Various AR-15 style Rifles

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foghornl

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It seems like most of the American Gun makers now have an AR-15 Style rifle/carbine.

Anyone own or shot for evaluation purposes say the S&W and/or Remington versions? How about 'after-market' M-16/AR-15 magazines for said guns?

Also, kinda wondering if Ruger or even Hi-point will make one....

Foggy is through stirring the pot for now.....
 
Based on in shop observations the M&P-15s I've handled have been very good to excellent in terms of fit & finish, and doing things like staking carrier keys correctly. The Remington R-15s are Bushmaster parts assembled at a Remington plant, and marked Remington. Remember that Cerberus Holdings owns Remington, Bushmaster, Marlin / H&R / NEF, Cobb Mfg, and DPMS now.
 
I really like the Rock River Arms National Match trigger. Most AR-15 rifle renditions seem pretty generic for the most part and are hard to distinguish from each other.
 
How about 'after-market' M-16/AR-15 magazines for said guns?
By definition, any magazine not purchased from the manufacturer of the rifle would be after market. We could get in to a philosophical discussion on who actually made the rifle as opposed to who merely assembled it, but that is for the birds. I haven't had a lot of experience with different magazines, but the 3 I have that have seen the Iraq desert seem to work still, the CMMG mags I have work well, though I have seen one that acted funny in a friend's del-ton kit; and PMags are great, but don't seem to "do it better" than the other mags I've used.
That being said, the AR has the cheapest "flawless every time" mags of any rifle available. $10-$25 from cheapest good mag to most expensive good mag is unheard-of in any other rifle that I can think of.

It seems like most of the American Gun makers now have an AR-15 Style rifle/carbine.
I can think of two, if you define American Gun Makers as any general gun manufacturer in the US, which is Remmy and S&W. They just happen to be the two companies that hopped on the gravy train first. I'd be willing to bet Winchester will follow, like they did with the Laredo after the Sendero. Basically, if you figure that there are only 3-5 American Gun Makers in the US, then yes your observation is correct. I figure there are more, however, and that only 2 have brought on an AR line.

Most AR-15 rifle renditions seem pretty generic for the most part
How so, because they look alike? That's like saying Remington, Winchester and Savage are all pretty generic. True the differences between Bushmaster, DPMS and Colt may seem more miniscule when you look at them, but there are many machine companies that make the parts and many barrel manufacturers that make the barrels; all of which have different specs and use different materials. It's a lot more complicated than that, but you get the idea.
 
hmmmmm,

If Ruger made an AR......

It would be stainless steel...
Heavy as a length of train track...
have a barrel so whippy you could strike flies out of the air with it.
and require $1000 worth of work to make it a viable shooter.

As to the mags.... Some work great, some don't . I have C-product mags, P-mags and a whole slew of weird mags. Most of them work great.
 
If Ruger made an AR......

It would be stainless steel...
Heavy as a length of train track...
have a barrel so whippy you could strike flies out of the air with it.
and require $1000 worth of work to make it a viable shooter.


lol...
 
If Ruger made an AR......

It would be stainless steel...
Heavy as a length of train track...
have a barrel so whippy you could strike flies out of the air with it.
and require $1000 worth

And only 10 round mags.

I wonder what they add to the billboard with all that extra space?

"Warning: Do not attempt to shoot this rifle. Doing so may cause frivolous law suits, hearing loss, addiction to evil black rifles, killing of rain forests, and global warming. Any civilian who has purchased this rifle needs to report to re-education center for immediate exchange for a bolt action rifle replica, there is absolutely no need for a civilian to own this rifle."

Wonder how would they market it? What the designation would be?
 
If Ruger made an AR......

It would be stainless steel...
Heavy as a length of train track...
have a barrel so whippy you could strike flies out of the air with it.
and require $1000 worth

And only 10 round mags.

I wonder what they add to the billboard with all that extra space?

"Warning: Do not attempt to shoot this rifle. Doing so may cause frivolous law suits, hearing loss, addiction to evil black rifles, killing of rain forests, and global warming. Any civilian who has purchased this rifle needs to report to re-education center for immediate exchange for a bolt action rifle replica, there is absolutely no need for a civilian to own this rifle."

