Big bore revolvers

[jwp475]

Fella's;

Well, in a word, no. When looking at four sources, Hornady X, Speer 14, Hodgdon's 2016, and John Taffin tests the .475 Linebaugh, it becomes obvious that the pressure differences can be substantially more than 2000 psi. Also keep in mind that the published data has to acknowledge that none of the alternative firearms have the brute strength of a Freedom Arms unit. And then there's the .475 Maximum, or .475 Linebaugh Long. You may also wish to read the on-line article from gun-tests dot com whose headline reads: "Ruger's New .480 Pales Next To The Linebaugh".

900F

2000 psi difference is all it is according to SAAMI specs.

 

[Paladin7]

I'm a big fan of the 44 Magnum and think it would fit your needs and then some. I have a Lipsey's 3 3/4" Bisley... http://www.lipseysguns.com/post/Ruger-Bisley-44-Magnum-Stainless-3-3Quarter-barrel.aspx

I purchased this because I wanted a packable 44 Magnum, that was comfortable with heavy loads... this one fits the bill. Remember, Elmer Keith's 44 was a 4" S&W, so losing 1/4" is not a problem to me. I can easily hit a torso sized target at 75 yards with it all day long. It is very accurate, easy to pack and suitably powerful for all my needs. The Bisley grip frame really tames recoil. People are surprised by how shootable it is. I can easily go through 100 rounds at the range. With the 44, you can shoot Specials and since you reload, it is very easy to get components that won't break the bank. Bullet styles are endless.

Let us know what you decide...

 

[MaxP]

Fella's;

Well, in a word, no. When looking at four sources, Hornady X, Speer 14, Hodgdon's 2016, and John Taffin tests the .475 Linebaugh, it becomes obvious that the pressure differences can be substantially more than 2000 psi. Also keep in mind that the published data has to acknowledge that none of the alternative firearms have the brute strength of a Freedom Arms unit. And then there's the .475 Maximum, or .475 Linebaugh Long. You may also wish to read the on-line article from gun-tests dot com whose headline reads: "Ruger's New .480 Pales Next To The Linebaugh".

900F

That article is rife with mistakes. The writer was basing his comparison on the weakest and most milquetoast of early .480 Ruger loads. Yes, they did pale next to the .475, however, they were a low pressure plinking load in reality. I have owned a .480 since 2001 and have had five to date. I performed endurance testing for Ruger and their new .480 SBH. I have also owned a couple of .475s over the years (customs) and actually own a .475 Maximum -- which has no SAAMI specifications as it never became a commercial reality nor was it necessary as it really doesn't do more -- oh, don't get me wrong, it does kick a lot more than either of the smaller cartridges, but that is about it. So, I am more than casually familiar with all of the rounds in question here.

The SAAMI maximum for the .480 Ruger is 47,862 psi, while the SAAMI max for the .475 Linebaugh is 50,038 psi. While the difference will buy you some velocity, big-game will probably not notice whether it has been poked by a .475 or its little brother, the .480.

I too have written a bit about this stuff, but I have actually dragged these various calibers out to the field to see how they do on animal flesh, and again, there's not a lot of difference between them.

 

[CraigC]

In a word, yes. SAAMI spec for the .480 is 48,000psi and it's 50,000psi for the .475.

I hope you realize that MaxP has written three books on this subject.

The article you link to is bogus. The comparison is based solely on the factory 325gr Hornady load, which is only running 1350fps and well under 40,000psi. Those of us who actually handload for, hunt with and shoot these guns, know that's 150fps behind full pressure handloads. There is no mention of heavy 425gr loads, which run 1200fps. Which is about 100fps behind the .475.

There is so much wrong with the Gun-Tests article, I hardly know where to begin. It's not worth the HTML it's printed on.

Here's the link:

http://www.gun-tests.com/issues/13_...es-Next-to-the-Linebaugh-Brothers-4706-1.html

Quotes from the article:

"The new Ruger cartridge has a slightly shorter case and significantly less power than the .475 Linebaugh."
Utter nonsense.

"...the new Ruger .480 does not do anything the Super Redhawk in .45 LC or 454 Casull can’t do."
More nonsense.

"He told us you’d have about a one-year wait for your conversion."
Right now that's at least 3yrs.

