Silencer Shop Deleted My Request

[Double Naught Spy]

So I got a new, integrally suppressed upper, just need to do the transfer. Did a Silencer Shop Trust, did the kiosk thing, etc. and 1 year and 4 months later, the shop doing the transfer tells me nothing is there. They tell me that I need to start the process over again. This is my 3rd trip to the shop and the last two times were "If we didn't call you, it ain't ready" but this time I asked that they look up things and that is when I learned everything is toast.

I log onto the website. I have a paid for tax stamp, sitting unused, and they show the status of my 2015 suppressor (that I have been using) and not being transferred, even though it is. ERRRRR.

So much incompetence. So much frustration.

 

[TacticalJanitor]

Yup. I finally decided to loan Uncle Sam $200, interest free with an unknown maturity date in an effort to buy my first suppressor last year. EFile had just spun up.

Four months later I received an email saying "Disapproved/Other" with no other explanation. Found that my $200 had been returned to my account.

During that entire time, there was no record of ANY history regarding ANYTHING in my Eforms login. Ever.

Called ATF twice. Talked to different people. Nobody knew anything.

LGS said that it was certainly not a rejection, and that I should start over. I declined.

Maybe someday I'll try again. Gov't is the devil.

 

[dogtown tom]

So I got a new, integrally suppressed upper, just need to do the transfer. Did a Silencer Shop Trust, did the kiosk thing, etc. and 1 year and 4 months later, the shop doing the transfer tells me nothing is there.

What do you mean?
The IS upper never arrived at your dealer?
Your dealer never uploaded your silencer to his SS inventory?
Or your paper Form 4 was never submitted?
Or approved?

What does "Silencer Shop Deleted My Request" mean?

They tell me that I need to start the process over again. This is my 3rd trip to the shop and the last two times were "If we didn't call you, it ain't ready" but this time I asked that they look up things and that is when I learned everything is toast.

Your Silencer Shop account should have shown your dealer assigning the serial# of your silencer to you.

I log onto the website. I have a paid for tax stamp, sitting unused, and they show the status of my 2015 suppressor (that I have been using) and not being transferred, even though it is. ERRRRR.

Thats normal. On a paper Form 4, Silencer Shop has no way to know when you got your approval. Once the check was cashed they were out of the loop. Only your dealer, you and ATF could know that info.

So much incompetence.

By who?

 

[dogtown tom]

Yup. I finally decided to loan Uncle Sam $200, interest free with an unknown maturity date in an effort to buy my first suppressor last year. EFile had just spun up.

Four months later I received an email saying "Disapproved/Other" with no other explanation. Found that my $200 had been returned to my account.

Every Disapproval I've received has an explanation attached.

During that entire time, there was no record of ANY history regarding ANYTHING in my Eforms login. Ever.

There wouldn't be. It would not show up in your eForms account because you do not possess the silencer
.

Called ATF twice. Talked to different people. Nobody knew anything.

Did you use the "Ask the Experts feature in eForms? Did your dealer?
When my customers get a disapproval, ATF has always been very fast with getting them the reason.

LGS said that it was certainly not a rejection, and that I should start over. I declined.

A disapproval most certainly is a rejection. Advising you to start over without know why you were disapproved is dumb on their part.

 

[TacticalJanitor]

Every Disapproval I've received has an explanation attached.



There wouldn't be. It would not show up in your eForms account because you do not possess the silencer
.


Did you use the "Ask the Experts feature in eForms? Did your dealer?
When my customers get a disapproval, ATF has always been very fast with getting them the reason.



A disapproval most certainly is a rejection. Advising you to start over without know why you were disapproved is dumb on their part.

Since you might know, what is the exact wording they use in a rejection? Being a bunch of Feds, I severely doubt they have any latitude when filling out these forms or making entries into the system.

Edit: Here is what was on the form:


In any case, I couldn't figure out what happened, and nobody at ATF could tell me. I clicked the "Ask the Experts" link three or four times and never received a response of any kind.

The second person I spoke to on the phone gave a different ATF email address to contact about the "issue". They didn't respond either.

It was a very frustrating experience.

This thread got me to wondering, so I took another look today. Are you saying that it is completely normal for NO INFORMATION at all to show in any of these categories on eforms.atf.gov?



I'd appreciate any helpful info or answers...from anyone.

