What's the deal with hot brass?

[Dave R]

I read many threads talking about the dangers of getting hot brass in your shirt/hat/glasses etc. This must be pistol brass, because I've never seen rifle brass get hot enough to hurt you.

When I'm shooting my K-31 and my boltguns, I'm proud of the fact that I can shoot, work the bolt, and then catch the brass in mid-air. Its not that hot.

I have never caught pistol brass in mid-air. Its moving too fast, and I have both hands on the pistol, anyway. But I have picked it up pretty quick after it hits the ground, and again, its not that hot. Just warm.

I've had .380acp brass from my P-3AT hit me. But no burning. I didn't notice any heat--just the impact of the brass.

So, does pistol brass REALLY come out hot enough to hurt you? And if so, why? How can 4 grains of pistol powder make that brass hotter than 46 grains of rifle powder?

 

[Sam]

It is generally rifle brass from semi autos.

Increase your rate of fire!

Sam

 

[Citadel99]

Before we deployed, I had two of my soldiers get pretty severe burns during a convoy live fire exercise from brass going between their collar and neck. Nasty blistery burns. Brass is hot.

Mark

 

[CAS700850]

A long time ago, my then girlfriend accused me of cheating on her because of a hickey on my neck. It was actually a burn from a 9mm casing that ejected, hit the lane divider at an indoor range, and landed between my collar and my neck, burning me. It was a mild burn, looked more like a hickey than a burn.

No, there were no witnesses. Yes, that's my story, and I'm sticking to it.

 

[vis35]

You can not work your bolt gun as fast as a semi-auto; the heat from the brass has been mostly absorbed into the chamber. Thinner brass (as in .22 rimfire) gets very hot and is ejected while it is still very hot. I was shooting a .22 pistol (many years ago) at an indoor range, an ejected empty bounced off the sidewall and went down the open neck of my shirt, it was stuck under my shirt in the same spot for several seconds and gave me a good burn that took months to fade. If a piece of brass just bounces off you it doesn’t have enough time to transfer any heat to you.
Regards,
Jeff

 

[taliv]

during the rapid fire stage of a competition once, i had hot 45acp brass bounce off a wall and stick inside my sandals... i was hopping around and shaking my feet and trying to fire at the same time.

i just can't even begin to count the times i've had burns from 223 or 9mm brass

 

[centac]

I get fried regularly by both pistol and rifle ammo when doing team or partner exercises. I know of some guys who insist on long sleeves and buttoned collars on their lines. I hate wearing hats but always do when shooting - getting brass behind the glasses' lens would have to suck.

 

[Waitone]

Any brass is hot if it hits and sticks. It will blister. If in the wrong place will cause permanent damage (c.f. cornea). I've had .45 ACP drop down my shirt and sit there just above my belt cooking. It burns and blisters.

My safety equipment includes muffs, close fitting eyeglasses, either an untucked shirt or buttoned top button, close toed shoes, and a hat with full brim. Been burned too many times to ignore it.

 

[Double Maduro]

Dave,

The first time I took one of my grand daughters shooting, a .22 case went off of the divider and down her shirt. She showed everyone her shooting scar for months, until it faded.

I'm proud of the fact that I can shoot, work the bolt, and then catch the brass in mid-air. Its not that hot.

Maybe it is because your hands are tougher than the more hidden and sensitive parts of your anatomy.

DM

 

[Bwana John]

A 45 acp case behind and trapped by your shooting glasses is alot of fun.

A fresh 7.62 case down the front of your shirt landing next to your nipple is really good for laffs also.

 

[Vern Humphrey]

One of the reasons the M16A2 has a brass deflector is a case at Fort Benning where a hot case went down a soldier's collar on the firing line and in his attempts to get it out, his rifle went off and killed another soldier.

 

[jefnvk]

I thought the brass deflector was to keep lefties from being pelted in the face with empties?

Hands are probably a bit tougher than the skin on your back. Have someone drop a freshly fired casing down between your shirt and back, where it is presing it into your back. It ain't fun.

 

[Vern Humphrey]

I thought the brass deflector was to keep lefties from being pelted in the face with empties?

Lefties had been complaining regularly, and all sorts of things had been tried (part of the problem was traced to the buffer and recoil spring, which with time can become a bit weak, so counter-recoil doesn't occur until after the case has left the ejection port -- which means the case is thrown nearly straight back. The emphasis was on timing -- a quicker recovery and counter-recoil would "solve" the problem (which was seen as minor.) A brass deflector was "impractical."

