Old calibers VS new calibers

[Rival]

I am a big fan of 9x19mm and .45ACP. I believe these two fill the void, and can do everything well.

Now we have all these new calibers coming in, .40S&W, 357Sig, and .45GAP. Does any single one of these new calibers offer a distinctive advatage over traditional 9mm and .45? What do you guys think?

 

[41mag]

I'm sure to get flamed but I believe that,for the most part,new calibers come out for two basic reasons.
First,as a route to sell more guns.ie.A marketing route for the gun manufacturers."NEW!","THE BEST YET!",& etc.
Secondly,we-as firearms buyers-like to try new/different things.So,they keep making them & we keep buying them.I suppose that it could be made more complicated but....

Demand creates supply & percieved demand creates more supply.
Or something like that.

 

[Peter M. Eick]

Lets see....

The 10mm gives more power then the 45 or 9mm,
The 40 gives more rounds then the 45 in the same size grip frame.
The 40 gives more punch then the 9mm in the same size grip frame.
The 357 sig gives more power then the 9mm.

The 45gap just doesn't make sense to me so I will avoid it.

Basically that is the advantages.

To me, the 10mm gives me power on tap to really have some fun. The 357sig is a nice upgrade from the old 38super/9mm. What's not to like?

 

[Ktulu]

I think we've had all the pistol and rifle cartridges the world will ever need since the early 20th century.

 

[Ash]

Yeah, does anyone really believe that the 300 Winchester Magnum is really inferior or better than the 300 Weatherby Magnum? Yadda yadda yadda?

Ash

 

[wally]

I usually stick with calibers that have been widely adopted by agencies or the military.

For me this means 45ACP, 9mm, 38/357, .308, .223, 30-06, & 7.62x39.

IMHO .40S&W has about hit critical mass, but I'd still be ignoring it if it weren't for the little Kahr PM40.

The .40 S&W has one usually overlooked unique virtue -- the sectional density of a 180gr .40 is the same as a 230 gr .45 and in the same length barrel the .40 S&W will give 100-150 fps more velocity than 45ACP. Probably doesn't matter in full sized guns but a real plus for CCW sub-compacts where penetration from the really short barrels starts to get marginal.

Other calibers are fine if you like to reload or want to fill out a collection. My wife loves the blast and flash of 44 Mag -- easy for her to enjoy since I do the reloading

I see no use at all for 45 GAP until something like a "Kahr PM45" comes out, and even then I may stay with my PM40 for the previously mentioned better penetration.

--wally.

 

[armoredman]

It looks like the CZ2075 RAMI may come out in 45GAP, but nobody knows why.....
I went down from 40 to 9mm, due to getting a newer pistol. With good modern ammo, I don't feel underarmed.

 

[mountainclmbr]

I favor the newer rounds for lower price, better availability and lower risk of obsolescence. Most ballistic requirements have been covered, with the exception perhaps of the 10mm and 40 S&W.

Some of the new-fangled rounds are interesting, but not enough to get me to part with the cost of gun, ammo and new reloading components.

 

[cratz2]

I don't have a problem with new cartridges... more options is a good thing in my opinion.

I do believe that the 9mm and 45ACP covers 99% of what a handgun should be expected to do though. I don't count myself a fan of the 357 SIG. I'd rather have a 9x23 in a 1911 platform. The 40 and 10mm makes sense, but I could live quite happily without them.

I'm the only one that is looking forward to some new guns in 45GAP. I'd take a CZ PCR or a full size (TP9-ish) gun in 45GAP. I don't know if I fully appreciate the 45GAP in full size service type guns though.

 

[1911Tuner]

Old and New

This caliber debate is one that's raged since Hector was a pup.

There are few ballistic niches that haven't already been filled, and the introduction of a new cartridge is usually met with a ho-hum response with few exceptions. Occasionally, there are some small advantages though.

The .45 ACP vs the new GAP is one such example of the breed. The GAP
offers no real advantage in terminal ballistics over the old ACP...but it
does open the door for a .big-bore pistol with reduced grip dimensions,
which can be important to those folks with smaller hands.

