is with respect to the bullet base for pressure reasons. That is why I work up a different load for each bullet I use. Some revolvers have cylinder throats that are smaller than the barrel bore diameter this will produce excessive leading when loading with lead bullets as they will not expand enough to seal out the hot gasses that melt the lead and cause leading. That is something to check before you start reloading/shooting lead in a revolver IMHO. Slugging the barrel and all cylinders will tell you what you need to do. I have several Ruger revolvers and I have had to ream at least one of the throats on all of them FWIW. Primer brand does not matter to me so much as I cannot shoot the difference between them but do use Mag primers where indicated. Ask the manufacturer what type of data they want you to use for plated as a best answer. If you are like me any savings I get will be translated into more lead down range and a bigger smile.

 

[Walkalong]

Based on what I've read using "whatever primer is most affordable" is not advised by anyone but is generally done by just about everyone.

I had to grin a little bit on that one. In pistol loads primers are somewhat interchangeable. One more reason to start low and work up though. I don't load many max loads, so I don't worry much if I change primers, I just check numbers and accuracy first before loading a lot of them. (Well, usually.)

Some powders need magnum primers. If the data uses one, use one, if it doesn't, don't. That said, occasionally you will need a mag primer when they don't call for one in the data, and then there is the Winchester LP primer which they say is good for both.


In general, yes, you can use another brand bullet if it matches weight and type. A cup and core 240 Gr JHP? Yes, you can use another 240 Gr cup and core JHP or JSP. Gold Dots which are heavily plated are a bit different, and often have their own data, but you can use them if you start low and work up carefully.

Plated bullets are not lead and not jacketed. The loading suggestions for them has changed over the years even from the plated bullet makers. Note dates on/in posts
Plated Link 1

Plated Link 2

Plated Link 3


In general jacketed bullets for .44 Mag are .429 to match the caliber (It's not a .44, it's a .429). Lead needs to be a hair over groove diameter so they are generally .430. That said, there are .430 jacketed bullets out there, and yes, they are safe to use. And lead can be had larger than .430 as well. Lead should match the revolver throats and the throats should be over groove diameter. That is a whole nother discussion. Overall though most guns shoot .430 lead fine and .429 jacketed fine.


What powder and bullets do you have in mind?

 

[quaid]

I use coated lead bullets for light special loads (Unique) and full magnum loads (W296) with no issues. They are sized @ .430 but run a little larger.
Enjoy your .44!

I would skip copper plated in favor of the coated (e.g. Hitek type powder coatings, Missouri bullet company has a nice selection). Nice crimp grooves available in the coated lead bullets.

I have pushed MBC's coated bullets to full 44 mag velocities out of my 44 lever rifle, and they would work fine for special or light loads.

 

[buck460XVR]

Reloading for .44 mag is one of the easiest cartridges to master and one of the most rewarding to reload. As for primers, specific brands are not really that important for .44 mag and recipes should not have to be adjusted if one is not using the same brand as specified in the recipe. While one can safely interchange Magnum and Standard primers in a larger capacity case like .44 mag(even with H110/W296), Inexperienced reloaders should stick to what the recipe calls for. Another suggestion I have for new reloaders is to stick with jacketed bullets from reputable manufacturers. While they do not give one the most savings, they are the easiest to have success with as far as accuracy and crimp. Jacketed also are not affected by bore and throat diameters like lead and will not foul ones barrel(generally) if the bore/throats are not perfectly matched to bullet diameter. Plated/coated bullets while easier to have success with than plain lead, are more prone to crimp error. Once one has consistent success with jacketed, it's much easier to understand and relate to the differences one experiences from lead and plated. Like most things in life when first starting out one needs to use the KISS approach.......keep it simple stupid. Do not start at max, compare recipes from more than one source(published sources, not the random internet guy) and avoid extremes in deviation of those sources. Load in small batches and do not buy anything besides primers in bulk until you figure out what really works well for you, in your guns, for your specific applications.

 

[SamT1]

There is only one proper bullet for a 44 mag. That’s a Kieth style LSWC with a gas check. I’m baffled why anything else exists.

