New Rules for CMP 1911's

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Tirod

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As found here: http://www.alloutdoor.com/2017/12/0...l-sale-policies-civilian-marksmanship-progam/

In short,
1) all NEW paperwork to be submitted
2) a signed copy of the 01 FFL license
3) a random number generated for the LOTTERY to buy what is available, with caveat that later numbers get less selection
4) NICS run at the time of purchase by the CMP
5) NICS run at the FFL at the time of pickup.

It also states a start date about 150 days after receipt, which implies they will vet most of the guns first and hold them until the first purchaser can select (not at all what they did with Garands.)

This creates a substantial series of hoops (or roadblocks if you want) which still includes grading them apparently by market value - no hints of cheap guns or Trench Grade offerings. (rats)

Looks like the scramble is on as its part of the two year test phase to prove there are no serious issues doing this.
 
Don't expect any deals. I bet the beaters (the ones my unit carried in the early 1980's) will go for over 1K
 
Seems like they're trying to address lots of the criticisms I've heard about the M1 program, with a committee-fied bureaucratic solution.

They ARE a bureaucracy, run by a committee, so no surprises there. The Rules seem pretty well suited too accomplish the goal.
 
Civilian Marksmanship Program.
Look up CMP in the Google machine and their site will explain it better then me.
In short they promote civilian marksmanship and are funded through the selling of surplus government rifles and ammo. Their charter was just changed to allow selling of handguns IF the army releases them.
 
In olden times if you were a member of a club and actively shot there, you could then purchase a firearm. In those days it was known as the Director of Civilian Marksmanship, or DCM. The purpose was to supplement firearms training after WWI and the huge loss of shooting enthusiasts because of the onus placed on German schuetzen societies.

If anything the CMP is channeling the demand thru a series of administrative chicanes to slow the process and keep things at a moderate pace. By promising it will take months, they are nipping the viral speculation in the bud. Threads already started on other forums reflect this, as some who previously planned on buying are now chagrined and their feelz got hurt because no instant gratification can be had now. It now takes things out of the hands of the flippers and leaves them available to the adults who want them.

There are many who think these should be sold to Veterans only, as they are generally the ones who actually used them. We didn't get that. This time. During this two year review new decisions could be made, changing the rules again.
 
Tirod said:
... This creates a substantial series of hoops (or roadblocks if you want) which still includes grading them apparently by market value - no hints of cheap guns or Trench Grade offerings. (rats) ...
Click to expand...

When the possibility of CMP 1911s first appeared, I set my expectations to the slightest bit above zero.

After getting the recent emails from the CMP about their process my Expectations Meter pegged, hard, on the zero pin.

Too few pistols, too much hassle, too many extra hoops and, I have no doubt, too much money. :eek:

So ... for those who are determined to play the CMP 1911 Lottery Game, I represent one less CMP member against whom you will be competing.

Best of Luck to you all! :)

I will have to be satisfied with what I already have purchased from the CMP: 15 M1s, 2 M1Carbines, M1903Mk1, M1917 plus lots of ammo and accessories.
 
Got the email up date this AM
To all CMP constituents:

The CMP Board of Directors has discussed at length how the sales of 1911s would be handled, if the CMP were to ever receive them from the United States Army.

Some preliminary decisions further clarified:
  1. Decisions concerning the grade and pricing of the 1911s will not be made until inspection has occurred of a substantial quantity which will take an estimated 150 days post receipt.
  2. All laws pertaining to the sale of 1911s by CMP will be strictly obeyed.
  3. Potential purchasers will have to provide to CMP a new set of documents exhibiting: 1) proof of U.S. Citizenship, 2) proof of membership in a CMP affiliated club, 3) proof of participation in a marksmanship activity, 4) a new form 2A with notary, 5) a signed copy of the 01 Federal Firearms License in which the 1911 will be transferred to.
  4. A NICS background check will be performed by CMP on the customer to assure the customer is eligible to purchase prior to shipment to the FFL licensed dealer. The customer must receive a "proceed" from NICS prior to shipment of the pistol to the FFL licensed dealer.
  5. The CMP customer will be required to complete a form 4473 in person at the FFL dealers place of business, successfully passing a NICS check performed by the FFL holder, before the pistol can be transferred. This is a second NICS check performed on the customer.
  6. Qualified CMP customer will only be allowed to purchase one 1911 per calendar year.
  7. No 1911s available in the CMP stores, or on line, only mail order sales.
  8. CMP will set the date in which it will accept orders for the 1911s. The date will be posted to the world.
  9. Orders will only be accepted via mail order delivery.
  10. Orders will only be accepted post marked on the date or after, no early orders.
  11. Once CMP receives 10,000 orders, customer names will be loaded into the Random Number Generator.
  12. The Random Number Generator will provide a list of names in sequence order through a random picking process to CMP.
  13. Customers will be contacted in the sequence provided by the Random Number Generator.
  14. When the customer is contacted a list of 1911 grades and pricing options that are available will be offered for selection of one.
  15. As CMP proceeds down the sequenced list less grade and pricing options will be available. Again, this done completely random.

