rangerruck
Member
the stg setup he had there, had the TWS rail, with the peep site, with a 4x acog clone, and you could def look through the site, with the peep site, and front site cowitnessing.
the ultimate AK accessory, ever!!
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SaMx
Member
would this be compatible with a saiga rifle?
rangerruck
Member
very much so, he told me the saiga is what he had in mind, when he first started the project...
Hello All,
Just had a chance to read through this thread this evening. I thought I should introduce myself as the designer of the DogLeg rail and let you know I would be happy to answer any questions anyone might have.
Perhaps, a little background is in order. As an AK shooter myself I was somewhat dissatisfied with the options available to me for mounting an optic on my rifle. I found my options to be either very high end super quad rail kind of stuff costing hundreds of dollars or ultra cheap chinese junk. The combloc side mounts seemed to be pretty good quality but the ergos were all wrong. Basically any optic and side rail combo I tried was way too tall. I then realized the Ruskies did that as a compromise to preserve the field stripping capability and while preserving scope zero.
After too much chinweld and turkey necking I decided to develop my own rail. To place the optic in the right place the key design feature is the dog leg bend that allows the rail to hug the dust cover. The low rail height allows a proper and consistent cheekweld for comfort and accurate shooting. An added benefit of the low rail height is when using one of the really tiny red dots like a Bushnell you can co-witness the optional rear mounted peep through the glass and still zero at fifty yards. The quick release mechanism preserves the field strip capability.
The primary design goals also included light weight, generous rail length, proper balance with the rail over the receiver, and simplicity of design for durability and low cost.
If anyone has specific questions I'll do my best to answer them.
Just had a chance to read through this thread this evening. I thought I should introduce myself as the designer of the DogLeg rail and let you know I would be happy to answer any questions anyone might have.
Perhaps, a little background is in order. As an AK shooter myself I was somewhat dissatisfied with the options available to me for mounting an optic on my rifle. I found my options to be either very high end super quad rail kind of stuff costing hundreds of dollars or ultra cheap chinese junk. The combloc side mounts seemed to be pretty good quality but the ergos were all wrong. Basically any optic and side rail combo I tried was way too tall. I then realized the Ruskies did that as a compromise to preserve the field stripping capability and while preserving scope zero.
After too much chinweld and turkey necking I decided to develop my own rail. To place the optic in the right place the key design feature is the dog leg bend that allows the rail to hug the dust cover. The low rail height allows a proper and consistent cheekweld for comfort and accurate shooting. An added benefit of the low rail height is when using one of the really tiny red dots like a Bushnell you can co-witness the optional rear mounted peep through the glass and still zero at fifty yards. The quick release mechanism preserves the field strip capability.
The primary design goals also included light weight, generous rail length, proper balance with the rail over the receiver, and simplicity of design for durability and low cost.
If anyone has specific questions I'll do my best to answer them.
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rangerruck
Member
Homie!!! Thanks for coming aboard; as you can see, I tried to answer as many questions as I could possibly remember, but now that you are here, you will take quite a load off! Anyway, it's great to have you here, and I hope to see you at the Reliant show in Houston, not this weekend, but next I think.
We have a pretty smart croud here, and skeptical of course, but in reality, you wouldn't want it any other way. All folks here are also pretty decent, and there is not a lot of chest pumping and trash talking, so you can have some good conversation. So prepare yourself! Iron sharpens iron.
Talk to you later. p.s. did you try to work on a good schematic for your site, to show just how the rear latch attaches, with what hardware, and how it works? Simple line artwork ought to do it...
We have a pretty smart croud here, and skeptical of course, but in reality, you wouldn't want it any other way. All folks here are also pretty decent, and there is not a lot of chest pumping and trash talking, so you can have some good conversation. So prepare yourself! Iron sharpens iron.
Talk to you later. p.s. did you try to work on a good schematic for your site, to show just how the rear latch attaches, with what hardware, and how it works? Simple line artwork ought to do it...
rangerruck
Member
very nice setup.
Limeyfellow
Member
Tech-sight are going to have their Ak-47 rear peep sight out this spring too.
If it works half as well as the one they designed for the SKS, it will be very nice indeed.
If it works half as well as the one they designed for the SKS, it will be very nice indeed.
MD_Willington
Member
Hey there Rafaga!
We (the Saiga-12 forum members) followed your manufacturing over at the other forum, looks pretty slick !
Guys did you see the new AK's coming out of Izhmash... some of them are sporting a "Beryl Rail" directly from the factory.
Samx - yes it works on a Saiga...
We (the Saiga-12 forum members) followed your manufacturing over at the other forum, looks pretty slick !
Guys did you see the new AK's coming out of Izhmash... some of them are sporting a "Beryl Rail" directly from the factory.
Samx - yes it works on a Saiga...
