Poll: what's the ideal big bore revolver cartridge?

[Seedy Character]

Ammo prices between .41 and .44 of same type ammo, is identical

There is not "Special", as such. But! Cowboy Loads are light loads.

I have .357, .41, .44 and .45C revolvers. I shoot the .41 the most.

Reloading does expand the choices of loads and bullets, but they factory loads available, cover all needs.

 

[aaaaa]

I am thinking in a perfect world where all ammo sizes are cheap and easily available, what would be the best big bore revolver. Maybe the S&W Governor if it had a longer barrel as it can shoot 45 Colt, 45 ACP (with moon clips), and 410 shot shells. And in our current world, it looks like 45 ACP is reasonably cheap ammo so one could have some fun at the range with it.

What other revolvers can shoot 45 Colt?

Recoil per article linked below is light on the 45 Colt cartridge. Compare:
.45 Colt Energy: 348 ft.-lbs. (185-grain bullet) Recoil Factor: 0.76
.44 Magnum Energy: 966 ft.-lbs. (200-grain bullet) Recoil Factor: 1.45
.44 Special Energy: 297 ft.-lbs. (165-grain bullet) Recoil Factor: 0.81
.357 Magnum Energy: 624 ft.-lbs. (125-grain bullet) Recoil Factor: 0.89
.38 Special Energy: 249 ft.-lbs. (110-grain bullet) Recoil Factor: 0.53
.327 Federal Magnum Energy: 386 ft.-lbs. (80-grain bullet) Recoil Factor: 0.67
https://www.handgunsmag.com/editorial/revolver-ammo-carry-home-defense/458665

 

[Mycin]

Any 454 Casull or 460 S&W Magnum revolver can shoot 45 Colt ammo. 45 Colt might be thought of as the "Special" for the 454 Casull -- shorter case and much lower pressure (14K psi vs. 65K psi).

The Taurus Judge is like the S&W Governor - shoots 410 shot shells and 45 Colt (don't know about 45ACP). I believe the Judge was out first, and S&W copied the idea with the Governor. I've never been a fan of either of these. If you want a shotgun, buy a shotgun. No need to make your revolver excessively long and heavy just to fire poorly-patterning 410 shells at a low velocity. They always struck me as a gimmick.

FYI, the Ruger Redhawk 45 is cut for moonclips so you can fire 45 Colt or 45 ACP in it. There may be a version of the S&W Model 25 or 625 like that, as well. There's also a "convertible" version of the Ruger Blackhawk single-action that comes with an extra cylinder to fire 45ACP.

 

[Mycin]

@aaaaa , since you seem to be soaking up info about big bores, you might be interested in this article discussing the "Ruger-only" level 45 Colt loads, if you haven't seen it. You can get 44 Magnum-class power from a 45 Colt if you have a handgun that'll handle the pressure.

https://www.johnlinebaughcustomsixguns.com/writings

A few boutique ammo companies like Buffalo Bore, Underwood and Double-Tap load ammo to these pressures so you don't have to handload to get your kaboom fix.

Be aware that there are a few newer configurations of the Blackhawk that are built on a smaller frame and are thus not recommended for these loads, but all the 45 Redhawks are, plus a few other makes & models. Just do your research before going down this path.

 

[The Happy Kaboomer]

It's really the one YOU LIKE BEST......In reality most don't do much that the others can do too.

 

[Huntolive]

I’m glad to see the two that I was consider voting for or both right at the top of the pack 44 magnum which would be my second choice
And my pic for 454Kassul which also got 45 colt as a bonus!

I will say I do like my 460 Smith and Wesson and that might actually be the most capable overall

But ammo is relatively inexpensive and easy to find for the combo 45 colt and 454

even during the ammo crisis 454 did not go up in price much relative to the increase in other types of ammo nor was it impossible to find at any point
The rounds are extremely capable and can be loaded up and down with the 4 to 5 cold plus P and everything the 454 can do

that said I definitely see the argument for 44 magnum and I wouldn’t trade all my 44 magnum‘s for my 454 Casuls
The cool thing about 44 is the other type of gun that you can put it out I love love love my Henri lever action carbine Mine is the all black one that is slightly tactical looking and has the threaded barrel

 

[__steve__]

Seems just one other voter than me has the same idea as “ideal”.

 

[P5 Guy]

.44 Special Energy: 297 ft.-lbs. (165-grain bullet) Recoil Factor: 0.81

If Elmer Keith heard, you say that ... Well I wouldn't stand within 600 yards of you.

 

[CaptHank]

Over the years, I've had revolvers in 500 Mag, 460 Mag, 45 Colt, 44 Mag, 41 Mag and 357 Mag. The only one that I cherish is the Dan Wesson 741. It will always have a place in the safe.

