jrfoxx
Member
cracked butt-yep, that works.I really should have just said like $1500 total, instead of limiting them separately, as one could go the route you did and be just fine I'm sure.
What would you pick for a "sniper" rifle?
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xringer3
Member
No question about it. Remington M700 308 all the way! My varmint rifle is all it can be, and it's sad to say, more than I am, LOL
gcrookston
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The Deer Hunter
Member
If money was nothing (for the gun), I would take a Remington M24 SWS. They are pretty sweet guns, and there has been confirmed kills out to 1200 meters.
.308 is pretty cheap.
I just like the gun.
.308 is pretty cheap.
I just like the gun.
I'd say get a phat ar-10 with a 270 winchester short mag upper and a 26" barrel. Then throw a nightforce 5.5-22x scope up top and you'd really be set.
Unfortunately, it doesn't meet your requirements, but my point is you might want to rethink your requirements. It's worth picking what you want, THEN saving for it, instead of picking what you want according to what you HAVE saved. Makes for less regrets and more long term satisfaction.
http://www.ar-10-rifles.com/index.php
Unfortunately, it doesn't meet your requirements, but my point is you might want to rethink your requirements. It's worth picking what you want, THEN saving for it, instead of picking what you want according to what you HAVE saved. Makes for less regrets and more long term satisfaction.
http://www.ar-10-rifles.com/index.php
Jeff Timm
Member
Millet scope
http://www.bigrivertactical.com/catalog/item/4193480/4081421.htm
I know nothing about Big River Tactical.
Geoff
Who notes that's a very good scope for the price.
http://www.bigrivertactical.com/catalog/item/4193480/4081421.htm
I know nothing about Big River Tactical.
Geoff
Who notes that's a very good scope for the price.
RioShooter
Member
GarandOwner
Member
Why is it when people start these threads, they say "What rifle would you choose for a sniper rifle" then go and restrict it to ammo cost? If you want a true sniper rifle, you cant be cutting corners.
Acheron
Member
Plus, if you want a true sniper rifle you have to eliminate any and all autoloaders. That means no AR-10s, PSLs, G3s, etc. I'm not saying that they aren't great rifles, but they all fulfill the role of Designated Marksman's Rifle. I know that some of the ARs in .308 can get sub-MOA groups even at long ranges, but those rifles are generally prohibitively expensive.
So for a real sniper rifle (for targets at 600m or more) you are best off with a nice bolt-action in a proven long-range cartridge. Since money seems to be a concern, my recommendation would be a Remington 700 in .308. It is an afforable and combat proven (as the M40) design.
So for a real sniper rifle (for targets at 600m or more) you are best off with a nice bolt-action in a proven long-range cartridge. Since money seems to be a concern, my recommendation would be a Remington 700 in .308. It is an afforable and combat proven (as the M40) design.
Art Eatman
Moderator In Memoriam
It thought this thread looked familiar. Like I said over at TFL,
I figure that if I can make a clean one-shot kill on Bambi at some 450 yards, I can practice a bit and make life discombobulating for a fella out beyond that.
I figure that if my pet hunting rifle can hold inside one MOA at my 500-yard range, I'm not gonna have problems in the discombobulation bidness.
My old Weatherby has been doing all that sort of thing since around 1970. Why change now?
People are a lot easier to sneak up on than Bambi or Wily. You "Howdy!" at some old boy from about five feet off his strong-side shoulder, and you'll come to believe in levitation.
Art
I figure that if I can make a clean one-shot kill on Bambi at some 450 yards, I can practice a bit and make life discombobulating for a fella out beyond that.
I figure that if my pet hunting rifle can hold inside one MOA at my 500-yard range, I'm not gonna have problems in the discombobulation bidness.
My old Weatherby has been doing all that sort of thing since around 1970. Why change now?
People are a lot easier to sneak up on than Bambi or Wily. You "Howdy!" at some old boy from about five feet off his strong-side shoulder, and you'll come to believe in levitation.