The .308 and the .30-06 are nearly identical in terminal effect on the target,
though the old "Ought-Six" offers a distinct advantage when bullet weight
goes over the 165-grain mark. The main advantage lies in the shorter, lighter actions that the .308 will fit into. If both cartridges are handloaded to their full potential, the longer .30-06 will hold about a 10% velocity/energy advantage over the shorter round. The deer will never know the difference.

The .308 and the 7mm-08 are, for all practical purposes, ballistic twins. There is some small advantage in ballistic coefficient with the 7mm, but
it's hardly noticeable in the game field. The other advantage is that it's
legal in countries where military calibers are verboten. Other than that,
there is no task for which one is suited for that the other won't do equally well.

Many times, a reinvented cartridge is made for a distinct purpose. To sell.
Whatever advantages that it holds over an older one are often minimal,
and appeal to a small segment of the shooting population.

 

[New_comer]

I now have a gun in 0.35" and in 0.45" calibers...


One more gun in 0.40" caliber wouldn't be bad at all...


I'd have one each in Small, Medium, & Large.


Nice...

 

[jc2]

mountainclmbr -

I favor the newer rounds for lower price, better availability and lower risk of obsolescence.

You meant "older rounds," didn't you? "Lower price, better availability and lower risk of obsolescence" sure doesn't describe most newer in rounds including the fairly well established (as newer rounds go) 357 SIG. For example, recent improvements in .36 calibre bullet design has already made the 357 SIG obsolete (though it will probably hang on just because it is a pretty good round).

 

[Black Snowman]

Auto loading handgun cartridges cover everything from 17 HMR to .50 AE with many small graduations as well as duplications and over-laps so specific balistics can be had in specific gun models in between. If you can't find what you want, odds are your desires are quite unusual.

As far a 9x19 and .45 ACP being able to do everything well, I can't say I agree. I wouldn't want to hunt big game with them as backup, much less a primary.

 

[Rival]

I don't agree

As far a 9x19 and .45 ACP being able to do everything well, I can't say I agree. I wouldn't want to hunt big game with them as backup, much less a primary.

Hunting the big game is not an autoloading handgun territory. I wouldn't count on 10mm to hunt the big game. Desert Eagle does not cut it for me either, I tried one. This is where revolvers come in.

 

[Onmilo]

You mean to say there are other calibers besides .45 acp!!???

 

[g21forme]

A wise man once told me

"All things old are not always better than what's new and all things new are not always better than what's old."

kinda fit to you post so I thought i'd share

 

[Dienekes]

I thought there were an awful lot of cartridges in the catalogue when I was a kid. I don't think I could keep them straight today even if I tried. It's similar to 100 brands of soap or the SUV of the week--fodder for the gun rags and stuff to sell to the clueless.

Way back when it was widely felt that the .22 LR, .38 Spl., and .45 ACP covered the waterfront. If you throw in the .357 I think that's about right.

The .44 Spl./Mag is a winner, and if someone was furnishing me .357 SIG factory ammo I could warm up to that.

Less is more.

 

[Majic]

Way back when it was widely felt that the .22 LR, .38 Spl., and .45 ACP covered the waterfront.

When you add the game fields the .44sp and .45 Colt expanded that waterfront.

 

[Vern Humphrey]

Quote inside a quote:
-----------------------------------
quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Way back when it was widely felt that the .22 LR, .38 Spl., and .45 ACP covered the waterfront.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

When you add the game fields the .44sp and .45 Colt expanded that waterfront.
---------------------------------------

If you consider the .357 a special case of the .38 Special, I agree with all of the above.

Everyone needs a .22 pistol -- for obvious reasons.

A .357 is about the most versatile revolver you can get -- and you can shoot .38 Special in it when you want mild loads.

The .45 ACP, in the great M1911A1 is pretty much unbeatable as a defense gun.

The .45 Colt loaded hot (or the .44 Magnum, if you prefer) is about as much gun as the average man can handle for hunting.

And them's the only cartridges represented in the 15 or so handguns I own (except for a couple of collectors items, a Colt .25 ACP and an original Colt model 1849 cap and ball.)