Using .44Mag Dies For .44Spl

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MI2600

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I tried using .44Mag dies for .44Spl loads, but I did not get a good crimp.

Anyone have a similar problem? Is there a secret to it?
 
I can only speak for RCBS dies which is what I have. They include a washer. With the washer on the seating / crimp die, adjust for crimping your .44 mag. With the washer off, it is set for .44 Special.... in theory. To get a really good crimp you need to trim your brass to all the same length, then set the crimp die. I load lots of lead in both .44 mag and special and the washer works fine. My loads are pretty light. 185 gr DBBWC over trailboss being my favorite paper puncher. I take a closer look when things get hotter, but I'm adjusting seating depth for a different bullet then too, so it aint a big deal. Hope that helps.
 
Depends heavily on your intended use. If your loading for single shots then you for sure can load, but crimping may or may not be possible. If for a repeater you don't need to try it without a crimp because bullets will move, most likely forwards and jam up the gun
 
Many brands of dies used to be caliber specific.

.38 & .44 Special dies could be adjusted UP to load .357 & .44 Magnum.

But the expander & seating / crimp dies for the Magnums could not be adjusted DOWN in the press for the shorter 'Special' cases.

The cure is, chuck them in a lathe and use a die grinder to take 1/8" plus off the bottom of the dies so they can be adjusted down far enough to work.

rc
 
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Most die sets sold these days are for both. Make sure of your adjustments. That said, there are .44 Mag specific dies out there, and they won't crimp the shorter .44 Spl case. Check to see how the dies are identified.
 
M2600 what brand of dies do you have and what does it say on the box are they for both .44 mag and special? If so, read the directions, you may just have to screw the seating stem out a turn an the die body in a turn to fix your issue.
 
Just when you think you have this die thing figured out along comes another caveat, depending on manufacturer. Here is an example using RCBS 44 Mag 44 SPL dies. The RCBS Part Number 18612 is a 3 die carbide set for 44 Mag and 44 Spl with the spacer included. However, the seater die is designed for a taper crimp. The RCBS Part Number 18608 is also a 3 die set RCBS 3 Die Set For 44 Mag /44Special but for straight wall cases. Includes sizer die with decapping unit, expander die for expanding & belling case mouth & seater die with roll-crimp. Does not feature a carbide sizing ring (cases must be lubed prior to sizing). So while both are 3 die sets there are differences to consider. Both sets include the 0.1375" spacer for use on 44 Mag or 44 SPL.

Ron
 
The first set of 44 Special dies would load the first 44 Remington Mag cases. Reloaders that adjusted their dies has no problem. RCBS made a set of dies for the 44 Remington dies, That left a lot of reloaders with two sets of dies, one for the 44 Special and another for the 44 Remington. To make a long story short RCBS added a shim/washer to the first 44 Special die set and later they went to carbon type dies.

Same for the 38 Special and 357 Magnum.

F. Guffey
 
My old .357 dies would load but not crimp my .38's.I just bought a .357 Lee Factory Crimp die ( I think about 10 bucks at the time ) and have been good to go ever since . Get a .429 Lee Factory Crimp Die for your .44 Spl. hdbiker
 
My old .357 dies would load but not crimp my .38's
Click to expand...

True, but the older 38 Special dies would crimp both the 38 Special and 357 Magnum.

F. Guffey
 
This 3-die set is RCBS #18605, with a fourth RCBS carbide sizer die. The label lists only .44Mag.

I do have an RCBS .44 Russian die set. I've used them for .44 Russian and .44 Colt. I wonder if I could "unadjust" them up to the .44Spl?
 
I have an RCBS "3-die carb set .44 mag/.44 sp". PN 18612. Bought around 1990.

Following the directions and using the spacer it works perfectly fine for .44 Spl and Mag. Produces a ROLL crimp. Produces outstanding loads in both calibers with pretty roll crimps.

My RCBS .357 mag/.38 Spl. set works the same way with equally outstanding results.

I did once buy a Lee .44 Mag taper crimp die thinking it would be good for light loads using lead bullets. Instead I got lazy and always use the RCBS seater/crimper die adjusted to "no crimp." Works great.
 