Art
nwilliams
Member
+1 on the LTR
I have one but I try to avoid referring to it as a "sniper rifle" its certainly tactical but since I'm not a sniper I can't personally call it one
IMO any rifle used by a law enforcement or military sniper is a sniper rifle whether the company that classifies it as one or not. Its not the rifle but the act in which it is used that defines a sniper rifle. You put any old deer rifle in the hands of sniper and that rifle now becomes a sniper rifle.
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It the role that defines the sniper rifle, not the weapon. In terms of 'kills', the Moisan-Nagant is still the number one sniper rifle.
Anyone who says that a semi-auto isn't a sniper weapon doesn't know history. From the G43 and M21 through the M110 SASS, semis have proved to be extremely effective sniper weapons - particularly in target rich environments.
Anyone who says that a semi-auto isn't a sniper weapon doesn't know history. From the G43 and M21 through the M110 SASS, semis have proved to be extremely effective sniper weapons - particularly in target rich environments.
Acheron
Member
Not all scoped combat rifles are sniper rifles. You can call this a debate over semantics, but the G43 and the M21 are not sniper rifles, but Designated Marksman Rifles. The G43 was originally designed as a standard infantry rifle and was later fitted with a scope (from 1943 on). It was typically used at ranges of less than 400m against any and all targets of opportunity. This makes it a DMR, not a sniper rifle.
While the M21 was a more capable system than the G43, and many shots were made at longer ranges (500-600m), the system was not designed for long range work. It was still a standard infantry rifle (M14) that had been accurised and fitted with a scope. It was used against targets of opportunity.
As has been said, it is the role that defines the sniper rifle. The sniper rifle is meant to engage special targets (namely high-value targets such as officers) at ranges in excess of 500m. This is not to say that snipers don't make shots at less than 500m and DMs don't make shots at more than 500m, but it is a crisscrossing of roles. Nowadays, snipers do not shoot enlisted men (unless in immediate self-defense), that is the job of the DM. With the addition of large (.50) caliber sniper rifles, it can be added that a sniper's role has been modified to include special anti-materiel work.
There is a reason why almost every major military uses a bolt-action as a dedicated sniper rifle. That reason is long-range accuracy. No semi can compete with a well-made and maintained bolt gun at long ranges.
While the M21 was a more capable system than the G43, and many shots were made at longer ranges (500-600m), the system was not designed for long range work. It was still a standard infantry rifle (M14) that had been accurised and fitted with a scope. It was used against targets of opportunity.
As has been said, it is the role that defines the sniper rifle. The sniper rifle is meant to engage special targets (namely high-value targets such as officers) at ranges in excess of 500m. This is not to say that snipers don't make shots at less than 500m and DMs don't make shots at more than 500m, but it is a crisscrossing of roles. Nowadays, snipers do not shoot enlisted men (unless in immediate self-defense), that is the job of the DM. With the addition of large (.50) caliber sniper rifles, it can be added that a sniper's role has been modified to include special anti-materiel work.
There is a reason why almost every major military uses a bolt-action as a dedicated sniper rifle. That reason is long-range accuracy. No semi can compete with a well-made and maintained bolt gun at long ranges.
+1 on the ss mildot scope,as far as caliber goes,.308.i wouldn't go the preowned route though,unless you know the seller very well.you don't know what they were shooting through it,or how it was maintained,was the barrel lapped? etc.it is very easy to damage an accurized rifle by cleaning/transporting it improperly/carelessly.
jr_roosa
Member
It's kind of built-up where I live, so when your Republic of Imaginary Bad Guys invading force happens to move into town, I'd say that >600m is a very long way away. So, what about this heretical idea:
It's an Anschutz 64 multipurpose in .22LR $800
A $500 scope would round it out.