Hey, I didn't say it....but I'm smilin'. Good, good stuff! :D
 
Quote: How so, because they look alike? That's like saying Remington, Winchester and Savage are all pretty generic. True the differences between Bushmaster, DPMS and Colt may seem more miniscule when you look at them, but there are many machine companies that make the parts and many barrel manufacturers that make the barrels; all of which have different specs and use different materials. It's a lot more complicated than that, but you

Well, it's not all that "complicated". I can distinguish a Remington from a Savage from a Winchester bolt-action from ten feet away and, furthermore, the three you referenced are distinctly different from each other in terms of extraction/ejection designs, bolt lock-ups and ammunition feeding methods.However, I defy anybody to tell the difference between a Bushmaster and, say a Stag, any further than ten inches away (without reading the logo). The AR-15 makers share many components and the basic design/function dynamics are all identical and generic. Which isn't to say that some manufactuers don't do a better (or worse) job at assembling or finishing said components but that's a fact of life with any maker of products.
 
Well, Ruger is now selling airguns, so AR-15s are not far off.

They... they are?

Hm... where does that one ARFCOM member work? Which foundry? If they are, then this is somewhat of a major statement from the company... I mean... remember, this is the same company that won't let us "simple civilians" have 20 round magazines. If they're buying receiver blanks for the AR-15, then they've probably changed their minds on what a "civilian" rifle is.

We'd all love it if that guy gave us some evidence that they did buy those blanks.
 
If Ruger does start selling ARs,they'll probably stop making mini 14s,as they would become Ruger's 2nd best semi .223.
 
If Ruger starts making AR's, we won't need them for mags.

Unless they were to change it ever so slightly so that only Ruger mags worked..... who knows
 
OK, guys, disregarding Ruger's magazine capacity, and lack thereof, let's veer back somewhere near the original questions....

How do the S&W or Rem "AR-15 Style" builds compare to say Armalite/Bushmaster/Colt/DPMS, etc?

Will "standard design" AR-15/M-16 magazines work in these?
 
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Regarding your original question regarding the merits of the many aftermarket magazines, I like and use those made by C-Products. The twenty round straight mags seem well-constructed, are made from s/s and cost about $13.00 each.
 
How do the S&W or Rem "AR-15 Style" builds compare to say Armalite/Bushmaster/Colt/DPMS, etc?

S&W...pretty good rifle, I'd say comparable to Stag, maybe slightly higher quality. I have heard that the more recent ones use LMT BCG, but I cannot confirm. Probably near Armalite quality...S&W did have some slight dimensional problems with their earlier lowers, but that is fixed.

Remington...probably comparable to Bushmaster, since the parts apparently come from there, because, as mentioned above, Cerebus owns Rem. and Bushmaster.

DPMS is lower than both of these (DPMS is actually near the bottom of the barrel...above Hesse/vulcan, though. Oooh, flame me).

Regarding your original question regarding the merits of the many aftermarket magazines, I like and use those made by C-Products. The twenty round straight mags seem well-constructed, are made from s/s and cost about $13.00 each.

PMAGS are the only way to fly. They are the toughest mags so far. Lancer Mags are worth a look, and seem to be pretty decent, but more expensive. HK mags are not worth the money...they have issues. Why buy a $30-40 HK mag when a $15 PMAG does the job. Plus, you can load a 30rd PMAG up to capacity w/o any problems.
 
Cerberus owns DPMS as well. Not to mention, Remington's AR-patterned .308 is the DPMS LR. Whose to say the parts for the 15's come from Bushie any more than DPMS? Anyway, it doesn't matter, you'll be happy whatever you pick. I built a parts kit on a DPMS lower. It works great and hasn't hiccuped yet with about 200rnds down the tube. My uncles owns an actual DPMS assembled gun and he didn't have any complaints.

As for mags, pmags hands down. I've got some USGI and Thermolds, but the pmags are awesome. I advise hunting down their vid on youtube that shows them playing with various mags under a truck. The pmag is the only one to survive.
 
Re S&W M&P 15's.

Several months ago there was an article in SWART magazine- "A Tale of Three Smiths".

3 M&P15's were run for over 24,000 rds over the period of several months.
It may answer several of your questions.
 
S&W...pretty good rifle, I'd say comparable to Stag, maybe slightly higher quality. I have heard that the more recent ones use LMT BCG, but I cannot confirm. Probably near Armalite quality...S&W did have some slight dimensional problems with their earlier lowers, but that is fixed.
As I've posted in previous threads, Stag no longer supplies S&W. The dimensional problems were on early guns built with Stag uppers & lowers. S&W makes a far nicer AR they Stag. Unlike Stag, S&W knows how to properly machine M4 feed ramps into the upper to match the M4 barrel bushing (Stag uses M4 barrel extensions and doesn't touch the upper). S&W also properly stakes bolt carrier keys, while Stag punches a little line across the screws. S&W properly stakes the tele-stock buffer tube castle nut, but Stag doesn't touch the castle nut. There's no comparison between Stag and S&W. Charles Daly, Bushmaster, and Armalite make rifles that are comparable with S&W.
 
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