Note: 1911 type pistols purchased from CMP cannot be transferred to 03 FFL (curio and relic) license. BATF and the United States Army prefer the second background check be performed by a "store front" FFL dealer. Each customer purchasing a 1911 type pistol from CMP will be subjected to two NICS background checks, one performed by CMP and the other performed by the FFL dealer the pistol is being shipped to.


Mark Johnson
Chief Operating Officer
Civilian Marksmanship Program
www.thecmp.org
 
CDW4ME said:
Seems these two requirements would eliminate many potential buyers.
Click to expand...

That's exactly the idea. It's the Civilian Marksmanship Program, not the cheap-surplus-guns-for-everyone program. While I might wish to change the CMP's legal mandate, it seems that these new rules are well-designed to meet that mandate as it actually stands, and address many of the accusations of contra-mandate activity in their M1 sales program.

I wish that all surplus military arms were simply auctioned off to the highest citizen bidder, but that's not what CMP is there for.
 
I'm disgusted by the nonsense of refusing to transfer directly to otherwise qualified C&R type 3 FFLs. There is no logical nor lawful stand for this apart from making someone feel warm n' fuzzy about a needless protocol. And it does not matter what the ATF or ARMY may "prefer" about anything. They were told to formulate a policy and a direct transfer to C&Rs would be more-than-appropriate. So once again, on an institutional scale, we witness pontification of a gun seller who is discomforted by Type 3's and refuses their business. It isn't a leap to see other sellers running scared from crufflers because the CMP just announced its intention to do so.
 
the cmp was created in 1995 under the clintons to control the sale of surplus firearms and recover funds for the government. the mandate of its predecesdor, the dcm, was to encourage marksmanship by the sale of surplus firearms at low cost to the citizenry. the cmp’s specific ban on c&r licenses to buy surplus m1911 is proof and an insult.
 
the requirement in post # 14 were there many years ago when I got my Garand through the CMP. was competing regularly then so no problem.............
 
jstert said:
the cmp was created in 1995 under the clintons to control the sale of surplus firearms and recover funds for the government. the mandate of its predecesdor, the dcm, was to encourage marksmanship by the sale of surplus firearms at low cost to the citizenry. the cmp’s specific ban on c&r licenses to buy surplus m1911 is proof and an insult.
Click to expand...
Beg to differ. The CMP was established in 1916 and up until 1996 was administered by the U.S. Army. In 1996 the National Defense Authorization Act created the Corporation for the Promotion of Rifle Practice and Firearms Safety (CPRPFS) to take over and administer and promote the CMP.
 
For people who don't remember or know of the predecessor to the CMP it was the DCM. Originally it was ONE M1 Garand in your LIFETIME and required more hoops to jump through then the CMP today.
I'm just sitting here scratching my head and wondering what people want or expect.
GOD I'M GETTING OLD.
 
Think what you will
Right from the CMP website

The mission of the Civilian Marksmanship Program is to Promote Firearm Safety and Marksmanship Training With an Emphasis on Youth. Our Vision is That Every Youth in America Has the Opportunity to Participate in Firearm Safety and Marksmanship Programs.
Click to expand...
 
ford8nr said:
For people who don't remember or know of the predecessor to the CMP it was the DCM. Originally it was ONE M1 Garand in your LIFETIME and required more hoops to jump through then the CMP today.
I'm just sitting here scratching my head and wondering what people want or expect.
GOD I'M GETTING OLD.
Click to expand...

People want it now, want it easy, and want it for free!

If someone wants a piece of history, then they will pay for a piece of history. I am of the opinion that if you want a shooter, then you are better served by buying a brand new GI configuration 1911, like the Rock Island GI 1911

http://armscor.com/firearms/gi-series/gi-standard-fs/ which is made of 4140 steel. Cabelas has these on sale for $399.00

I handled one at Cabelas, these are tighter than any original GI 45 ever built, the materials are better, and they are new. I found one that I would say is between Kimber and Les Baer tight. The trigger broke clean, I was impressed. As a population, original GI 45's went through so many rebuilds they became unreliable and inaccurate.

I have been through the phase of buying stuff because it was old, because of the emotional attachment with old, and it is irrational.People create a story through emotional attachments around something, that in the end, is an object.

I would balance the cost of one of these against the cost and effort to buy a CMP 1911, and if the romance of the story is your number one factor, then cost, utility, is not going to matter much anyway.

With a $100.00 gift card, that Cabelas Rock Island GI M1911 was $299.99. Just saying:

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