Ammo is cheap, ammo is light, and the rifle doesn't say "BLAM! FLASH! I'm hiding over here in the shrubbery!" to everybody for miles around when you pull the trigger. Take a look at a 100yd smallbore target. ~6" bullseye, ~1" 10 ring. Even out at 2-300yd you're going to ruin somebody's afternoon to the point that they'll probably need a surgeon to set things straight. That will occupy the casualty, some litter bearers, a medic, a truck or a helicopter, and a surgical team for quite a while.
The downside is that your comrades will probably giggle uncontrollably every time they see you with your squirrel gun.
-J.
It's an Anschutz 64 multipurpose in .22LR $800
A $500 scope would round it out.
Ammo is cheap, ammo is light, and the rifle doesn't say "BLAM! FLASH! I'm hiding over here in the shrubbery!" to everybody for miles around when you pull the trigger. Take a look at a 100yd smallbore target. ~6" bullseye, ~1" 10 ring. Even out at 2-300yd you're going to ruin somebody's afternoon to the point that they'll probably need a surgeon to set things straight. That will occupy the casualty, some litter bearers, a medic, a truck or a helicopter, and a surgical team for quite a while.
The downside is that your comrades will probably giggle uncontrollably every time they see you with your squirrel gun.
-J.
gcrookston
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Plus, if you want a true sniper rifle you have to eliminate any and all autoloaders... such as the Psg1, Cobb .338, Barrett 82???
Here are three 3 shot groups while sighting in my DMR @ 100 yrds (I'd swapped out for some new rings). I regularly shoot this rifle at 500 & 1000 yrds and it maintains consistant sub MOA groups. Sure, I'll concede the bolt gun is a master of the long range shot, but when a .338 Cobb is 1/2 MOA and the M107 engaging personnel targets out to 1,400 meters and material targets out to 2,000 meters in iraq, its difficult for me to believe the bolt action rifle is going to remain king for much longer (see: http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/systems/ground/m107.htm)
Here are three 3 shot groups while sighting in my DMR @ 100 yrds (I'd swapped out for some new rings). I regularly shoot this rifle at 500 & 1000 yrds and it maintains consistant sub MOA groups. Sure, I'll concede the bolt gun is a master of the long range shot, but when a .338 Cobb is 1/2 MOA and the M107 engaging personnel targets out to 1,400 meters and material targets out to 2,000 meters in iraq, its difficult for me to believe the bolt action rifle is going to remain king for much longer (see: http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/systems/ground/m107.htm)
Average Joe
Member
Remington 700 in .308
FLORIDA KEVIN
Member
I think k-bob nailed it ! my choice might 30-06 just because .
Zak Smith
Member
The argument over the word "sniper" as it applies to a rifle is silly. "Sniper" is a miliatary role, who employs various tools with various attributes to get the job done. (So is DMR, and perhaps, in another thread, it would be interesting to dissect the differences.) If we want to be all technical about it, one might say that the only "sniper" rifles are the ones that have been issued to military snipers-- which cuts down on the possibilities immensely.
If we're not going to do that, then it will be more productive to define the specific application of the rifle and then discuss attributes that help it succeed, or are detrimental, in achieving those ends.
If we're not going to do that, then it will be more productive to define the specific application of the rifle and then discuss attributes that help it succeed, or are detrimental, in achieving those ends.
Commander Guineapig
Member
your fav Remington as suggested by many of these fine gents
coupled with
your favorite Leupold.
mine? Rem 700 SPS Tactical with a VXII 2-3X40 in .308 -- don't forget good rings.
my setup isn't $1300...but it is within 1 moa of my budget, so the wife approved.
GP
coupled with
your favorite Leupold.
mine? Rem 700 SPS Tactical with a VXII 2-3X40 in .308 -- don't forget good rings.
my setup isn't $1300...but it is within 1 moa of my budget, so the wife approved.
GP
gcrookston
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Here's a picture of my son just before his 2nd deployment to Iraq with his work gun... Since Uncle Sam gave him the rifle, I suppose you could say it falls under the less than $1,300.00 catagory. As for use and training, the rifle and rifleman fall under Zak's and slzy's definitions as well.
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