Troubled By Pack Dogs or Wolves(?)

[P5 Guy]

http://www.outdooralabama.com/watchable-wildlife/what/Mammals/Carnivores/rw.cfm

SCIENTIFIC NAME: Canis rufus

OTHER NAMES: Brush Wolf

DESCRIPTION: A red wolf is a medium sized wild canid that is 3 to 4 feet long and weighs 40 to 90 lbs. It is much larger and more robust than the more common coyote. The pelage is a coarse tawny-cinnamon mixed with gray and black along the sides. A darker shade of gray and black is evident along the back. The legs are longer and the feet and ears are larger than the coyote. Neck and nose are usually white and the tail is bushy with a black tip. Its nose, ears, neck and outer surfaces of the legs are tawny

http://www.angelfire.com/ky2/forestfriends/redwolf.html

Quick Facts

ORIGINAL HABITAT: Throughout Southeastern United States. By the 1980's, red wolves were found only in coastal Texas and Louisiana.
RELOCATION HABITATS: Alligator River Wildlife Reserve in North Carolina, the Great Smokey Mountains of Tennessee, some islands off the coast of Florida , Mississippi & S. Carolina.
NATURAL CURRENT HABITATS: Anahuac National Park in Texas, {some sources claim native populations in Louisiana and the west Alabama wetlands, but these animals may be red wolf hybrids}
SIZE: 35-90 pounds, 4-5 feet long, 2-2.5 feet high at shoulder.
DIET: Small rodents and mammals- rabbits, white-tail deer where available, squirrels, crayfish, insects.
BREEDING: Mates twice a year with litters of 3-7 cubs. High infant mortaility rate.
LIFESPAN: 8-16 in the wild, up to 20 in captivity.
BREEDING: Mates twice a year with litters of 3-7 cubs. High infant mortaility rate.
STATUS: Extremely endangered, almost extinct.
ESTIMATED NUMBERS: Around 300, most in captivity.

 

[Jim Watson]

Yes, but from the same source:

"The red wolf was extirpated from Alabama in the early 1920’s."

If you want to see a red wolf, you have to go to a zoo or to a refuge in North Carolina.

 

[jrdolall]

I live in a very rural area of Alabama where my neighbors all own over 100 acres and we have the same issues.

There are no wolves in Alabama, at least not wild wolves. They are either coyotes or feral dogs. I live near a major highway and people dump dogs constantly for whatever reason people have for dumping dogs. They also occasionally dump horses in my pastures but they usually open the gates first and let the horse in with the cows.

I can call rescue agencies to come get the horses but there is no "dog catcher" that can chase the wild dogs through all the cattle pastures and pine thickets. Hungry dogs will chase cows. Hungry dogs will kill calves. If a stray is obviously sweet I will pick him up and take him to a shelter in town. I have had plenty that just jumped right in the truck with me and rode like they were at home. If they have tags I will attempt to catch them(especially hunting dogs)and return them.

A large percentage of the dogs I see are bulldog varieties with pit bulls being predominant. I have no problem with pitbulls as they can be very sweet like any other dog but I do respect them for what they are capable of doing if provoked.

We have a don't ask don't tell policy around here. It's not any fun but it's the responsible way to control them. If they are in my yard then I just deal with it. Of course my neighbors do the same so I don't have any issue there and the game warden or sheriff sure isn't gonna investigate.

 

[itsa pain]

Coyotes attacking a human, much less an adult man, is a non-issue so unless you have livestock what's the point of killing them?

Some people like to kill animals. Should work in a slaughter house.. Coyotes look to much like dogs anyway I could not shoot one. Some gun owner like to create a situation where they feel they are under attack wether it is zombies or "wolves" in Alabama.

 

[P5 Guy]

Yes, but from the same source:

"The red wolf was extirpated from Alabama in the early 1920’s."

If you want to see a red wolf, you have to go to a zoo or to a refuge in North Carolina.

Jim, I'm thinking there are misidentifications going on. But that is an interesting thing, maybe pretty dangerous, too.

 

[buck460XVR]

I live in an area of Wisconsin with a high density of wolves. They have been here in substantial numbers for almost 20 years. While there have been several instances of them preying on cattle and hunting dogs locally, the problem we have with canines close to buildings and humans are either feral dogs and/or wolf/dog hybrids, bred by humans and released into the wild because they could not find a buyer, did not want to feed them, and/or could not control them anymore.