 

[Riomouse911]

As much as it isn’t my favorite, the .44 Mag is the most versatile big bore out there. Plenty powerful yet controllable; super popular in DA and SA revolvers, also in semi-autos (Desert Eagle) and single shots along with currently made bolt, lever and single shot rifles (past ones include pump and semi-auto as well); factory ammo and component choices are broad; 44 Spl compatible for fun-practice-defense; forgiving and easy to reload from mild to wild.

Stay safe.

 

[AzShooter1]

Most people can handle the .44 Magnum. If not you can shoot .44 Specials or even .44 Russians out of it for light loads.

The heavier Magnums are a bear to shoot. I find them unpleasant and I've fired most of them at gun shows or from friend's arsenals.

 

[Buck13]

I am thinking in a perfect world where all ammo sizes are cheap and easily available, what would be the best big bore revolver. Maybe the S&W Governor if it had a longer barrel as it can shoot 45 Colt, 45 ACP (with moon clips), and 410 shot shells. And in our current world, it looks like 45 ACP is reasonably cheap ammo so one could have some fun at the range with it.

What other revolvers can shoot 45 Colt?

Recoil per article linked below is light on the 45 Colt cartridge. Compare:
.45 Colt Energy: 348 ft.-lbs. (185-grain bullet) Recoil Factor: 0.76
.44 Magnum Energy: 966 ft.-lbs. (200-grain bullet) Recoil Factor: 1.45
.44 Special Energy: 297 ft.-lbs. (165-grain bullet) Recoil Factor: 0.81
.357 Magnum Energy: 624 ft.-lbs. (125-grain bullet) Recoil Factor: 0.89
.38 Special Energy: 249 ft.-lbs. (110-grain bullet) Recoil Factor: 0.53
.327 Federal Magnum Energy: 386 ft.-lbs. (80-grain bullet) Recoil Factor: 0.67
https://www.handgunsmag.com/editorial/revolver-ammo-carry-home-defense/458665

If you believe that the recoil factor is a realistic measure of shooting comfort and that muzzle energy is a good indication of terminal ballistics effectiveness*, then you can divide the muzzle energy by that recoil factor to get an adjusted (aka: specific, or unit) energy. Higher is better. By that calculation, .357 Magnum is the best and .44 Magnum is second for the loads you listed.

*Now, I am agnostic on the question of ME being the best measure of terminal effectiveness, but certainly skeptical.

And as far as recoil, I haven't shot the .45 Colt or .327 Federal, so I can't be sure, but those numbers don't seem too bad. However, I consider muzzle blast to be a factor, too, so I'll bet .327 Federal would *seem* worse than indicated and .45 Colt probably better, due to their chamber pressures.

Also, those are all light-for-caliber bullets, which is good for kinetic energy but almost certainly not ideal for hunting. Don't know if redoing this table with heavy-for-caliber bullets would change the rankings, though.

To go back to the very original post, 10 mm is nothing to sneeze at. I've been regretting selling my 10 mms lately.

 

[Buck13]

Dang, Beartooth Bullets used to have a very interesting table showing claimed wound channel for various meplat diameters and velocities that I was going to link to, but their site is gone.

Too bad, there was a lot of fun stuff there for pajama adventuring.

 

[aaaaa]

If you believe that the recoil factor is a realistic measure of shooting comfort and that muzzle energy is a good indication of terminal ballistics effectiveness*, then you can divide the muzzle energy by that recoil factor to get an adjusted (aka: specific, or unit) energy. Higher is better. By that calculation, .357 Magnum is the best and .44 Magnum is second for the loads you listed.

*Now, I am agnostic on the question of ME being the best measure of terminal effectiveness, but certainly skeptical.

And as far as recoil, I haven't shot the .45 Colt or .327 Federal, so I can't be sure, but those numbers don't seem too bad. However, I consider muzzle blast to be a factor, too, so I'll bet .327 Federal would *seem* worse than indicated and .45 Colt probably better, due to their chamber pressures.

Also, those are all light-for-caliber bullets, which is good for kinetic energy but almost certainly not ideal for hunting. Don't know if redoing this table with heavy-for-caliber bullets would change the rankings, though.

To go back to the very original post, 10 mm is nothing to sneeze at. I've been regretting selling my 10 mms lately.

I don't know how one can really compare these. As you say, the numbers are for specific loads. Unless one could run these tests with a variety of loads for each caliber, then average it. Or run the tests with grain weights for each caliber that are proportional to the caliber across the guns tested.

My desire to purchase a .44 or .41 or .45 is pretty much gone. I realize the .357 Magnum has quite a lot of recoil and is more than enough for my needs. A coworker who is a gun nut said "you don't want a .44, just shoot one sometime, but no need to buy one." I think he is right. Still, if I saw one at the right price I might be tempted to buy it.

