Semi, bolt, or lever action .22 LR?

[cosine]

I'm thinking of getting a .22 LR rifle for target plinking, but don't know whether I want to get a bolt action rifle like the CZ 452, a lever action like the Marlin 39A, or a semi action like the Ruger 10/22. I'd like to hear what are the advantages/disadvantages of all three types of action, how they work, and if one is inherently better than the others for a beginner like me.

I've searched, but didn't get anything that specifically answered these questions. I'm new to this whole rifle thing, so I'll probably have more questions later!

Thanks for your help.

 

[America_without_liberals]

For pure plinking, nothing beats a tube fed semi. I have an old Marlin. I think the model is 60, I'd have to look.

You have to decide if you will also hunt with this. Here in PA we are not allowed to hunt with s/a weapons. If this is also the case in WI you may want to go with the bolt or lever action.

 

[Brian Williams]

I have to say I really love to shoot my Marlin 39m

 

[cslinger]

Well I have examples of all three.

1-Marlin 39A Golden
1-Ruger 10/22 stainless bone stock
1-Ruger 10/22 fully decked out ($600+ in it)
1-CZ 452 with a trigger job (Sweetest trigger I have ever felt)

Tough choice for me. The Marlin and the CZ feel more like "real" guns. They have more pride of ownership. The CZ is EXTREMELY accurate with any 40 grain .22 I feed it.

A bone stock 10/22 is fun but not all that moving. Spending the time and money to build it into something else is immensely fun and satisfying but gets pricey.

So if I could have only one plinker...........

I would rule out the stock 10/22. Just not as cool or as much pride of ownership as the others and costs a decent amount to build into something personal.

I would rule out the CZ 452 only because I feel it is a more serious gun then for plinking all around duty. If you go with a 452 spend the money to put good glass on it and start shooting single holes with it.

That leaves me with the Marlin 39 as the best all around plinker. Here is why.
1)19 rounds of .22 long rifle, thats a lot of ammo on board.
2)Feels like a real, high quality, well made firearm....because it is.
3)Shines with iron sights. Maybe add a peep sight or buckhorn style but is basically good to go out of the box.
4)It is a lever gun and not only do they look good they are just spectacular fun to cycle. Shoot fast or slow.
5)Great gun for indoor or outdoor ranges.
6)All in all the most versitile of the three IMO

So basically the Marlin edges out the CZ but only by a nose and only because I am placing an emphasis on it being a plinker.

CZ 452 Varmint with Bushnell Elite Scope.

10/22s from affordable plinker to you paid how much for that?

Marlin 39A and an old Winchester 62 pump .22

 

[BozemanMT]

for plinking, nothing beats a semi. (just for pure blowing stuff up fun)

for accuracy a bolt

a lever just for fun.

but just for plinking, an accurate (which excludes the 10/22, ohhhh, did I say that outloud? ) semi-auto is a hoot

 

[cosine]

Thanks for all the replies so far, especially cslinger's! I am leaning towards a lever or bolt action, because I want something that will work well, be accurate, and be fun to shoot right out of the box with no customization. When I said plinker, I meant just general, all-around target shooting, both at paper and at other objects.

I plan on shooting with the stock iron sights that come with the gun, no fancy scopes or anything.

I have another question: How hard is it to shoot a lever action from a benchrest position? The lever's underneath the gun, is there room to cycle the action without lifting the gun up off the rest? That's one concern I had with a lever action over a bolt.

I guess I should mention that this will be my first firearm.

 

[ArmedBear]

IMHO, the novelty of shooting a semiauto fades rapidly. A few misfeeds and a few cleanings, and it seems as much a PITA as anything. At some ranges, you dump shells on the guy next to you; people get bent out of shape about it at some places. Still, I'm a hankerin' for a Browning SA 22, but I'm too cheap to buy one. I'm over the 10/22, though I'll probably keep mine so I have a little scoped gun that won't bum me out if I trash it.

Bolt actions clean up the easiest and provide the best accuracy, and now there are good ones for good prices. For a while, there were .22 bolties, and there were affordable .22's, but there weren't a lot of good affordable .22 bolties. Savage, CZ, et al. have changed the equasion a lot.

Lever guns are, well, lever guns. Fun and timeless. Some of the .22 lever guns are simply exceptional, like the Marlin 39, the Browning BL-22, and the Henry Octagon and Golden Boy models. None are as cheap as a basic 10/22, but they're fun and accurate; they're heirloom guns, especially the Marlin. The 9422 was probably the best Model 94 Winchester still made, up until they quit.

