Nickel or Stainless

[Monac]

Nickle has a certain luster that I've never seen stainless achieve , I'm sure there are exceptions. a good nickle finish has a hue of color sometimes to my eye too, maybe kind of blueish. Hard for me to elaborate but I can usually spot the difference pretty easily.
- I'm zero help for s&w model designations or identification.

I agree, but it's tough, and can be even tougher from a picture. I get fooled even in person sometime. There was a real pretty CZ-75 in a local gun store recently, and I can't remember if it was nickel or polished stainless, because it was so hard to tell.

 

[CraigC]

Nickle has a certain luster that I've never seen stainless achieve , I'm sure there are exceptions. a good nickle finish has a hue of color sometimes to my eye too, maybe kind of blueish. Hard for me to elaborate but I can usually spot the difference pretty easily.

You can match the polish but stainless will never match the color. Nickel has a warm, bronze hue to it. Stainless is a cooler (blue/white) color, though still slightly warmer than hard chrome.

 

[Hal]

Not to mention that cleaning the carbon scoring off the cylinder face is a colossal waste of time.

Right up to the point where that crud starts to bind up the cylinder....which happens pretty soon when you shoot .38 special loads worked up with Unique powder & that gooey type bullet lube on the cast lead bullets.

But - if you are all that concerned - you can always drift on over to Pro Shot and order your cloth from them....they put right on the front of the label it's safe on nickel.

https://www.proshotproducts.com/Lead-Clean-Cloth_p_603.html

Takes big ones that clang to make a statement like that - if it's going to damage something of enormous dollar value - like an old Peacemaker. for instance.

 

[Waveski]

OP asked if "THIS model 36" is chrome or stainless. I assume he knew the model number but was not aware of S&Ws model numbers being specific to the material used.

I stand corrected. There were many model numbers tossed about in other posts ; I guess I juxtaposed.

 

[Waveski]

The original M-60 came with stainless hammer and trigger. There was an issue with hardening them as it changed the color...hence they were flash chromed (matte white). After that they just installed carbon hammer and triggers, as in the M-36, and flash chromed them.

Ok , but do you agree that there were also early 60's with case hardened triggers and hammers? I've seen a number of images as such.

 

[CraigC]

Right up to the point where that crud starts to bind up the cylinder....

Carbon scoring doesn't build up and bind the cylinder. If it did, blued guns would be locking up all the time.

I don't care what the marketing says. They say LeadAway is non-abrasive, all the while it's removing the carbon scoring mechanically. Which requires abrasive action.

 

[JFrameTwitch]

Thanks everyone. Guess I should have done more research and could have answered my question with the model number. It is indeed a 36. From the serial number I think it’s a 1976. Whole reason I started the conversation was to see if there was a way to fix the little scuff seen in photo. I assume since it’s nickel I’m out of luck. Also attached a closeup of the hammer as requested.

 

[Waveski]

Lovely case hardening coloration.

Regarding those nicks : if that nice little Chiefs were mine I would put a dab of Flitz on a q-tip and gently work on it. I zoomed in but could not tell if the dings were through the nickle. I don't think that there is ant risk in a cautious approach as suggested , and there may be opportunity for improvement.

(I prefer to call a m.36 by it's original name of Chiefs Special ... too bad S&W jettisoned that great reference.)

 

[Waveski]

"There is a large "N" stamped on the grip frame.

(could indicate Not stainless?)"

Indicates it's factory Nickel...not an aftermarket job. Is there an "N" on the rear of the cylinder between the chambers?

Yes , I understand that. Attempt at humor.
I'll borrow Bikerdoc's line : "I'll be here all week!"

 

[halfmoonclip]

There may have been other running changes that I'm not aware of, but my recollection is that early 60s (and my own 66, 640 and 940) had hardchromed action parts, due to galling or hardness issues with stainless parts. Smith set out to make the guns just about rustproof, tho' a 3" 60 of mine developed surface rust all the time. On the other hand, a buddy's old 60 sat in a wet drawer (roof leak) for months, with no damage, even to springs.
Those hardchomed parts are as nice to work on as the color case ones...which is what they are, under the plating.
Current production is MIM, and not plated with anything. The parts are a dull dark gray, and may be rust resistant; I've sweated liberally on a 640 Pro without problem.
When taken apart, the MIM parts are just a mystery; they are pinless, and go together like a jigsaw puzzle.
Moon

 

[bangswitch]

Nickle has a certain luster that I've never seen stainless achieve , I'm sure there are exceptions. .

You can match the polish but stainless will never match the color. Nickel has a warm, bronze hue to it. Stainless is a cooler (blue/white) color, though still slightly warmer than hard chrome.

Stainless steel is an alloy of carbon steel and any combination of varying percentages of chromium, nickel, molybdenum and nitrogen as well as copper and a couple of other elements, depending on the intended use. Not sure what grade of stainless is used in S&W revolvers or other firearms, but stainless can be highly polished. many of the surgical instruments I used for many years had a degree of shine that made a show car's bumpers look like oxidized aluminum.

Thanks everyone. Guess I should have done more research and could have answered my question with the model number. It is indeed a 36. From the serial number I think it’s a 1976. Whole reason I started the conversation was to see if there was a way to fix the little scuff seen in photo. I assume since it’s nickel I’m out of luck. Also attached a closeup of the hammer as requested. View attachment 968598View attachment 968599

If the spots on your cylinder are chipped places in the finish, all you can do is keep the underlying steel from rusting, since it has no other rust preventative than the nickel plate. Try some flitz to polish the entire gun, and keep a light coat of gun oil on it, or keep it wiped down with a silicone impregnated cloth to protect it. As nice as that gun looks, I wouldn't go nuts over a couple of tiny places, it's normal wear. The only time you'll ever see a perfect finish on a firearm is if it never sees the light of day and lives its life in a storage case.