 

[NeroM]

My desire to purchase a .44 or .41 or .45 is pretty much gone. I realize the .357 Magnum has quite a lot of recoil and is more than enough for my needs. Still, if I saw one at the right price I might be tempted to buy it.

IMHO..... Recoil is only part of the "shootability" equation, muzzle blast is a significant contributing factor as is how the grip/gun fits. Currently shoot 357, 41, 44, 45 and ,454. Have not been able to get really comfortable with 454. Have hunted the most with 41, probably shot 45 the most/longest with 357 close behind. However lots of 357s from a carbine, different topic.
My frame of reference is "deer and hog" hunting, as these are realistically what we most commonly hunt. Strong proponent of 41, however only if you handload. 44, as some have suggested, my really be more gun than needed - even with handloading - lots of muzzle blast. Hunted some with 357, especially 170-187 gr LBT design bullets - would like a little more - plus the muzzle blast. 45 Colt has almost 150 years of cartridge success - 255 gr SWC at 900-1000 fps is a highly effective hunting load, recoil tolerable, doesn't leave your ears ringing - the most all around pragmatic cartridge. Of the large number of firearms available for it; Rugers are great, as is S&W M25. Best bang for the buck right now is probably an SAA clone - suggest one with so called Army style grip - try it if you can before deciding on the Navy or Plow style as it seems to fit many hands better and rolls better with recoil. If you get a regular Ruger Blackhawk, consider replacing the stock grip with Hogue. It is ugly, but works well and is relatively inexpensive. Barrel length in the 5-6.5" range is probably optimal, remember hunting criteria. With 45 Colt, factory ammo available for practice and some stout (within normal pressure limits) effective hunting loads, of course if you hand load - almost endless opportunities.
Consider the 45 Colt?

 

[N555]

I think 44mag.
When I think of taking 44mag, adding more case capacity and turning up pressure up to nearly double, naw I'm good.

 

[Buck13]

I realize the .357 Magnum has quite a lot of recoil and is more than enough for my needs. A coworker who is a gun nut said "you don't want a .44, just shoot one sometime, but no need to buy one." I think he is right. Still, if I saw one at the right price I might be tempted to buy it.

For me, there's .44s and then there's .44s. I first shot a .44 Magnum from a 7.5" Super Blackhawk and hated it. The last 3 of 6 rounds were painful. I thought I didn't like .44 Magnum.

Then years later, my brother-in-law and I split a box of .44s (factory 240 grain, Fiocchi, I think) through his 7.5" Redhawk and I loved it. Bought myself a similar gun within a few weeks. Enjoy shooting it a lot. Most of my handloads are a little lighter than max, but some are very heavy and I enjoy those, too.

I've never shot a Model 29, so I don't know if it's the DA frame, the Redhawk grips, the extra weight or some combination of the above that made the difference for me. I'm tempted to get a 29 since I've always wanted a Smith and Wesson with the 8-3/8" barrel. Watched a couple go on Gunbroker lately but the prices are a little more than I'm thrilled with spending on another gun right now.

 

[aaaaa]

Consider the 45 Colt?

Well, given the numbers in the linked test results (copied below) the .45 Colt does look like a great choice for an easily manageable revolver. And the bigger bore should provide more stopping power over the .357. If the right deal comes up, perhaps. Not going to buy online, but keep checking my local gun shop.


45 Colt Energy: 348 ft.-lbs. (185-grain bullet) Recoil Factor: 0.76
.44 Magnum Energy: 966 ft.-lbs. (200-grain bullet) Recoil Factor: 1.45
.44 Special Energy: 297 ft.-lbs. (165-grain bullet) Recoil Factor: 0.81
.357 Magnum Energy: 624 ft.-lbs. (125-grain bullet) Recoil Factor: 0.89
.38 Special Energy: 249 ft.-lbs. (110-grain bullet) Recoil Factor: 0.53
.327 Federal Magnum Energy: 386 ft.-lbs. (80-grain bullet) Recoil Factor: 0.67
https://www.handgunsmag.com/editorial/revolver-ammo-carry-home-defense/458665

 

[3Crows]

I want my six shooter to be a six shooter:



My 1981 .45 Colt Blackhawk.

Too many of the revolvers listed are five holers.

HMS Bear Load is a good load for .45 Colt. It is 325 grain HCL with 963 fpe. Shoots a bit softer than BB +P stuff, maybe not the best choice, compare to Buffalo Bore, for browns but plenty for black bears and hogs and deer.

3C

 

[aaaaa]

No, I don't consider 357 magnum or 10mm big bore , just as I don't consider 9mm or 40 s&w big bores. Also didn't include 41 magnum to keep consistent but I do consider it the littlest big bore. ::::edit:::: 41 mag added due to popular response.

You did well adding the .41 Mag. Max Prasac, in his book Big Bore Revolvers, considers big bore to be .41 and up.