*Kemosabe*, if the police did not have a clue, did you contact the state DNR/F&G? If the animals in question are a problem, a threat to humans and are really wolves, those folks need to know about it. Tracks if clear, may be able to distinguish between a true wolf and a dog and/or wolf cross. Wolf tracks are much larger than even very large dogs and are rectangle more than square(like a dog) and middle claw marks are generally close together compared to them and the outter claws as opposed to a dog's where claw distances are more equal.


Here is something my state puts out about wolf identification. The bushy erect tail with the black tip and erect round ears are two common identifiers.

Wolf characteristics

The following wolf characteristics were designed to help non-biologists determine if an animal is wolf, dog, or hybrid. They are the average measurements taken from 24 adult wolves. Certain characteristics may vary with animal's age and health status, such as canine wear and fur conditions. If an animal has at least 8 out of 10 of these characteristics, there is a high likeliness that it is at least part or mostly wolf, but in some cases DNA testing may be needed to confirm its status.

Head is relatively large, with broad cheeks ~ 5.75 inches (~15 cm) across, below the eyes.
Face markings are well blended, lacking distinguishable borders.
Well furred erect ears rounded at tip ~ 4.75 inches (~12.1 cm.) long.
Light colored slanted eyes, ranging from amber to yellow.
Normal coloration is rusty brown (cinnamon) with black tipped guard hair, winter coat has thick under fur and guard hair.
Elongated snout (non-dished) with black nose and large ~ 1.0 inch (~23 mm) inward curved canine teeth.
Narrow keeled chest and hips, front feet slightly toed out, shoulder height ~ 28 inches (~73 cm).
Long legs with large ~ 3.5 inches (9.0 cm) long by ~ 2.6 inches (6.7 cm) wide front feet and smaller back feet
Ruff of fur around neck and shoulder area resembling four layer cape appearance. Chest girth ~ 24 inches (~ 60.5 cm)
Straight bushy tail with black tip, black spot (precaudal gland) on top of tails base. Tail bone length ~ 17.5 inches (43.5 cm)

 

[Gaucho Gringo]

If it keeps up like this it will naturally sort itself out hopefully. Why do you think most humans have a fear of wolves? Because in the process our evolutionary development the ones that did not fear wolves didn't survive. Wolves have and will attack humans given a chance. Why do we have all the big bad wolf stories handed down from eons ago? There are no big bad Bambi stories. It was a matter of survival. Wolves behavior today is no different than it was 10,000 years ago, but a lot of humans have definitely gotten more stupid in the last 100 years. They think that all furry carnivorous predators are cute and cuddly and they will play nice with them. So let them go out in the woods unarmed and see how cuddly they are. It might do the gene pool some good. IMO the only good wolf or feral dog is a dead one. I value my life too much. Shoot, shovel and shut up.

 

[hso]

Firstly, wolves are a minimal threat to humans these days.

Secondly, Fish and Game in Abalama might have them listed as protected and you'd be breaking the law.

Thirdly, Fish and Game would probably want to trap and relocate them and do your work for you.

Fourthly, you're not likely to be seeing wolves in your area and far more likely to be seeing coyotes or coyote/dog crosses and that makes them of interest to Fish and Game for extermination.

If the authorities will do your work for you it makes sense to let them.

If you want to make sure, put up a game camera and motion sensor lights and send pics to Fish and Game.

 

[joeschmoe]

Secure your trash, raise your bird feeders so they feed the birds, not other critters. Ask your neighbors to do the same. Eliminate any other sources of trash/food for them.
Report your sightings to local LEO. If threatened on your property, destroy them.

 

[*Kemosabe*]

First: I failed to mention this ocurred at our Mississippi house and not in Alabama. So the conversations with the Game Dept. apply to Mississippi and NOT to Alabama. I apologize if it got you on the wrong track.

Second: In Post #25 it was determined that there are NO wolves in this area and therefore they are a non-issue.

Third: The trash IS secure (never said it wasn't), but just try and keep birds from spilling seeds from a feeder... geez!

Fourth: Deer and their fawns are welcome visitors in our backyard as are the foxes, our cat and dogs... all of which are coyote food. Are you not aware that coyotes and feral dogs are carnivores???

Fifth: Please read ALL of Post #25 so I don't have to address non-issue questions... thanks!

 

[MistWolf]

...Wolves have and will attack humans given a chance...

There are no documented accounts of unprovoked wolf attacks on humans in North America

 

[robhof]

robhof

Thank God I'm not the 1st to suggest shooting them, in another posting about shooting feral cats, I got chewed out for suggesting shooting feral dogs. Animal control will Never there when the dogs are, unless you live next to their dispatch. I used to get paid $1.00 per dog/cat as a teenager by farmers where I grew up to eliminate feral animals that stupid pet owners think the farmers will take in. In Miami. the zoo had to pay professional hunters to kill a pack of feral dogs that was destroying their African plains animals.

