Ruger mini 14 vs AR15 accuracy challenge. Calling all Ruger Mini14 shooters

[Redneck with a 40]

As soon as I can get my mini out to shoot, I'll post up my results. I'll be shooting my handload's and my mini is scoped. I'm not really interested in the ammo, I just want to see if I can get (2) 2.5" goups. I think its doable.

 

[R.W.Dale]

As soon as I can get my mini out to shoot, I'll post up my results. I'll be shooting my handload's and my mini is scoped. I'm not really interested in the ammo, I just want to see if I can get (2) 2.5" goups. I think its doable.

I tip my hat to you sir!

I look forward to your submission

 

[C-grunt]

Well I should be going to the range on Sunday. Ill see what my old Colt 6520 can do. I hope I dont embarrass myself to much. maybe even throw in my M96 Swede for the hell of it, just so we have some more pictures here!

 

[X - Man]

Redneck with a 40, I agree with you, I also think it can be done. And like you, it's all about what my rifle can do.

The weather here has been terrible for shooting for weeks, and remains very muddy. First chance I get, it's off to the range.

I still beating the bushes looking for good target ammo, though.

 

[1KPerDay]

People that say Minis are inaccurate have never shot one.

My mini is inaccurate. And I've shot it. See?



It's a 195 series ranch rifle, scoped. Stock other than a m14-style flash hider (which is supposed to improve accuracy). That's 50 yards, prone, from a rest. 9 inch pie plate.

 

[Steve Marshall]

I bought a Mini Ranch many years ago. I put a Really really nice Tasco 3x9 on it and proceeded to shoot 5-6" groups at 100 yards. So I tried PMC. 5-6". I tried Remington Factory in several different iterations. 5-6". I tried Winchester. 5-6". Years later, I tried FGMM. 47/8-57/8"!!! Oh joy! Now I'm on to something. I reloaded Berger, Ballistic Tips, Lapua, and Hornady's. 41/2 -6". Now this might not be what krochus was looking for BUT-- you have to admit this was a consistent Mini. A few years ago, I traded it and 4 each Ruger 20's and 30's even up on a new Bushmaster.

 

[Redneck with a 40]

I'll have to prove it with a target post, but I'm getting 2.5" groups with my handload's and a 580 series Mini. My biggest groups are hovering right around 3" at 100 yards. The Mini has definitely improved from the early models.

My dad's 180 series will print 6" at 100 yards, mine is quite a bit more accurate than that.

 

[frankiestoys]

Redneck
thats about right
lets see those targets

 

[McBuck]

I am not a semi-auto guru, but I would call this a decent 50yd group for a semi.
I was shooting Fiocchi 55gr FMJs out of a hot bbl. This was basically a 16 round mag dump. I have only shot this gun once before this range trip, and only had zeroed it at 25yds. This is with the factory peep sight too. My sight picture was holding the front post at the bottom of the larger orange dot to not completely obscure it. My eyes are old enough to barely make out the orange dot, so don't be too cruel on me. I am still contemplating on a scope as I like the gun without glass, but feel like a scope would make a huge difference with my less than stellar vision.

oops...forgot to tell you this was from a factory OOTB 580 Tactical Mini-14

 

[ThomasT]

Here is a link for a photo of one of the groups and the story for the straight taper 580 series mini I shot a while back. I did not have a good rest. This is only 50 yards. It is with open sights. I bought a new 580 with the tapered barrel and it shoots better. I sold the first mini. I wish I had it back. It was 3/4 of a pound lighter than the newest mini.

I plan on shooting my new gun at 100 yards and when I do I will post it. I did set up 6 2 liter coke bottles full of water and shot them at 75 yards. All but one bottle fell over when shot. So I shot it twice more. When I looked at the holes in each bottle if they had of been on one bottle the group would have been about two inches. Those were shot using a tree for support for my left hand and not off a bench.

http://www.perfectunion.com/vb/showthread.php?p=508464#post508464

If you click on the link for some reason it lands in the middle of the page. Jump to the top to see the whole thread.

 

[frankiestoys]

Ratshooter
this shows that the 580 series is a better gun then the older mini , it still wont convince the judge or the mini haters but who cares anyway.
nice shooting.

 

[ThomasT]

Thanks Frankie. I forgot to take the allen wrench to adjust the rear sight with me. I was holding on the very bottom of the bull and was still shooting high.

I don't know why so many people badmouth the mini. It never was pushed by ruger to compete one on one with the AR as far as I know. I could have bought an AR just as easy as a mini, I just like the way the mini felt in my hands over the AR. A personal choice. We can still make those. You just can't make them without someone jumping up and telling you how wrong you are and that you should have bought what they would have bought.