 

[cslinger]

Bolts are easier to shoot from the bench and a good CZ452 LUX with iron sights can grow into a great scoped gun later if you like.

I fully agree that you should learn to shoot iron sights first. Save the glass for later.

Levers do fine from the bench, if you are too low to cycle the lever straight down, just twist the gun slightly to the left or right and work the lever. No big thing at all. Harder then a bolt but not an issue in any sense.

If this is going to be your first gun I really do recommend either the Marlin or the CZ simply because both guns are just so nice that twenty years from now you will still look at them as something special. The 10/22 or most other affordable semi autos tend to be a bit cheap. Not BAD by any stretch of the imagination, loads of fun for sure but just not the same level of pride of ownership if that makes sense.

Based on your criteria I still think the Marlin 39 is your best bet. Besides there is something to be said for shooting the oldest still in production firearm. That kinda history is just so cool.

Chris

 

[cosine]

Bolt actions clean up the easiest

I like hearing that! I can be kinda lazy at times...

Hmm, maybe I'll regret posting this thread. I thought maybe the CZ 452 was just what I wanted. (It seems to get good reviews based on what I saw from searches here and at TFL) Now cslinger's selling me on a lever action instead!

Choices, choices... (and I have a tendency to have trouble making up my mind )

Hmm, gotta go find a range, maybe I can shoot both and see what I like...

 

[cslinger]

Don't stress too much about it. You will love either one and besides your original comment should read.

"This is my first gun..........of many."

You will likely end up with all three at some point.

As an aside if you end up moving towards the CZ take a look at the 453. The 453 is an updated version of the 452, only it comes with CZs excellent SET trigger. This basically means you can move the trigger slightly forward to sort of pre cock it. What you end up with is a trigger that basically breaks with breath of air. You either set it or shoot it as normal where the trigger is good but much longer in comparison. Definitely the way to go if you can get a 453 over the 452.

Chris who is working from home and playing a little electronic hooky today.

 

[cosine]

As an aside if you end up moving towards the CZ take a look at the 453. The 453 is an updated version of the 452, only it comes with CZs excellent SET trigger. This basically means you can move the trigger slightly forward to sort of pre cock it. What you end up with is a trigger that basically breaks with breath of air. You either set it or shoot it as normal where the trigger is good but much longer in comparison. Definitely the way to go if you can get a 453 over the 452.

Thanks for that extra bit of information.

I've just been looking at the specs of these rifles and I just noticed that some CZ 452 and 453 models don't come with sights. Is that a problem? I want to learn to shoot with sights, but what do you do if your rifle didn't come with sights? Shoot without sights? Can you have iron sights added by a gunsmith for a slight extra charge? Otherwise, this fact would seem to kinda rule out the CZ 453 for me.

 

[cslinger]

If looking at the CZ 452/453 you want to look for the following models.

The Special (Beechwood, cheaper stock)
The Scout (Small gun, cheaper stock)
The Trainer (Basically a Lux with a slightly cheaper beachwood stock)
FS (Manlicher full stock. /drool/
Lux (High end stock)
Ultra Lux (High end stock extra long barrel)

These all come with iron sights. You only buy a gun sans iron sights if you plan on putting a scope on it. I just looked and it does appear that the 453 only comes in Varmint or American styles and therefore no iron sights. So you are back to the 452 certainly not a bad thing.

The CZs that come with iron sights have pretty nice ones at that. My CZ is a Varmint model and does not have iron sights. The "American" model does not have iron sights either.

http://www.czusa.com/product_detail.php?id=3

I am half thinking I might need to get me one of these FS models. You are a bad influence.
http://www.czusa.com/product_detail.php?id=45

http://www.czusa.com/product_detail.php?id=5

 

[cosine]

I guess while I'm at it I should confirm that .22 LR is like the standard .22 ammo, right? I'm seeing other types of .22 ammo like .22 short, .22 Long, and .22 WMR as I look at rifle specs.

 

[cslinger]

Good question.

.22 Short
.22 Long
.22 Long Rifle
The above all fall in the basic .22 family. They basically the same bullet with different sized cases. As a rule tube fed guns like the Marlin 39 can shoot all three types. Magazine fed guns like the CZ or Ruger 10/22 cannot due to the fact that the magazines are designed to feed only one type.