 

[Sam Cade]

There are no documented accounts of unprovoked wolf attacks on humans in North America

Fantastically rare is not the same as none.

Please View Attachment.

 

[Nom de Forum]

Coyotes attacking a human, much less an adult man, is a non-issue so unless you have livestock what's the point of killing them?

Unfortunately, coyote attacks on humans are no longer a "non-issue". Both individual and group attacks while rare have been happening in suburbs. Familiarity breeds contempt, and I suspect the coyotes are contemptuous of the mostly unarmed suburbanites.

 

[berettaprofessor]

As for SSS, if what you are doing is legal than no problem, but the suggestion to others that they should do so to cover an illegal act is not really The High Road. A poacher/violator is still a poacher/violator. Vigilantes are still criminals. Acting tough about it don't make it legal nor right.

Not saying or thinking its illegal to shoot them. But legal is different from what others feel is acceptable. Owning and carrying guns openly is acceptable in Texas but that won't keep you from being arrested for it. Shooting a maniac with a knife in your home is probably legal as well but that won't keep a rabid anti-gun prosecutor from making you defend yourself with your savings and the equity in your home.

 

[readyeddy]

AR with 30 round mags sounds about right.

 

[splattergun]

Wolves in L.A.? Possibly dog-coyote cross, but not wolves.
Continue shooting 'em. Call DWR and animal control.

 

[Conservidave]

i use a paint ball gun to dispatch dogs, coyote's or anything i dont want hanging around my place. They rarely come back for more......

 

[jerkface11]

IDK why you felt undergunned. Not like the pack would stick around after you started blasting with a shotgun.

 

[stevek]

We've been having an issue with coyotes taking a lot of the neighbors cats/small game. When I am out with my dogs, I have a Glock 20SF on my hip.

 

[Steel Horse Rider]

My experience in shooting began as a very young man shooting the very types of animals you describe on our farm in Iowa. We raised cattle, pigs, sheep, and chickens and there were many predators who wished to have dinner at our expense that were quickly dispatched by myself or one of my brothers with either a .22 or an Argentine Mauser if it was a long shot. The numbers of dogs seemed to run in cycles, my Dad believed that the good city folks liked buying cute puppies but after they reached full growth they became an expensive nuisance so they were taken for a ride in the country and never came back - after all, don't animals belong in the wild - without giving any thought to the danger these animals become to the rural residents and their livestock when they either become diseased or gather in packs.

For those of you offering the olive branch advice, I suggest you listen to the Billy Joel song "Pressure", pay special attention to the lyric about offering your "Peter Pan advice" because you have no scars on your face and you cannot deal with pressure."

 

[Deltaboy1984]

Packs of Dogs on the Farm got #4 Buckshot and pairs or single got the 22 rifle or if way out in the pasture our 22-250.

 

[gtd]

"I say canines because I'm not sure what they were. "

Probably coyotes but I can't say without a photo. You might try trapping them, it's a fun pasttime. Look at www.trapperman.com for lots of good info. On 18 acres you have no land restrictions, I assume. (Alabama law applies, you might need a license.)

With that much land you'll have canine problems, just be careful at night and be armed, and have a great flashlight, too. They'll eventually get the message.

Regards,
GT

 

[marv]

I live out in the sticks. Neighbors and I been troubled by large dogs damaging property, killing cats, etc. I called local L E. Deputy came to my house. He basically told me "Deal with them however you have to". Sounds to me like SSS.

 

[JTHunter]

Nom de Forum said:

Unfortunately, coyote attacks on humans are no longer a "non-issue". Both individual and group attacks while rare have been happening in suburbs. Familiarity breeds contempt, and I suspect the coyotes are contemptuous of the mostly unarmed suburbanites.

And "coy-dogs" have even less fear of man, and can be larger and more aggressive than true 'yotes.

Many years ago, I saw one run across the street in front of my car. It was running from a patch of woods with several expensive homes to a farm field behind three more homes. This animal was almost as tall as a Lab but less weight. From the middle of his sides to the ground, his fur was the normal tan/gray of a 'yote but from the ribs up to its spine, it got redder and redder. Along the back, it was almost as red as an Irish setter! He also had the long, pointed muzzle and upright ears of a 'yote.

The reason I could see this one so well was that it was about 11:30 in the morning!