Steve762us
Member
- Joined
- Jun 26, 2011
- Messages
- 219
Sneak over on a new moon and shallowly-bury several large jugs of
tannerite in the backstop...
tannerite in the backstop...
To start with, I would like you or anyone else who is interested to get on Google Earth and look up Springersville, IN. The part being discussed is the northeast corner with the Springersville, Road on the south and CR 450E on the west. My shop is the larger building out by itself with a red roof near a smaller building with the same color roof (utility shed) slightly to the south and east of the shop. The rental house, partially obscured by trees, is the third house east of the intersection on the north side of Springersville Road.
This isn’t about noise.
They are shooting from a point less than fifty feet from the road at a backstop about twenty feet from the property line. If they were the neighbor to the north, well over 100 yards away, and shooting east where a missed backstop wouldn’t be any big thing because there are no houses for miles let alone close by and in sight.
I believe your first course of action is to talk to the renters and express your concern.The renters have built a log backstop of maybe eight feet wide by six feet tall that is positioned so my shop is almost directly down range, and in the summertime when I’m mowing there have been occasions when I was directly downrange when they decided to start shooting.
The log backstop is probably adequate as long as nothing, like an accidental discharge, happens and they miss the backstop.I looked you up and you're right. They should not be shooting there.
On the subject of your own safety, do you think their log backstop is actually stopping the bullets? And where on the satellite photo is it located?
The log backstop is probably adequate as long as nothing, like an accidental discharge, happens and they miss the backstop.
If you look closely, north and a little east of the third house there is a tree that is a brighter shade of green than the others. A little south and east of that tree is a circular area that is lighter than the area around it. That is the approximate area of the back stop.
In spite of a previous post implying that I’m anti-gun and trying to shut down shooting ranges, all I am concerned with is getting shot by an accidental shot fired by someone who doesn’t know enough about gun safety, or doesn’t care enough, to fire when the potential of something bad happening exists.
The renters have built a log backstop of maybe eight feet wide by six feet tall that is positioned so my shop is almost directly down range
Again, have you talked to the renters?when I’m mowing there have been occasions when I was directly downrange when they decided to start shooting.
If you read all the posts you will know that I haven’t and why. But to save you some trouble. The owners of every house surrounding the renters have asked them not to and they have all been told they can get stuffed. There is no point in me adding my voice to the ignored.Again, have you talked to the renters?
First of all, I am not a lawyer but spent decades as state government worker federally licensed to investigate and enforce applicable city/county/state/federal ordinances, regulations and laws of health care facilities which resulted in many directors and managers being terminated when found in violation of them that led to negative outcome/harm. (Our district office actually sent some to state prison and they are still serving time)The owners of every house surrounding the renters have asked them not to and they have all been told they can get stuffed. There is no point in me adding my voice to the ignored.
Just because every neighbor demanded that you drive electric only vehicle does not make it right if you don't want to and if there is no mandate for you to do so.The owners of every house surrounding the renters have asked them not to and they have all been told they can get stuffed.
If you read all the posts you will know that I haven’t and why. But to save you some trouble. The owners of every house surrounding the renters have asked them not to and they have all been told they can get stuffed. There is no point in me adding my voice to the ignored.
Local LE has said that no law is being violated. They have been there, they have seen the lay of the land, and they have said sorry can’t help ya. Talking to the renters as a prerequisite of making a complaint is kind of pointless when it has already been stated that what they are doing is permissible.First of all, I am not a lawyer but spent decades as state government worker federally licensed to investigate and enforce applicable city/county/state/federal ordinances, regulations and laws of health care facilities which resulted in directors and managers being terminated when found in violation of them. (Our district office actually sent some to state prison and they are still serving time)
I am actually on your side and agree that being down range while the renters are shooting is concerning and potentially dangerous.
But if you are planning to take any action, especially after local LE told all the neighbors the renters are not violating county ordinances, you must first establish why you have a safety concern of being directly down range when the renters were shooting.
And that requires you directly notifying/informing the renters. If I was the person conducting the investigation, my first question to the renters would be, "Did anyone notify you that they were concerned?"
If no, my question to the neighbor would be, "Why did you not inform/notify the renters?"
And if yes, my question would be, "What were the expressed concerns?" (I would expect noise/disturbance, safety concerns, etc. as most cities/counties have community disturbance ordinances, particularly if they disrupt normal hours of sleep, etc.)
Then I would collect facts/evidence of concerns to see if any applicable county ordinances were violated (Quiet hours, requirement for sufficient backstop if such exists, etc.).
But as local LE already told the neighbors, apparently there was no violation of applicable ordinances.
Having said that, ordinances/regulations/laws can change or new ones written all the time (Heck, anti gun law makers do it on a daily basis. )
So then you can find out what it would take to do such a thing but since this is a gun forum and I am assuming you are a supporter of gun rights/2A, I would caution against any attempt to erode our gun rights/2A.