 

[Onty]

I noticed that those who have or had 41 Magnum, almost all prize this cartridge and many stick with it. IMO this is the most universal caliber, just ideal for shooter who goes on range regularly and shoot considerably more than average shooter. The fact is that we all have certain level of tolerance for recoil (talking about over hundred rounds in one day), and looks like that for majority of us 41 Magnum is just bellow that threshold. Anything more, wrists are warning. Yeah, 44 Magnum and 45 Colt could be loaded with lighter bullets to mimic standard and target 41 magnum loads, but, I didn't see folks are running for 44 and 45 (for revolver) molds in 180-220 grains weights. Must be a reason for that.

As for handgun hunting, I wrote (post #95 on this thread): "For handgun hunter, IMO 480 Ruger is the way to go. There is no substitute for caliber and bullet weight. As a matter of fact, 50 JRH is even better..." I learned later that 454424 from 45 Colt at 1100 fps will go right through even full grown cow. After finding a 41-265 LBT bullet, with .320" meplat dia, IMO, except for full grown moose or brown bear, noted 41-265-LBT at 1100 fps is certainly more than enough for anything else in lower 48:



As you could see, this bullet/mold could be ordered as PB, GC, and both as HP with various cavities, more https://www.mp-molds.com/product/mp-413-265-wnfp-41-cal-hollow-point-mold-multichoice/ . For everything else, there are a lot of excellent molds and jacketed bullets, ranging from 180 to 220 grains. In other words, for handloader, 41 Magnum tops!

 

[Arkansas Paul]

I voted .44 magnum, and I love both the .44 mag and the .45 Colt.
Can you get .44 magnum performance out of a .45 Colt? Of course you can, but you have to choose the right gun to do so in.
You can't just pick up any run of the mill .45 Colt and start shooting 300 grain bullets at 1200-1400 fps out of it. Well, you can but it won't last very long.

Also, I will say that my .44 magnum gets a lot more .44 specials (mostly Skeeter loads) shot through it than magnums. I hunt whitetails, and a 245 grain SWC going 900ish fps is plenty for any of those that walk.

Again, not disparaging the .45 Colt, I love it.

 

[aaaaa]

I voted .44 magnum, and I love both the .44 mag and the .45 Colt.
Can you get .44 magnum performance out of a .45 Colt? Of course you can, but you have to choose the right gun to do so in.
You can't just pick up any run of the mill .45 Colt and start shooting 300 grain bullets at 1200-1400 fps out of it. Well, you can but it won't last very long.

Also, I will say that my .44 magnum gets a lot more .44 specials (mostly Skeeter loads) shot through it than magnums. I hunt whitetails, and a 245 grain SWC going 900ish fps is plenty for any of those that walk.

Again, not disparaging the .45 Colt, I love it.

Yeah, my favorite big bores are .44 and .45. I have some cowboy 180 grain .45 Colts that are real easy shooting. In .44 I tend to prefer Specials to Magnums just because I don't need the extra punishment of the Magnums--nor of the heavier .45 Colts. The GS I bought the Charter Arms .45 Colt Bulldog at said never shoot more than 250 grain out of it.

 

[Smaug]

Fun poll; thanks for posting it.

For me, it is the 45 ACP. Yep, it wasn't DESIGNED as a revolver cartridge, but was made into one in WW1. Handloading for it is easy, as we don't have all this extra case capacity to deal with as a result of it originally being a blackpowder cartridge. I just love the moonclip reloads, too. Load & unload moon clips at home and they're ready to rock in the field; much nicer than speed loaders.

Mike Venturino did a good write-up justifying it here: https://americanhandgunner.com/handguns/the-best-ever-revolver-cartridge/
His handload with the Auto Rim brass and wadcutter bullet looks like a real peach!

​

I admit it's not as versatile as the 44 Mag/44 Spl or 45 Colt / 454 Casull, but I feel like hunting is best done with rifles anyway, and I don't want that 454 recoil in a handgun. (75% more than a full power 44 Magnum!)

Since it's not technically a revolver cartridge, I voted for 44 Mag:

• It has a great selection of guns that will shoot it
• It's powerful enough for big game out to 125 yards or so (if I ever do that)
• It can be down-loaded to make a nice target/plinking load
• It has a great selection of reloading components

454 Casull is a close 2nd, because it can do all the same things, it's just that I would never need/want to shoot a full power load, so why bother? (OK, maybe in a Rossi 92 carbine)

 

[DR505]

Fun poll; thanks for posting it.

For me, it is the 45 ACP. Yep, it wasn't DESIGNED as a revolver cartridge, but was made into one in WW2.

You meant to say WWI didn't you? The Colt New Service 1917 and S&W 1917 both were chambered in .45 ACP for use in WWI.