That said, like mentioned before you need to learn to load a jacketed bullet first. The lead bullets take special care to size properly, select proper finished length, crimp correctly according to pressure, and the mouth flare needs to be just enough. You also really need a vintage Lyman book to get the real loads from.

As for learning. I’d buy some jacketed bullets that are listed specifically in your manual. Hornady xtp or gold dot’s are most common to find I’d say in my area anyway. Start in the bottom quarter of the data and work up to the top quarter. That will show you how to read primers for pressure especially if you use a non magnum primer.
Stick to the data. It would be good to use the primer they recomend, but some books don’t even say specifically.

Try to buy your supplies from a local shop where you can get advise from the man behind the counter. Lots of loading shops have presses setup and it wouldn’t take but a minute for them to show you how to setup the dies.

You’ll eventually find that loading ammo is like cooking. Lots of cooks veer from the recepie, but instead of a bad meal you get a ruined gun or missing hands and eyes if you screw up.

 

[typhun]

My expereince with 44 mag was getting case tension and crimping set properly especially when loading at or near max, watch for bullet jump. Fire a couple and then check the remaining.

 

[RealGun]

I avoid plated bullets in revolvers since it is better to have a real crimp groove and to avoid needing a taper crimp die. I did manage to use some plated in 41 Magnum, but the crimp wasn't what it should have been, while the load wasn't extreme. I now use the remainder of those bullets only in 41 Special target ammo.

 

[thomas15]

. I estimate my savings will be extraordinary by loading .44 magnum myself, and I can load more accurate cartridges with heavier loads as a bonus.

Don't tell anyone, if you do there will be a rush to the store to purchase all of the presses, dies, smokeless powder and primers. Then there will be none left for me.

 

[Walkalong]

Inexperienced reloaders should stick to what the recipe calls for. Another suggestion I have for new reloaders is to stick with jacketed bullets from reputable manufacturers. While they do not give one the most savings, they are the easiest to have success with as far as accuracy and crimp. Jacketed also are not affected by bore and throat diameters like lead and will not foul ones barrel(generally) if the bore/throats are not perfectly matched to bullet diameter.

Good advise, start slow. The XTPs are the same price per hundred as an unknown bullet from Everglades. They might shoot great, and at least out shoot you, but if they don't, you'll wonder if a known bullet would have.

Once you get a little more comfortable, and want to try something lower priced, heck, buy 500 of the Everglades bullets and try them. Chances are good they are at least "good enough".

There is only one proper bullet for a 44 mag. That’s a Kieth style LSWC with a gas check. I’m baffled why anything else exists.

While no doubt a great bullet, I had to giggle a little at that. One of the attributes of the .44 is so many choices.

As for learning. I’d buy some jacketed bullets that are listed specifically in your manual.

Never bad advise.

The coated "Kieth" bullet is a great choice if you are looking to save a few pennies over premium jacketed.

 

[WestKentucky]

My response follows each chunk of your post.

.1 I'm just getting into reloading and the first cartridge I want to reload is going to be the legendary .44 magnum. I estimate my savings will be extraordinary by loading .44 magnum myself, and I can load more accurate cartridges with heavier loads as a bonus.

Yes you will save a lot as .44mag is one of the most marked up rounds in common caliber.

.2 I've done some research on the various accoutrements for reloading and have some equipment on the way, but I now need to decide what components I want to order and ultimately assemble. Based on my readings I've wound up with more questions than answers and I'm hoping this forum can help set me straight. Here are a few of my questions:

That’s a common problem.

.3 How important is using the exact primer from a given recipe? For example, if the recipe calls for a "CCI 300 large pistol primer" can I use a Sellior & Bellot large pistol primer in it's place? What about magnum vs. standard? Based on what I've read using "whatever primer is most affordable" is not advised by anyone but is generally done by just about everyone. I am partially reloading to reduce cost so I'm interested in using whatever brand of primer is most affordable (or on sale) if I can get away with that- What say you?

I’m no stickler for the exact primer listed. I just match the type, specifically if it is magnum rated or not.