 

[Double Naught Spy]

The shop checked. NADA. My tax stamp remains unused, but purchased. When I checked the website, all they show is 1 suppressor from 2015 that they show as awaiting approval. I have been shooting that suppressor since 2016. There is no record of the current transaction from Dec 2021

 

[horsemen61]

The shop checked. NADA. My tax stamp remains unused, but purchased. When I checked the website, all they show is 1 suppressor from 2015 that they show as awaiting approval. I have been shooting that suppressor since 2016. There is no record of the current transaction from Dec 2021

That sucks I’m sorry to hear that I’m not sure what you can do moving forward

 

[bwalker36]

Since you might know, what is the exact wording they use in a rejection? Being a bunch of Feds, I severely doubt they have any latitude when filling out these forms or making entries into the system.

Edit: Here is what was on the form:
View attachment 1138895

In any case, I couldn't figure out what happened, and nobody at ATF could tell me. I clicked the "Ask the Experts" link three or four times and never received a response of any kind.

The second person I spoke to on the phone gave a different ATF email address to contact about the "issue". They didn't respond either.

It was a very frustrating experience.

This thread got me to wondering, so I took another look today. Are you saying that it is completely normal for NO INFORMATION at all to show in any of these categories on eforms.atf.gov?

View attachment 1138899

I'd appreciate any helpful info or answers...from anyone.

My understanding is you won't see anything on a form 4 in your account, its all on the dealer side transferring it to you. The Dealer should see it in their account, if it was deleted they would have had to do it, or the ATF. No one else has access to the accounts.

 

[Double Naught Spy]

That sucks I’m sorry to hear that I’m not sure what you can do moving forward

I get to start the process over completely anew.

 

[TacticalJanitor]

My understanding is you won't see anything on a form 4 in your account, its all on the dealer side transferring it to you. The Dealer should see it in their account, if it was deleted they would have had to do it, or the ATF. No one else has access to the accounts.

That's pretty much what we thought. It reads like someone deleted the application. But, we did not. The dealer said he couldn't see anything in eforms either (throughout the process).

When I called the first time, the gal said that she had "about 15 calls today about missing form 4s".

Whatever. The Gov't wins. I don't need the hassle. What really chaps my behind is that I have recently had Gov't security clearance, have a CCW, no felonies on my record, no domestic violence.

I think they sit behind the desk and flip a coin on some people.

 

[bwalker36]

That's pretty much what we thought. It reads like someone deleted the application. But, we did not. The dealer said he couldn't see anything in eforms either (throughout the process).

When I called the first time, the gal said that she had "about 15 calls today about missing form 4s".

Whatever. The Gov't wins. I don't need the hassle. What really chaps my behind is that I have recently had Gov't security clearance, have a CCW, no felonies on my record, no domestic violence.

I think they sit behind the desk and flip a coin on some people.

Did you get a confirmation email. While I just certified an eform 4 yesterday with my dealer. I got an email immediately and have the control number and everything. If you didn't get that email perhaps yours never actually got submitted.

 

[dogtown tom]

Since you might know, what is the exact wording they use in a rejection? Being a bunch of Feds, I severely doubt they have any latitude when filling out these forms or making entries into the system.

Edit: Here is what was on the form:

Thats not a disapproval or a rejection. Only the transferee can delete or cancel a form. I've done that once on request of a customer that had moved out of state.

In any case, I couldn't figure out what happened, and nobody at ATF could tell me. I clicked the "Ask the Experts" link three or four times and never received a response of any kind.

ATF likely can't tell you because they didn't delete the form.
Its frustrating, but Ask the Experts often takes multiple "asks". Once I started writing "This is my third time asking for help....." I started getting quicker responses.

The second person I spoke to on the phone gave a different ATF email address to contact about the "issue". They didn't respond either.

It was a very frustrating experience.

Word.

This thread got me to wondering, so I took another look today. Are you saying that it is completely normal for NO INFORMATION at all to show in any of these categories on eforms.atf.gov?

Only the transferor (the seller) will see anything in his eForms account. You being the transferee (buyer) won't see anything in your eForms account because you do not possess the NFA firearm.

I'd appreciate any helpful info or answers...from anyone.

Whoever submitted your eForm 4 to ATF is the only one that can tell you why they deleted your form.