 

[McBuck]

On AR's ? Personally, I carried one for five years and never did like those "Mattel" knock offs. Always rattling around in a CUCV, catching more dust than a Hoover, and generally being a pain in the rear to clean and keep running properly. These were the old A1's mind you , and while they shot relatively well and would hold a zero they did tend to be what we called "jam-masters", especially when they got a little dirty after a long night fire, or a few days at Hohenfels. I never could get used to the things. I always shot "Expert", and I use that term loosely because mot many GI's could tell you the muzzle velocity, energy or bullet weight of a 556mm NATO. The gun(s) were not comfortable to shoot. Recoil felt like a little girl trying to slap a plastic cork gun out of your hands and follow up sight pictures are terrible on em. I always thought those goofy carry handles were for girls who didn't know how to properly carry a weapon, and what is up with that 3" tall front sight. No, no...I will stay with the little brother of what Patton called "the finest battle implement ever invented."

I'll get back to the range and get a yard 5 shot group as soon as I can. Heck, I hope I can even see 100 yards through a peep sight !

 

[X - Man]

Preliminary Target Photos

Photos of three targets I shot last week:
.

100 yards, from a prone position off a sandbag. Used Federal 223 Rem 55 gr. FMJ, value pack. My Mini is a Ranch S/S 188 series 1 in 7 twist, with a Bushnell Sportsview 3 x 9 scope. (Once I'm satisfied and document the performance of my Mini I'm going to remove the scope). The Mini has its original barrel, with many mods made for improved performance. That's another posting topic.

I call these targets preliminary for two reasons. These show the Mini's groupings before cryo-treatment, as the process is being done to the rifle currently. After treatment target photos will be shown when I get back out to the range later.

Also, I shot two single groups of five rounds, in a time of three minutes per group, and reloaded the magazine between groups. For the final target submission two groups of five rounds each must be shot in the three minute time limit. This time criteria is the standard set by Krochus and will ensure that target results reflect the consistency of the rifle and shooter.

I couldn't see using more ammo than necessary in this first round of shooting. The second round will test how well this Mini, with its new cryo-treatment, holds up under the time allotted.

Thanks to Krochus, he has been very helpful in the review, photographing and plotting of these targets.

 

[R.W.Dale]

Photos of three targets I shot last week:
.

100 yards, from a prone position off a sandbag. Used Federal 223 Rem 55 gr. FMJ, value pack. My Mini is a Ranch S/S 188 series 1 in 7 twist, with a Bushnell Sportsview 3 x 9 scope. (Once I'm satisfied and document the performance of my Mini I'm going to remove the scope). The Mini has its original barrel, with many mods made for improved performance. That's another posting topic.

I call these targets preliminary for two reasons. These show the Mini's groupings before cryo-treatment, as the process is being done to the rifle currently. After treatment target photos will be shown when I get back out to the range later.

Also, I shot two single groups of five rounds, in a time of three minutes per group, and reloaded the magazine between groups. For the final target submission two groups of five rounds each must be shot in the three minute time limit. This time criteria is the standard set by Krochus and will ensure that target results reflect the consistency of the rifle and shooter.

I couldn't see using more ammo than necessary in this first round of shooting. The second round will test how well this Mini, with its new cryo-treatment, holds up under the time allotted.

Thanks to Krochus, he has been very helpful in the review, photographing and plotting of these targets.

Nice Please keep us posted on your progress

 

[Hammerhead6814]

Two years ago when Mini-14's were being sold for $500~, I'd have rooted for them.

But now Ruger and they're dealers decided they're $200~ to build rifles are now worth $600-$700, I'm all for the AR-15's. Even though I still think they're the bastard child of Eugene Stoner's AR-10.

GO AR-15's!!!

 

[Casefull]

I am not supplying any targets but I have 3 mini 14s and more ar style rifles and the rugers suck in the accuracy dept., as in I could not believe how inaccurate they are. It is 1 to 2 in for the ar's and 4 in plus for the rugers.

 

[BillCh]

"...and never did like those "Mattel" knock offs.."

I've been watching this thread for a while.
The M16A1/"AR" was my issue weapon. It failed me twice, Once when I needed it most.
Never again.
A cheap-o piston gun is my preference now. They just shoot.
Any AR is second best.

I've got a Mini-14, never clean it or anything, just shoot it. I've never had a FTF.
Lets try that with an AR.

B

 

[McBuck]

"It failed me twice, Once when I needed it most."

I know men who have a limp from those failures. What is worse, is those men can tell you tales of men that lost their lives from those failures. I don't recall a Mini ever costing a mans life because it didn't go bang when it was supposed to. That is the legacy of an AR...IMO.