Quote: AK103K,
Now all we need is an unbiased, realistic, side by side comparison between the two set ups to see which works the best, under realistic use.
Hey AK103K,
On the other forum a couple of folks have done side by side comparisons of the DogLeg, DPH, and Krebs. You can take a look and judge the results for yourself. I won't link to it cause I believe that's a no no.
Maybe someone else that has read it can chime in.
Now all we need is an unbiased, realistic, side by side comparison between the two set ups to see which works the best, under realistic use.
Hey AK103K,
On the other forum a couple of folks have done side by side comparisons of the DogLeg, DPH, and Krebs. You can take a look and judge the results for yourself. I won't link to it cause I believe that's a no no.
Maybe someone else that has read it can chime in.
SharpsDressedMan
member
Just ordered a TWS mount, and have an Ultimak on another AK (7.62). I will be putting the TWS on a AK-74 (5.45), so it won't be a direct comparison, cartridgewise, but I'll post my range experiences. The Ultimak holds a Zeiss Z-Point, and I can switch the Z-Point back and forth. I also have a ACOG Reflex, and can mount that on both to give a little more comparison. I am excited about the more solid rear mounting of the TWS rail, as I was hoping to put a regular riflescope on it to test the true capabilities of the 5.45x39. The crude sights of the AK just don't do the potential of that cartridge justice. The mount might be here before Easter, and I may get some shooting in this weekend.
rangerruck
Member
No, no, I think you are right; the 545 round dares to be shot accurately. is either you zeiss or acog have any power? If so, that should tell us if it is , first off, repeatable at zero at 100 yds, and secondly if it actually is tight enough, to increase accuracy over the sites, or another type of mount.
MD_Willington
Member
Rafaga, the pictures I saw were posted on the AK forum a few months ago...
Bottom line it looked pretty much like the rail on the Polish rifles.
I sold my Kobra, so I'm interested in a rail system that sits on top.
Bottom line it looked pretty much like the rail on the Polish rifles.
I sold my Kobra, so I'm interested in a rail system that sits on top.
rangerruck
Member
We are still working on a group buy though, I got three dudes looking for one so far. Rafaga says if we get 20 dudes, we get the extra special, super spectacular, giveaway with candy, price.
MD_Willington
Member
I need to know the bottom line, I just laid out $170 on some 9x19
I may be interested.
A few questions:
1. Is there a picture of the final version that we would purchase somewhere?
2. Will this fit a Vepr K?
3. How far below the tang does the connection mechanism extend? I assume it is just a bolt secured through the tang into the stock material?
4. Is there a rear aperture sight setup for this yet?
Thanks,
Mike
A few questions:
1. Is there a picture of the final version that we would purchase somewhere?
2. Will this fit a Vepr K?
3. How far below the tang does the connection mechanism extend? I assume it is just a bolt secured through the tang into the stock material?
4. Is there a rear aperture sight setup for this yet?
Thanks,
Mike
rangerruck
Member
in the group buy, they will cost us 90 bucks a piece;
here is a pic of the final version.
http://www.texasweaponsystems.com/id1.html
he is currently working out the final version of the peep site, just deciding on windage hardware.
rear peep will be similar to the one shown on the bottom of this page;
http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=4&f=56&t=111659
final rail design looks like this; about 10 dudes down;
http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=4&f=56&t=111659&page=9
here is some good looking mounted pics;
http://i71.photobucket.com/albums/i123/Wolvydude/AK Pics/009.jpg
http://i71.photobucket.com/albums/i123/Wolvydude/AK Pics/002-1.jpg
the attachment block comes with diff type screws, and sits on your tang, so it shouldn't matter how much higher or lower your tang sits.
remember, the whole thread discussing production is at ar15.com then ak 47, then optics and accessories. look for the on fire envelope on the left, covering the dogleg rail topic...
here is a pic of the final version.
http://www.texasweaponsystems.com/id1.html
he is currently working out the final version of the peep site, just deciding on windage hardware.
rear peep will be similar to the one shown on the bottom of this page;
http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=4&f=56&t=111659
final rail design looks like this; about 10 dudes down;
http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=4&f=56&t=111659&page=9
here is some good looking mounted pics;
http://i71.photobucket.com/albums/i123/Wolvydude/AK Pics/009.jpg
http://i71.photobucket.com/albums/i123/Wolvydude/AK Pics/002-1.jpg
the attachment block comes with diff type screws, and sits on your tang, so it shouldn't matter how much higher or lower your tang sits.
remember, the whole thread discussing production is at ar15.com then ak 47, then optics and accessories. look for the on fire envelope on the left, covering the dogleg rail topic...
Will the peep sight be usable with the standard front sight? FWIW, I'm unconcerned about being able to cowitness through the optic. That's why Larue makes QD mounts. It would be a nice-to-have feature, but I don't know how you could make it work with the realities of the AK platform.
Mike
Mike
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