 

[dogtown tom]

The shop checked. NADA. My tax stamp remains unused, but purchased. When I checked the website, all they show is 1 suppressor from 2015 that they show as awaiting approval. I have been shooting that suppressor since 2016. There is no record of the current transaction from Dec 2021

Your 2015 silencer will always show as awaiting approval. That's because ATF does not/never did notify SS of approvals on paper Form 4's.

What did you local shop check when they told you NADA?
The IS upper never arrived at your dealer?
Your dealer never uploaded your silencer to his SS inventory?
Or your paper Form 4 was never submitted?
Or approved?
What does "Silencer Shop Deleted My Request" mean?
Did you ever certify an eForm 4 with your dealer?

The answers to those questions are important as to what was or wasn't done and what needs to happen next.

 

[TacticalJanitor]

Did you get a confirmation email. While I just certified an eform 4 yesterday with my dealer. I got an email immediately and have the control number and everything. If you didn't get that email perhaps yours never actually got submitted.

I did not get a confirmation email. Had no idea I needed one.

The dealer did his thing on the computer, I entered my pin number, paid the tax stamp, then nothing until the disapproval email from eforms.

But, the "disapproved/other" email has a copy of the eform 4 in it. Control number, all that stuff.

 

[dogtown tom]

That's pretty much what we thought. It reads like someone deleted the application. But, we did not.

You couldn't delete it.

The dealer said he couldn't see anything in eforms either (throughout the process).

He's either lying, incompetent or ignorant of eForms.....maybe all three.

When I called the first time, the gal said that she had "about 15 calls today about missing form 4s".

Uh oh.

Whatever. The Gov't wins. I don't need the hassle. What really chaps my behind is that I have recently had Gov't security clearance, have a CCW, no felonies on my record, no domestic violence.

I think they sit behind the desk and flip a coin on some people.

This isn't the fault of the government. It sounds like your dealer deleted eForms after they were uploaded.
He should be on the phone with NFA Div right now.

 

[TacticalJanitor]

Whoever submitted your eForm 4 to ATF is the only one that can tell you why they deleted your form.

He says he didn't. Maybe he did. I kinda had the feeling that he didn't know "what was what" about the whole process.

It sounds like an eform 4 isn't something I can do myself..right? If I try again, and can submit it myself, I'd rather do that. One less nut in the nuthouse.

Thanks for the info all!

 

[dogtown tom]

I did not get a confirmation email. Had no idea I needed one.

The dealer did his thing on the computer, I entered my pin number, paid the tax stamp, then nothing until the disapproval email from eforms.

But, the "disapproved/other" email has a copy of the eform 4 in it. Control number, all that stuff.

The eForms system is supposed to send both you and your dealer two automatic emails, one from pay.gov confirming payment of your tax, the second is a Submission Notification that your application is "submitted/in process". Sometimes, the eForms dosn't automatically send those emails, but your dealer can view them in the "Submitted" folder in his eForms account.

If the application was deleted after submission, only your dealer can say why he did that.

 

[dogtown tom]

He says he didn't. Maybe he did. I kinda had the feeling that he didn't know "what was what" about the whole process.

It sounds like an eform 4 isn't something I can do myself..right? If I try again, and can submit it myself, I'd rather do that. One less nut in the nuthouse.

Thanks for the info all!

Only your dealer can use eForms to transfer to you.

 

[TacticalJanitor]

Only your dealer can use eForms to transfer to you.

Bummer. I'll need to decide if he can try again, or find a different dealer.

Thanks!

 

[Lennyjoe]

I did not get a confirmation email. Had no idea I needed one.

The dealer did his thing on the computer, I entered my pin number, paid the tax stamp, then nothing until the disapproval email from eforms.

Did all of it online yesterday at my FFL’s shop and we both received the email notification immediately after username and pin was accepted online.

 

[Double Naught Spy]

Well, at this point in time, I am going to offer my humblest apologies to Silencer Shop. I still don't have a grasp on exactly what all went wrong, but am inclined to believe that the information that I was provided was not as accurate as claimed. I should have verified more thoroughly before saying anything, but at the time, I believed the information I was provided was accurate and as time has gone on, this does not appear to be the case.

Again, my apologies to Silencer Shop.

 

[JohnKSa]

Closed.