"The Linebaugh had them visible, which we preferred. Also, there was not enough steel on the .500’s cylinder to make the chambers recessed."
More BS.

"We taped up the Freedom grip to closely match the Ruger Bisley grip shape. This was an improvement, but was not enough to compensate for an inappropriate grip design by Freedom Arms, which includes a hand-banging boss at the top of the grip that is not present on the Ruger Bisley."
More BS.

"We’re sorry to put it this way, but if you want the full power of either the .475 or .500 Linebaugh—enough power to drop an elephant—in a package you can wear on your hip all day, you should pay the price for a custom revolver built by Bowen, Linebaugh, or one or two other gunsmiths, or Freedom Arms. The latter revolvers are not as comfortable for most shooters as those built on the Ruger Bisley frame, but they do have the full-power chambering. The new Ruger is not in the same league and is, we believe, something of a mistake. We think only Ruger collectors and a few hunters will find it acceptable."
More words for the unknown author to eat. Who is a moron comparing the portability of a 5½" Bisley to a 9½" Super Redhawk. My own 7½" SRH .480 is a mere 6oz heavier than my Bisley .500, which is nearly three inches shorter. The .480 has been a rousing success and the writer should have left himself a little more room here. As it stands, 16yrs later, he has egg all over his face.

 

[CraigC]

When looking at four sources, Hornady X, Speer 14, Hodgdon's 2016, and John Taffin tests the .475 Linebaugh, it becomes obvious that the pressure differences can be substantially more than 2000 psi.

Did you actually look at Speer #14? If you had, you might have noticed how much higher the 325gr velocities were than that crap article. You might have also noticed the HIGHER velocities for the 325gr in the .480 than for the .475. One might attribute this to the difference in barrel length but the .475 was an FA, which will usually yield higher velocities than a more pedestrian production gun.

 

[MaxP]

Another gem from that article: "The Linebaugh had them visible, which we preferred. Also, there was not enough steel on the .500’s cylinder to make the chambers recessed. The .500 case is noticeably larger than the .475 case."

Guess someone had better tell that to Jack Huntington as the .500 Maximum (seen here in this photo) he built for me clearly uses a counter-bored cylinder.

 

[jwp475]

1400 fps with 420 grain hardcast is possibles with the 475. I think 1400 fps is much harder to shoot than 1200 fps and 120 with a 420 grain bullet is a formable load for very large game.

 

[CB900F]

Fella's;

I do own, reload for, and hunt with a .475 Linebaugh. My normal load uses a Cast Performance 425 grain gas check that exits the muzzle, over an Oehler 35P, at 1250 fps. That's 25 grains of bullet heavier than Speer's .480 load with their 400 grain bullet, & over 60 fps faster. Furthermore, there's no indications whatsoever that that's a maximum load. However, it is in a Freedom Arms model 83 that achieves that muzzle velocity out of a 6 inch barrel, not the 9.5 inches shown in Speer #14 for the .480. Guys, it takes more pressure to do that, and more than 2000 lbs. I do believe. That being said, I do not have a means to evaluate pressures.

I will note that when the .454 Casull became a SAAMI spec'd cartridge and other manufacturer's than Freedom Arms began producing guns for the round that the maximum pressure limits were lowered significantly from loading data developed by Freedom Arms and Dick Casull.

900F

 

[jwp475]

Fella's;

I do own, reload for, and hunt with a .475 Linebaugh. My normal load uses a Cast Performance 425 grain gas check that exits the muzzle, over an Oehler 35P, at 1250 fps. That's 25 grains of bullet heavier than Speer's .480 load with their 400 grain bullet, & over 60 fps faster. Furthermore, there's no indications whatsoever that that's a maximum load. However, it is in a Freedom Arms model 83 that achieves that muzzle velocity out of a 6 inch barrel, not the 9.5 inches shown in Speer #14 for the .480. Guys, it takes more pressure to do that, and more than 2000 lbs. I do believe. That being said, I do not have a means to evaluate pressures.

I will note that when the .454 Casull became a SAAMI spec'd cartridge and other manufacturer's than Freedom Arms began producing guns for the round that the maximum pressure limits were lowered significantly from loading data developed by Freedom Arms and Dick Casull.