 

[X-Rap]

I know men who have a limp from those failures. What is worse, is those men can tell you tales of men that lost their lives from those failures. I don't recall a Mini ever costing a mans life because it didn't go bang when it was supposed to. That is the legacy of an AR...IMO.
__________________

We will never know the reliability of the great "mini" under combat conditions other than the hundredth of a percentage that were used by prisons and leo. I bet if the stats were run there is a greater failure rate.
No matter, what does matter is that the mini in all its greatness has never been the primary weapon of any country aside from those tinpot dictatorships from the A Team television program.

Through out history you will find evidence that all the weapons used in war have failed and likely cost someone. Putting up a caricature of a former battle weapon as if it were the original as a comparison is a joke and hardly worth noting except that there is a following that persists on making the claim as though the US would be better armed like BA Baracus or Hannible Hays.

Perhaps a black van would be better than an MRAP for a patrol vehicle.

 

[FRJ]

I have several targets with groups shot during load development on my Mini 14. They are all under 1" but it was done with a 4X scope as I am 65 years young and my eyes are not what they used to be. If I knew how to transfer them from the my pictures section of my computer to this site I would. Can anyone help? If so please send me a PM. Thank You FRJ

 

[67rschev]

Hello All ,
I'm over from the Perfect Union forum and thought i would drop in and say hello . I wanted to jump in on this 'Challenge' and post a few targets for ya . I'm a relatively new Mini owner and just love the feel of these nice little cheap carbines . This target was shot today with my new 581 Ruger Mini 14 Tach series rifle . I did do quite a bit of research before i bought this weapon and knew the early minis were god awful with stringing in the accuracy department , so i opted for one of the new ' hammer forged ' taper barrel model . I also wanted the factory threaded end , with flash suppressor too , cause they seem to help with barrel harmonics , and hence accuracy . The only thing i really didn't like was the synthetic tactical stock , so i immediately swapped out with a nice Birch model , ala ebay , before i even put a round down the chamber . Woood is Goood an I'm a 'plastic' is for pistols kind of guy , and if i wanted a ' black ' gun ...... well I woulda probably wound up with an AR like the rest of you . Did i mention it was ' Cheap ' ? ...... Or should i say inexpensive . Like $597 cheap . Any way , only a few little tweaks , the usual re-torque of the gas block cause Ruger cant seem to get that right , floated the block , worked the trigger over which wasn't all that bad new , and some major polishing of the receiver and bolt .
This target was shot today , at 100 yards using bags , and was well within the 3 minute time limit . I Was using the WW Federal 100 bulk pack 55 gn rounds and was pretty surprised with the results . I did use a 60 $ BEC 4 x optic for this round , but i was just trying to put some rounds on paper to see where i was at . The break in was all done using some Russkie rounds out doors , plinking at clays , dumping mags on unsuspecting inanimate objects and such , so i had no real idea how it was shooting . My measurements from today came in close to the Target program , at 2.828 for the first group low and left . 3 clicks up and 3 to the right , and the second group which i measured at 1.326 . The targeting program showed the first at 2.951 with 2.818moa and second at 1.104 with 1.054moa . I will try with the irons next week with cheapo ammo and post , lets hope my eyes can get it done . After that , onto working up some hand loads and do the two target deal first with the POS scope , and then my tired old eyes . I'm not after the ammo , just out to see what this weapon is capable of and share with the non believers . These are really nice little capable guns , and serve their intended purpose well . Did i mention , U can pick one up for under 600 bucks ?

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Bye the way , nice little forum you guys got here . Some great info here and hopefully i can contribute . Pic of the Mini is old , wearing a red dot for break in . Its just a hoot to dump 20 rounds at 50 meters , but you can only measure that by a ' minute of a man ' , and when SHTF , thats what we are gonna be measuring .

 

[benzy2]

How much was the stock? You don't add it into your price list. Good groups for sure, especially with bulk ammo. Not sure I would say $600 is inexpensive in this game. In fact its fairly close to the base model AR that has been in comparison in many of these threads. If it is a good deal is up each owner, but in this context I wouldn't put as an overly cheap/inexpensive rifle. In the end if you are happy with how it shoots its a keeper, be it better or worse than what the other guy has.

 

[McBuck]

Hey !! 67rschev !! How much did you pay for that gun again ?!?
I think I have $700.00 in mine and that includes two factory 20 mags , two aftermkt 30 mags, sling, and a hard case.

 

[SSN Vet]

I don't recall a Mini ever costing a mans life because it didn't go bang when it was supposed to.

Well seeing that the mini has never been selected as a "issue" weapon for combat troops and the AR has hundreds of thousands of combat man hours under it's belt, being carried daily in every American war since Nam, I think this is a pretty meaningless statement.

How many home defense failiures or LEO failures which can be documented as being attributed to a failure of the AR system can you point us to?

Here's an equally meaningfull comparison....

I don't recall a M60 Marlin ever costing a mans life because it didn't go bang when it was supposed to.

Love your Mini and 'ol sell out Bill all you want.... the fact is that the Mini is untested in combat.