Now, if I was the renter and my neighbors reasonably approached me in a friendly manner, I would have discussed shooting option solutions that would make my neighbors less concerned and happier. Perhaps one such solution is a "safer" neighborhood designated shooting area in a different location. Of course that would require some planning and work but would be a better option than a bunch of pissed off neighbors against renters who are exercising their 2A rights without violating any county ordinance.
Just because every neighbor demand that you drive electric only vehicle does not make it right if you don't want to if there is no mandate for you to do so.
And none of us were there so we have to take your word how the renters were approached by the neighbors, which BTW is second hand information as you yourself did not directly talk to the renters.
Who knows, put yourself in the renters position and a bunch of angry neighbors told you, "Are you crazy? You can't shoot there!" So you check with local LE and county ordinances and they say you can. Well, would you then tell the angry neighbors to get stuffed too?
Of course, my opinions only.
I have a workshop in a very small rural crossroads community. The building is ... over 100 yards from both of the two county roads ... is a rental.
So if there is no county ordinance violation as far as distance to road/structure, what do you plan to do?Local LE has said that no law is being violated. They have been there, they have seen the lay of the land, and they have said sorry can’t help ya.
You might have been searching for Fayette county Indiana, but from what I see that is from Fayette county Mississippi. Connersville in Indiana is Fayette county, Connelllsville, PA is also in Fayette county. There is a Fayette county in KY. Fayette is a popular name for counties.I found this 2016 article for Fayette County, IN that may be of interest to you - https://thecitizen.com/2016/05/11/ognio-fails-persuade-fayette-allow-target-shooting-10-acres/
"Ognio said a citizen with a 10-acre lot and a proper backstop was informed by code enforcement that he could not fire his rifle into the backstop. This occurred after the resident set up a target practice area and neighbors called county officials to complain."Perhaps you should contact the county and talk to code enforcement and find out how much land is required for private shooting range, how far away other people's property or buildings are required for private shooting range and any noise restriction.
I believe for rural counties, shooting on property must be done at least 50 yards from public roads.
here in Florida, you need a minimum of 10 acres and then you'd better have a safe backstop and not shoot towards other structures.
..any person who knowingly discharges a firearm in any public place or on the right-of-way of any paved public road, highway, or street, who knowingly discharges any firearm over the right-of-way of any paved public road, highway, or street or over any occupied premises, or who recklessly or negligently discharges a firearm outdoors on any property used primarily as the site of a dwelling as defined in s. 776.013 or zoned exclusively for residential use commits a misdemeanor of the first degree..
Any person who recreationally discharges a firearm outdoors, including target shooting, in an area that the person knows or reasonably should know is primarily residential in nature and that has a residential density of one or more dwelling units per acre, commits a misdemeanor of the first degree, punishable as provided in s. 775.082 or s. 775.083. This subsection does not apply:
(a) To a person lawfully defending life or property or performing official duties requiring the discharge of a firearm;
(b) If, under the circumstances, the discharge does not pose a reasonably foreseeable risk to life, safety, or property;
If you read all the posts you will know that I haven’t and why. But to save you some trouble. The owners of every house surrounding the renters have asked them not to and they have all been told they can get stuffed. There is no point in me adding my voice to the ignored.
George P writes:
Here are quotes from the actual state statutes involved. There is no "ten acres requirement." Because Florida is still a "preemption state", local ordinances with tighter restrictions are not lawful.
Curiously, the first statute quoted only prohibits reckless or negligent discharge of a firearm on one's homesite. This law was amended fairly recently after press-generated hysteria over "backyard shooting ranges." The previous law prohibited the unsafe discharge of firearms on residential property, but this amended version seems only to be a re-phrase of the original. Still, I'm not about to test the legal determination of the new version's intent.
.. local LE have told them there is nothing that can be done. ...
....A private nuisance is a civil wrong; it is the unreasonable, unwarranted, or unlawful use of one's property in a manner that substantially interferes with the enjoyment or use of another individual's property, without an actual Trespass or physical invasion to the land.
...
an activity or physical condition that is indecent or offensive to the senses, or interferes with another person’s reasonable use and enjoyment of life or property.
Whether a property owner near you is creating a nuisance depends upon the unique facts and circumstances of the situation....
...None of the neighbors who live out there are happy about them shooting so close to everybody,....
And why I suggested you contact the county code enforcement to find out.Codes here can be interesting.
And agree with Frank's comment that you could find out if any past complaint for noise/safety concern resulted in forcing another neighbor to stop shooting on their property.Perhaps you should contact the county and talk to code enforcement
LE ... think in terms of a specific law which prohibits something and which is being violated
... Your chances for a good outcome will depend on local law, including applicable case law, and the exact facts.
So the OP could consider getting together with his neighbors and sharing the cost of a consultation with a lawyer. A knowledgeable, local lawyer should be able to assess the situation under local law and help pursue appropriate litigation if it would be worthwhile.