 

[CraigC]

As I said, you can match the polish but not the color. Stainless is closer in color to hard chrome than nickel, IMHO.

 

[9mmepiphany]

Ok , but do you agree that there were also early 60's with case hardened triggers and hammers? I've seen a number of images as such.

Yes, there was an outcry of outrage when those hit the market. The practice was quickly stopped and the rest of the trigger/hammers flash chromed. There were also folks who switched their stainless hammers and triggers to case hardened to avoid accelerated wear

 

[Speedo66]

(I prefer to call a m.36 by it's original name of Chiefs Special ... too bad S&W jettisoned that great reference.)

Colt came out with their Detective Special in 1927, S&W came out with the Chief Special in about 1951.

Perhaps the Smith name was just to one up the Colt, a Chief over a lowly Detective. lol

 

[Waveski]

Yes, there was an outcry of outrage when those hit the market. The practice was quickly stopped and the rest of the trigger/hammers flash chromed. There were also folks who switched their stainless hammers and triggers to case hardened to avoid accelerated wear

I don’t understand the outrage or the concern for accelerated wear.
I have revolvers over 100 years old with case hardened hammers and triggers that seem to be holding up just fine.

 

[9mmepiphany]

I don’t understand the outrage or the concern for accelerated wear.
I have revolvers over 100 years old with case hardened hammers and triggers that seem to be holding up just fine.

You either mis-read or mis-understood my post. Perhaps you just transposed and combined the separate statements.

The accelerated wear was from the original all stainless triggers/hammers.

The outrage is because of S&W marketing of the rust resistance of the original M-60 (remember the M-60 frozen in a block of ice?) with the implication that the gun would not rust. Adding carbon steel triggers/hammers to the M-60 would certainly compromise this quality. It's the same kind of outrage that occurred when S&W introduced the alloy framed M-642 and the barrel/cylinder didn't match color/finish of the frame

 

[Waveski]

Your knowledge and reference base go back further than mine. I was a late bloomer.
Thanks for the background information.

I'd like to see that ad with a 60 in a block of ice.

 

[walnut1704]

"There is a large "N" stamped on the grip frame.

(could indicate Not stainless?)"




Yes , I understand that. Attempt at humor.
I'll borrow Bikerdoc's line : "I'll be here all week!"

My bad. Context, intent, and inflection is often lost in the printed word.

 

[Monac]

You either mis-read or mis-understood my post. Perhaps you just transposed and combined the separate statements.

The accelerated wear was from the original all stainless triggers/hammers.

The outrage is because of S&W marketing of the rust resistance of the original M-60 (remember the M-60 frozen in a block of ice?) with the implication that the gun would not rust. Adding carbon steel triggers/hammers to the M-60 would certainly compromise this quality. It's the same kind of outrage that occurred when S&W introduced the alloy framed M-642 and the barrel/cylinder didn't match color/finish of the frame

My understanding is that S&W quickly got away from making the internal mechanism out of stainless steel because it resulted in very poor trigger pulls. I thought they went back to the same material they used in their blued revolvers for those parts, and that does not seem to have been much of an issue. Certainly there was not outrage. I hope I have not missed the point here.

 

[9mmepiphany]

My understanding is that S&W quickly got away from making the internal mechanism out of stainless steel because it resulted in very poor trigger pulls. I thought they went back to the same material they used in their blued revolvers for those parts, and that does not seem to have been much of an issue.

That is what I was trying to say...sorry if it was confusing

Certainly there was not outrage. I hope I have not missed the point here.

Perhaps outrage was too strong a word...maybe loud whining would be more accurate.

You have to remember that this was in the days before the internet. When customers or dealers were moved enough to complain, it required more effort than it does now. It had to be pretty loud if the gun rags were willing to pick it up and print it; I remember reading about it in both Gun & Ammo and Shooting Times

 

[Riomouse911]

There was another thread where the OP was asking about nickel plating a stainless gun.

Personally I wouldn't ever do that but others may... which is 100 pct fine with me .

I’d rather polish the stainless like the factory finish on this old Vaquero rather than open a stainless gun up to the issues this nickel Model 49 can have (Flaking, scratching, deep scratches that can damage the plating, chemical damage, etc.)



The poster who said there is a different hue to nickel is right, the nickel gun above has a slightly yellowish tint in my led lighting in person.

Stay safe.

 

[9mmepiphany]

I’d rather polish the stainless like the factory finish on this old Vaquero rather than open a stainless gun up to the issues this nickel Model 49 can have (Flaking, scratching, deep scratches that can damage the plating, chemical damage, etc.)

The knock on stainless has always been that it is softer and picks up scratches easily...the flip side of that coin is that it's easy to fix.

My personal preference for a hard use white pistol is hard chrome with electroless nickel coming in a close second

 

[Riomouse911]

The knock on stainless has always been that it is softer and picks up scratches easily...the flip side of that coin is that it's easy to fix.

My personal preference for a hard use white pistol is hard chrome with electroless nickel coming in a close second

When the factory finish on my SIG P-226 wore off after about four months of duty use, I sent it to Robar for their Np3 treatment. This stuff was awesome, shrugging off years of duty carry rain or shine. The finishes like that are amazing... but I don’t know if they come in a mirror polish finish.

Stay safe.

 

[CraigC]

I talked to Bob Cogan of Accurate Plating and he said the ultimate in corrosion resistance would be hard chrome over stainless.

Here's a good pic I use to illustrate the difference in color between hard chrome and nickel. Stainless is somewhere in between.