The shooting changed all that.

 

[centac]

Brings to mind the scene in the movie "Blackhawk Down" when the rain of brass from a Minigun showers one of the Rangers.....

 

[Combat-wombat]

I got a piece of .30 carbine brass down my shirt once: it ain't fun.

 

[ReadyontheRight]

My K31 also spins the brass right around head-height when ejected, so I can easily and safely grab it in mid-air. The first time I did this, I grabbed it without thinking and then quickly dropped it - thinking I'd get burned like with brass from a Garand. The brass was fairly cool out of the bolt action though.

As mentioned above, the brass has time in a bolt action to transfer some heat to the barrel and chamber. An autoloader will eject immediately upon firing and the brass will stay hot.

I wore shorts to only my first two highpower matches. The first was a Springfield match - bolt actions only, so no hot brass. The second was a Garand match and I was somewhat distracted from my sight picture by the brass from my neighbor landing on my bare legs.

 

[Rockrivr1]

Take my word for it, spent pistol brass is HOT! I was an unfortunate victim of hot brass stuck on the side of my shooting glasses. I ended up with a good sized blister right next to my right eye. Gives a whole new meaning to paying attention to how many times a minute you blink.

 

[Ransom]

Took a .45acp brass off the range lane divider to right under the eye. Left a nice little burn that bugged me the rest of the day, especially if I started to sweat at all.

 

[Father Knows Best]

You don't know what hot brass is until you load with black powder. I've had 44-40 cases that started out with 35 grains of ffg black powder in them drop down my shirt and come to rest against me ample belly (they were ejected from my 1866 Winchester replica in a cowboy match). You might as well be poking me with a hot iron! It's awful hard to keep focused on the rest of the string while your flesh is getting seared.

 

[280PLUS]

me ample belly

Heyyy, I resemble that remark...



I done been burned a few times, it hurts.

 

[SIOP]

I thought the brass deflector was to keep lefties from being pelted in the face with empties?

Back in the day, M-16's didn't have brass deflectors. Guys that shot left-handed had to button their shirts all the way up to keep the brass out, but I still took more brass in the face than I care to remember. One of my left-handed shooting buddies came off the range one day with half of his right cheek blistered from getting hit. Eventually the armory guys jury-rigged metal shields that bolted up to the carrying handle, that helped some.

 

[g56]

When I am shooting my AR off the bench I put up a deflector to keep the brass on the bench so I don't have to pick it up off the ground, the recently fired brass is extremely hot, definitely hot enough to burn you, it has to cool down for a few minutes before it is safe to handle.

 

[Dave R]

Hands are probably a bit tougher than the skin on your back. Have someone drop a freshly fired casing down between your shirt and back, where it is presing it into your back. It ain't fun.

I'm tellin' ya--the .308 and 7.62X55brass I catch in the air is no hotter than 100 degrees. Just warm. And it hasn't been in the action for more than 2 seconds. Probably closer to 1 second.

Now that I hear these stories about people with AR burns, I'm remembering that I also catch .223 brass as it ejects out of my NEF single shot. Again, no more than 1-2 seconds after firing. And it is no hotter than 100 degrees. MAYBE 110. But not hot enough to cause any discomfort, much less skin damage.

Maybe that much heat is absorbed in the 1 second that case is in the action. Maybe when it spits out of a semi-auto in milliseconds its that much hotter. But...

recently fired brass is extremely hot, definitely hot enough to burn you, it has to cool down for a few minutes before it is safe to handle.

A few minutes? I handle all kinds of brass after a few seconds--9mm, .380acp, rifle rounds, and I've never had an "owie" moment. Maybe its just that first 1 second that the brass has enough heat to burn skin.

Maybe I'm just lucky, I dunno. But I'm over 50 and have never been burned by a piece of brass. I was worried that ya'll are a bunch of tender people, but I guess from the number of replies, there really is some burnage going on.

 

[nico]

getting brass behind the glasses' lens would have to suck.

yes it does. The last time we went to the range, I was standing behind my girlfriend as she was shooting and a 9mm case went over my glasses and got stuck between them and my cheek. I didn't get burned, but it didn't feel good.

 

[benEzra]

And it hasn't been in the action for more than 2 seconds. Probably closer to 1 second.

There's why your brass is so much cooler than brass ejected from a semiauto. The brass case breaks contact with the chamber walls of a semiauto within a matter of milliseconds after firing. A second is an eternity for a piece of brass as thin as a cartridge case to dump its heat into the surrounding metal of the chamber.