By far the most common type is the .22 Long Rifle or .22LR. Actually this is pretty much the most common type of caliber PERIOD.

.22 WMR stands for .22 Winchester Magnum Rimfire Round. It is also known as .22 Magnum. This is a whole different ball of wax. It is still a rimfire. Still .22 but uses a good bit more powder and a larger case. There are some revolvers that come with two interchangeable cylinders to shoot each but as a rule .22 WMR guns only shoot .22 WMR and any of the above .22LR guns CANNOT shoot .22 Magnum.

.22 Magnum is much more costly. For your needs you want a .22LR or Long Rifle firearm.

Boy did you catch me on a good day. I am a wealth of useless information and relatively bored.

Chris

 

[cosine]

For your needs you want a .22LR or Long Rifle firearm.

Thanks. That's what I figured.

 

[Thirties]

"Thanks for all the replies so far, especially cslinger's! I am leaning towards a lever or bolt action, because I want something that will work well, be accurate, and be fun to shoot right out of the box with no customization. When I said plinker, I meant just general, all-around target shooting, both at paper and at other objects.

I plan on shooting with the stock iron sights that come with the gun, no fancy scopes or anything.

I have another question: How hard is it to shoot a lever action from a benchrest position? The lever's underneath the gun, is there room to cycle the action without lifting the gun up off the rest? That's one concern I had with a lever action over a bolt.

I guess I should mention that this will be my first firearm."


Cosine, plinking is not bench rest shooting. They are different things. If you want to shoot off a bench, look at a semi or a bolt. The lever interferes with the bechrest position.

But, for plinking the lever is a fine gun. I suggest you look beyond the Marlin, although it's a fine rifle indeed. The handier Browning BL-22 is also a fine lever .22, as is the less expensive Henry. In my humble opinion, the lever and the semiauto are both especially suitable for plinking.

Good luck with whatever you buy. And remember, there's no law that says you can only have one .22 plinking rifle.

Let me get something off my chest about the semiauto .22 rifle, and specifically the Ruger 10/22. Read my post in the link below about my Ruger 10/22 rifle . . .

http://www.rimfirecentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=131042


.

 

[Clipper]

Do yourself a favor though...

...And make sure you check out a Browning BL-22 before you buy. Beautifully built , finished and fitted, 5 pounds, 33 degree lever throw, trigger stays with the lever, too, so no pinched fingers, and mine would shoot 1" groups at 100 yards with CCI Stingers. I used a 4x scope with 1"tube in a set of Williams low mounts, but the factory sights are very good, and were actually sighted in at 50 yards, just like the manual said they would be...

 

[cosine]

Thanks Thirties and Clipper, especially for pointing me towards some other .22 rifles to consider. I'm a real beginner and don't know what's all out there to look at.

I guess I should ask, instead of just talking about what I don't know: What is the difference between plinking and benchrest shooting? I thought they both referred to shooting at targets just for fun.

 

[Thirties]

"What is the difference between plinking and benchrest shooting? I thought they both referred to shooting at targets just for fun."

Here is a very fancy rest which exagerates the differences to make a point...

http://www.cabelas.com/cabelas/en/t...parentType=index&parentId=cat20793&id=0024152


Bench rest shooting is rather formal, while plinking is quite informal.

While plinkig, you might have occasion to rest your rifle on, say, the hood of a car, on the trunk of a tree, or on a fencepost -- known as informal rests. But plinking also means walking around looking for interesting things to shoot, such as clumps of dirt, NECCO wafers, squirrels, tin cans, milk jugs filled with water, or trash found lying around. Plinking is something Huck Finn may have done with Tom Sawyer.

Bench rest shooting involves a bench and a rest. You do it sitting down. You may have a spotting scope at hand to check where your bullets hit the paper target. It is a form of target shooting where you are trying to elimanate the human or physical aspects of shooting. It is a form of target shooting. Bench rest is a test of the rifle's and the ammo's mechanical characteristics. Of course, it takes skill to learn how to aim the rifle precicely and consistantly. It is, after all, a sport, and usually has rules, judges and competative scores.

To put it very simply, plinking is done in spacious rural areas. Bench rest shooting is done at a rifle range. They are both fun.

By the way, I love my Browning BL-22. I chose it over the Marlin 39 which is also a nive lever rifle. But the Browning is lighter and handles much better for my taste. Both a well made rifles, and both are not cheap.