900F

Go to the SAAMI web site and check it out for yourself. 480 Ruger max average pressure is 48,000 PSI and the 475 Linebaugh is 50,000 PSI. The 454. SAAMI max average pressure is 65,000 PSI. Some manufacturers of 454 do not load to SAAMI max average pressure but some do. I like my 454 loads to be around 50,000 PSI or lower.

 

[CB900F]

Jwp475;

I don't doubt that that's what the SAAMI specs are. However, what I strongly suspect is that the current SAAMI pressure specs are below what was originally produced by Freedom Arms loads when they were the sole commercial provider of .475 Linebaugh guns.

Note: Commercial supplier, which excludes the various specialty gunsmith's who also produced revolvers in that caliber.

900F

 

[jwp475]

Jwp475;

I don't doubt that that's what the SAAMI specs are. However, what I strongly suspect is that the current SAAMI pressure specs are below what was originally produced by Freedom Arms loads when they were the sole commercial provider of .475 Linebaugh guns.

Note: Commercial supplier, which excludes the various specialty gunsmith's who also produced revolvers in that caliber.

900F

If at anytime a test round of Ammo exceeds the maximum allowable pressure even if max average pressure is not exceeded during the test session the load is backed down.
I'm not saying that happened with the 475 but it happens.
Hornady factory loads have always been below the top velocity of other makers.

 

[CB900F]

jwp475;

Yes, I understand that, I know the process. What I'm talking about though is what occurred before the .475 became a SAAMI round. SAAMI has to certify that their information is safe in whatever firearms are available on the commercial market at the time the information is produced. So, the weakest product determines the cap pressure.

900F

 

[USSR]

I've been looking at Blackhawks and super Blackhawks in 45 LC and 44 mag. I'm leaning towards the colt cartridge. I'm not set on single actions. Not wanting to get into really powerful cartridges like 454 and 500.

Just wondering how this thread got twisted into a .475 .vs .480 slug fest when the OP said he didn't want to go there?

Don

 

[MaxP]

Just wondering how this thread got twisted into a .475 .vs .480 slug fest when the OP said he didn't want to go there?

Don

The OP was looking for options and then stated he didn't want anything too powerful like the .454 or .500s. In the third post, I suggested that another good option would be the .480 in a Super Blackhawk. The very next post, the OP stated his intrigue and started asking questions about the .480. CB900 then began talking .475 later in the thread. It was a natural progression.

 

[lagerratrobe]

Coming back to the OPs original question, I enjoy shooting the 45 Colt (LC) cartridge. It's not the most powerful of the big bore options, but if you own a Blackhawk and reload, you have plenty of power options. And you can buy it for around six-hundred bucks, new.

 

[USSR]

I also enjoy shooting the .45 Colt, lagerratrobe. And while I can't load my N frame to the same level as your Blackhawk, I have personally seen what a 265gr SWCHP at 1100fps does to the local deer.

Don

 

[MaxP]

Coming back to the OPs original question, I enjoy shooting the 45 Colt (LC) cartridge. It's not the most powerful of the big bore options, but if you own a Blackhawk and reload, you have plenty of power options. And you can buy it for around six-hundred bucks, new.

The .45 Colt is one cartridge that's hard to beat. It is a cartridge of many flavors.

 

[Gordon]

You cn get it new for around $850 .
http://www.ruger.com/products/redhawk/specSheets/5032.html

 

[Tallball]

A nice thing about these kinds of revolvers is that they're sturdy. I got my Ruger Super Blackhawk used last year. It was made in 1971, IIRC and seems to have been shot quite a bit. It still locks up very tight. I like the 7.5" barrels on it and my 45/45 Blackhawk - the long sight radius really helps my aging eyes. I am more accurate with either one than any other handgun I own... except for my Buck Mark and possibly my Single Six (both with long barrels). I can't remember if I paid $299 for the SBH or $399. No one else bid on it, I think because the finish is somewhat worn. The trigger is amazing.

 

[SlowFuse]

@Tallball is the SBH youre talking about your profile pic?

 

[Armybrat]

My SBH .44 is quite a handful with magnum loads, but with .44 Special it's like shooting a .38.

 

[jdmb03]

I'm in the same situation. I'm looking for a backpacking gun when in the upper peninsula. I'm leaning towards 45LC and something in a Ruger single action.

 

[Tallball]

Slowfuse - yep, that's it!