The 44 Russian Seating die has the same part number as the 44 Special Shotshell crimp die so I'm not sure it will work as a normal seating die for the 44 Special.

An RCBS .44 Special/Mag roll crimp seating die is only $21.99
http://www.midwayusa.com/product/16...cial-44-remington-magnum?cm_vc=ProductFinding

A .44 Special/Mag Lee Factory Crimp die will run you only $18.79.
http://www.midwayusa.com/product/56...cial-44-remington-magnum?cm_vc=ProductFinding

The Hornady roll crimp seating die is $20.99, the Redding die is $26.49 so there are plenty of choices out there which won't break the bank...
 
I tried the .44 Russian seater without the stem and...IT WORKED! I think I'll still get a .44 Spl crimp die.

Thanks everyone.
 
The cure is, chuck them in a lathe
Click to expand...

Them? The seating die for the 44 Remington Magnum and the 357 Magnum are the 'too tall' dies, The full length sizing dies will size both the special and magnum cases.

F. Guffey
 
Yes, you only have to cut off the seating die.

I had this done after making the mistake of buying dedicated .44 Magnum dies.
And while I was at it, I had a 7/8" washer faced off to .125" for the expander die so I wouldn't have to fool with its lock ring.

Now you get combo dies with the washers included or available to order. But in my early days of reloading, I got the distinct impression that RCBS dies were made with narrow ranges of adjustment on purpose so you would have to buy more dies.
 
Them?
Click to expand...
I was thinking I had to mod both the seater & expander dies for a friend once years ago. No idea what brand of dies they were now though.

No, you for sure don't need to mod the sizing die!

rc
 
The cure is, chuck them in a lathe and use a die grinder to take 1/8" plus off the bottom of the dies so they can be adjusted down far enough to work.
Click to expand...

Discounting the "them" since we only need to trim down seating die there is another slight problem.

The last 25 years with my company I was fortunate to work in an isolated area where we had a nice machine shop used for prototyping work. Just chuck it in a lathe or run it on the Bridgeport or run it on a precision grinder wasn't a problem. Need a custom washer? Make one and then grind a micro-finish on it. Want to check dimensions? Just toss it on a precision surface plate and check it with a precision height gauge. Heck, want my headspace gauges checked or maybe my precision weights? Just run them over to the main facility from my skunk works and have one of the guys check them on a few million dollars of CMM (Zeiss) or a precision scale. Ah yes, life was grand for an electrical engineering type with access to a full blown nuclear engineering machine shop and an army of mechanical engineers and some of the best tool room guys in the business. Not to mention equipment and gauges many could only dream about.

How many hand loaders have access to even a simple lathe or precision grinder let alone a layout table or surface flat? How many hand loaders have access to precision gauges like a height gauge, even an old height gauge? I will venture a guess that 95% of the home handloaders haven't a clue what half this fun stuff is and 95% don't have access to these things. Yes, the lathe is a fun tool. I need to get my little Atlas lathe from my brother. How many hand loaders can use all this fun stuff? Damn, while retirement is sweet I do miss that machine shop being at my disposal.

So to all those who make these suggestions I am sorry but I do not see them as good suggestions. Anyone familiar with machine shop operations and anyone who either has the tooling mentioned and the skills to use the tooling will sure as heck know they can trim down a 44 Magnum seating die to use with 44 Special. So what is the point of reciting it?

My suggestion is simple. Buy the correct die for the job and be done with it. Again, my apologies if I have offended anyone.

Ron
 
Quote:
Them?

I was thinking I had to mod both the seater & expander dies for a friend once years ago. No idea what brand of dies they were now though.
Click to expand...

rcmodel, then there is the difference in RCBS expanders, they made an expander die with an aluminum die body, they also made an expander/primer punch die. Then came the expander without the primer punch.

When purchasing dies it is possible for a reloader wanting a set of dies for loading on a progressive receive dies that were designed to be used on a single stage press. I have friends that purchase pistol dies for the expander.

We all know position one is for sizing and removing primers when the ram goes up and installing primers when the ram is lowered. It would be awkward to punch the primer after the case has left position number one.

F. Guffey
 
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