.4 How important is using the exact bullet from a given recipe? For example, if I have a recipe in my Lee loading manual that says "240 grain jacketed bullet" with no further elaboration what bullet are those recipes referring to? Obviously lead vs. jacketed is a substantial difference that requires different loads, but what about jsp vs. jhp? Could I use the same "240 grain jacketed bullet" load for either bullet type that I got a better deal on bulk?

Exact bullet is not of extreme importance provided they are similar. Look at bullet profile, weight, and bearing surface (area getting friction as the bullet travels through the barrel) and if they are similar then go fo it, but always start low and work up. I liked the Hornady 240gr bullet when I was loading 44mag. I loaded all I had and kept the ammo when I sold the gun because I will pick up another 44 and keep going with that load.

.5 Is "Copper plated" it's own thing, or should I be using lead loads, or "light" jacketed loads, or what? I can get copper jacketed rounds (diameter .429) or exposed lead rounds (diameter .431), and then just to make things interesting I can get copper plated rounds which have special loads in some manuals, no specific loads in others, and which are advised for "low velocity" from their manufacturer

Copper plated (Berrys?) bullets are in between lead and jacketed. Use lead data. The bullets don’t hold up well when pushed harder and can cause issues in the gun as well as externally.

.6 All the "jacketed" rounds I've seen have been .429, except for one set of JSP .431 rounds sold from Everglades Ammunition. What's the deal with .431 JSP? Why is jacketed ammo traditionally .429 while lead is .431, with plated at .430 or .431? Is .431 JSP safe to fire in my Redhawk revolver, and can I load it to the high velocity high pressure loads I aspire to in my manuals?

That’s the common way. All calibers are similar in the size difference between lead and jacketed.

.7 Sorry for all the questions but I figured if I get an answer to even a few of these bullets I'll know a lot more than I did before. Happy New Years everyone!

The only stupid question is the one you don’t ask. In this hobby that can get you hurt or even killed. Ask away.

 

[Walkalong]

Copper plated (Berrys?) bullets are in between lead and jacketed. Use lead data. The bullets don’t hold up well when pushed harder and can cause issues in the gun as well as externally.

I disagree with this. So do the plated bullet makers.

 

[brewer12345]

I disagree with this. So do the plated bullet makers.

Ditto. I would not do a top end load with plated, but otherwise I use jacketed data.

 

[SamT1]

The coated "Kieth" bullet is a great choice if you are looking to save a few pennies over premium jacketed.

Kieth bullets are also a good choice for hunting game, shooting steel plates, reduced loads, all out hot rod loads!
But a man has to have casting stuff to take full advantage of all that. I guess that is the disadvantage.

 

[WestKentucky]

I disagree with this. So do the plated bullet makers.

I looked it up and must concede. In practice it doesn't change much if your safety protocol is adequate during load workup. Start low and work up. If something seems weird during shooting STOP. Safely verify your barrel is unobstructed, inspect the weapon, and continue only after you determine its safe to do so. That's more important than the numbers.

 

[ray15]

Ditto. I would not do a top end load with plated, but otherwise I use jacketed data.

I recently tested some xtreme heavy-plate bullets back-to-back against Hornady XTPs using the same min to max W296 load ladders in a .357 magnum. Long story short, those .357" plated bullets did the same velocities as the XTPs did at a given charge weight. At both 125 and 158 grain.

I've come to think that it's generally safe to use jacketed max loads with plated bullets under two conditions - the plating is thick enough for the resultant velocity and the diameter of the plated bullet matches that of the jacketed one. Many plated makers, including Berry's, tend to size their products slightly larger than typical jacketed diameters.

I know when I use Berry's plated bullets in 9mm I reach max jacketed velocities with a little less charge than the published jacketed data. When I use xtreme plated bullets, which tend to be sized a bit smaller and like typical jacketed bullets, the velocity vs. charge weight matches published jacketed data very well in most cases.

 

[Walkalong]

When I used to shoot a lot of 115 Gr RN in 9MM at near full data the Ranier 115 Gr RN and Hornady 115 Gr RN encapsulated ran almost tit for tat with the same charge weights with various powders.