 

[ArmedBear]

I like hearing that! I can be kinda lazy at times...

The way I figure it, a gun that takes time and makes a mess when I come home is a gun I won't shoot very often. I love black powder revolvers and muzzleloaders, but I don't shoot them much because doing so is more a day's event than a quick hour's fun.

Lever guns clean up pretty easily, too. Anything that doesn't get large amounts of crud in the action is better by far than a semiauto. But bolties and break-actions are the easiest, because you can open the breech and clean the barrel directly. A brush and a few wet patches through the barrel, and a few wet patches to clean out the action, some oil, and you're done.

The Marlin 39 is similarly easy, since the action comes apart with a single screw you turn with a nickel.

 

[hksw]

IMO, if you are lookling for out of the box accuracy, the CZ452.

The CZs that come with iron sights have pretty nice ones at that.

With the exception of the Scout. Their rear sights are very rudimentary and adjust only for elevation. (Front sight drifts for windage, after you take the cover off first, of course.) They are grooved for rings though, (11 mm) and with a good scope will do less than 1" @ 50 yds easily with run of the mill ammo. The stock on the Scout, IMO, is quite better than a comparably priced and sized domestic rifle. I like the stock on the first Scout I got which was to be used to teach my nieces and nephew that I decided to keep it myself and bought another.



Still my Varmints shoot even better, IMO. My smallest group at 50 yds to date is with a 452 Varmint in .17 HMR at ~0.129" (5 rounds).

 

[CB900F]

Cosine;

I've had at least one example of each over the years. Short answer first; buy the CZ452/453. Hitting what you're shooting at is the best positive reinforcement. The CZ is the very probably the most accurate out of the box of the three types. If budget is a concern, look at the Savage MKII for about 1/2 the money of the CZ. Both bolt guns, but the CZ will almost certainly be more accurate. Not that the Savage isn't, but as the range stretches, the CZ wins.

The Marlin 39's are very sweet guns, highly accurate & built to last. Quality oozes from them. Very fun, long-lasting, well built, what's not to like? Nothing really, but the CZ will out-shoot them.

I've got Rugers 10/22's, plural. One is a full-on Volquartsen conversion done by Tom in the shop at Carroll Iowa. It is the most accurate gun I own, period. But, I also have serious money into it & it's a PITA to clean.

The Savage is easy to work on yourself without spending gobs of money. You will get a positive return on your investment of time with increased accuracy. If you look at a cost/accuracy ratio, this was my winner. But I sold it to the father of a young shooter who is also a lefty. Kinda of a pay forward thing.

Let us know what your decision is please.

900F

 

[pauli]

you can't go wrong with a 39a. or a 39m, for that matter, if you can find one.

i've got two 22 rifles - a 39a and a remington 572. both date from the early sixties, and both are shining examples of what a 22 rifle should be. they are solid, they are more accurate than i am, they are older than me, and they're going to outlast me anyway.

they're also both as heavy as my mossberg 500.

the nice thing about the 572 is that the controls exactly mirror an 870. well, it's a nice thing if you've *got* an 870... anyway, the rifle is the most solid feeling pump 22 i've encountered. most have a huge amount of forearm twist, which really turned me off about the winchester and taurus guns.

pump/lever 22s make for the most fun you can have with a given dollar amount of ammunition, flat out. figure out what you're set on, and then get a nice old used one in good condition.

 

[cosine]

Like CB900F said, I noticed that the CZ .22's would be a bit harder on the budget. I'll take a look at the Savage, but I think I want to get something nice, even if it means spending a bit more money.

So, I think I'll end up getting either a bolt action or a lever action. Brand: probably either CZ, Marlin, or Browning. I've just got to go to the gunshop now and take a look at those rifles in person. See what they feel like, and see what I like.

Let us know what your decision is please.

Sure will. It'll probably be a several months though before I actually get the rifle, I need to get my parents used to the idea.


P.S. I was browsing around the 'Net and found two other firearm sites:
www.rimfirecentral.com and
www.rimfirecentral.net

I recall hearing that one of those sites came first, and that the other is kind of a knock-off of the first site after someone got angry at someone else and so started their own site. Which site came first, and which is the "right" rimfirecentral site?

 

[rangerruck]

skip the ruger, you can get a used marlin mod 60 , with the feed tube that goes to the end of the bbl, holds 17 rounds, and get a cz , for the same cost of the ruger. no compromise.