I have tried to hurt Powerbond plated bullets in .38 Spl, midrange .357, and 9MM/.38 Super, and couldn't do it. Their 125 Gr HP bullet can do all that +P .38 Spl can do to it. The similar 124 Gr 9MM/.38 Super HP can take all those can do to it.

Here is the Powerbond 125 Gr HP in .357 at an average 1257 FPS.

 

[Walkalong]

The new rated to 1500 FPS X-Treme and Berrys bullets are pretty danged tough as well.

 

[Walkalong]

That said, I would only use plated for midrange .44 Mag loads (If I loaded them), like I do with .41 mag. Use a taper crimp and call it good.

I did buy some Power bond .44 bullets to test, but haven't gotten around to it. I used to shoot the Ranier 240 Gr .44 bullets at midrange .44 Mag power level with Blue Dot years ago.

 

[sequins]

Thanks for all the input everyone, here are a few additional thoughts from yours truly:

Bullet- pick a bullet that fits the use. Hunting vs target can be very different.

I intend to load for target shooting using handguns at this time, I have both a Ruger Super Blackhawk and a Ruger Redhawk that I'll be firing my .44 magnum rounds through. I want to start out with lighter loads while I get a handle on what I'm doing. Once I'm a little more adept I want to start loading some really hot, fast rounds with a massive blast and report to impress people at the range and give myself the thrill only heavy magnum loads can produce but I understand that is something I should work up to.

copper plated is its own thing depending on thickness and plating process. each manufacturer should tell which load data to use with their bullets. if not, ask here. some bullets have thin plating and require low velocity lead load data. again, keep asking questions.

I am eyeballing Berry's and Rainier plated bullets, but I've heard Berry's are marginally superior so I was thinking Berry's in particular. They seem to be very prevalent and the reviews generally seem pretty favorable. I am considering buying a box of 500 of the 240gr plated FP bullets and though they lack a specific crimp groove my hope is that light target loads won't need a tremendous crimp to perform well. Am I going to get into trouble trying to load those rounds? It seems crimping a plated round is risky because it's very easy to pierce the plating and compromise the bullet but I was hoping I wouldn't need much crimp if I loaded to 1000-1100 fps.

Plated bullets you use lead or light jacketed data. Plated manufactures will list their max velocity so start at min and workup for accuracy, pressure and try not to go over the manufactures velocity.

Though I ultimately want to load some really heavy charges, I'm going to be starting closer to the minimum and make some light target loads to start out and become acquainted with reloading. Berry's bullets seem very affordable and are rated for up to 1,200 FPS according to the manufacturer so if I'm loading 1,000-1,100 FPS loads they should be very light in recoil and I can "practice" reloading on rounds with plenty of margin for error on both the high and low end. A quick look at my Lee manual I think I'll be using Universal, Titegroup, and HP38 powders and working with each to figure out what my gun likes best. Those powders seem great for starting loads, but would love advice on other powders if those aren't such a good idea after all.

I would skip copper plated in favor of the coated (e.g. Hitek type powder coatings, Missouri bullet company has a nice selection). Nice crimp grooves available in the coated lead bullets.

I have pushed MBC's coated bullets to full 44 mag velocities out of my 44 lever rifle, and they would work fine for special or light loads.

Those MBC bullets look extremely affordable and if what you're saying is true they might be the obvious choice. Can I really load those up to 1500 fps without leading? I hadn't seen the "coated" bullets until you pointed them out to me so thanks for opening my eyes to that and I'll probably buy a box of 500 to try out. It looks like they offer the "Keith" bullet that I suppose I ought to be using. If those are great at high velocity I could use the same bullet for a variety of target and heavy loads, whereas I was currently considering buying plated for light loads and jacketed for heavy loads.

One other thing about those MBC bullets- My range doesn't allow "exposed lead bullets" to be fired as it's an indoor range and aerosolized lead in an indoors environment is extremely undesirable. I will of course check with my range directly to see what their policy on coated bullets is, but are coated lead bullets safe the way plated and TMJ bullets are? Even if they allow the bullets I wouldn't want to use them indoors unless they are as safe as Plated/TMJ rounds.

Thanks again for all the great info everyone, THR is a wonderful resource for a new reloader such as myself and I appreciate everyone who has posted here for helping me out.