Definitely 243 of those two. Less recoil, much faster. More ammo availability and choice. 7mm08 is not nearly as good for varmints. You want something flatter shooting. Take your 243 and sight in 1.5 inches high at 200 yards and tell her to aim at fur.
.243 or 7mm-08
- Thread starter All4eyes
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litman252
Member
That is a nice deer there!!!!!
1.5 @ 200 is pretty good.
approx balistics-
3100 fps
Range Impact
0 -1.5
25 -0.21
50 0.85
75 1.66
100 2.22
125 2.5
150 2.51
175 2.22
200 1.62
225 0.71
250 -0.54
275 -2.14
300 -4.1
Tony
1.5 @ 200 is pretty good.
approx balistics-
3100 fps
Range Impact
0 -1.5
25 -0.21
50 0.85
75 1.66
100 2.22
125 2.5
150 2.51
175 2.22
200 1.62
225 0.71
250 -0.54
275 -2.14
300 -4.1
Tony
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kdstrick
Member
I'm sorry rizbunk... but that is horrible advice. 1st of all, a 12 year old is not likely to attempt a 200 yard + shot. It will very likely be within 100 yards (maybe within 50) and sighting the rifle in high could be the difference between hitting the heart or missing it. Sight it in at 100 yards.
2nd... "aim at fur" is just absolute blasphemy. That philosophy will only end in lots of wounded animals that will likely never be found. That is cruel and even a 12 year old knows it. Precision is always important unless you are playing with horseshoes or hand grenades.
And neither of those have a place in hunting. Kernel
Member
jdkebert, nice picture. I see it's dated 9/19/09. I bet that kid is still smiling.
rizbunk77, wrote:
Aim small, miss small. Ring any bells?
rizbunk77, wrote:
Dude, that is so wrong on so many levels. Not only is it unethical and unsafe, it's just bad shooting advice - PERIOD.
Aim small, miss small. Ring any bells?
rangerruck
Member
Rbernie; you are def right about ammunitiontogo.com, they are top notch, and THE PLACE to get both newmade and milsurp ammo. If you don't see it on their site, just call them up or email them, they are likely to have it, and the price just can't be beat. Plus they don't jack you on shipping cost; they do real world cost, and that's it, they don't add on a profit there; like everyone else does.
I would say that means you must be either from Austin, Dallas, or the Houston area. That is their usual corridor for gunshow travel.
I would say that means you must be either from Austin, Dallas, or the Houston area. That is their usual corridor for gunshow travel.
rangerruck
Member
JBKEBERT: name the rifle and stuff, it looks like some sort of T/C setup!!!
did you dress the deer, get a weight, keep the rack; come on, no teasing.
did you dress the deer, get a weight, keep the rack; come on, no teasing.
Uncle Mike
Member
At her age she doesn't know if a rifle is kicking hard or if it is a pussycat... all she'll know is it did in fact punch her in the arm and it made a lot of noise while doing it.
If you don't put in her head that she's going to suffer from recoil in some fashion I bet she could shoot a 308 and not care one way or the other.
Like I told my kids...recoil is a part of shooting, it's going to happen and here is how we deal with it.....
Most kids don't really care about recoil, it's the BOOM they shy from!
My daughters all use 7mm-08's...have since they started deer hunting at the ripe old age of 12. They were popping skwacks at 6 with the 22's, well, doing a lot of popping AT skwacks.... lol
I vote for the 7mm-08, the 243 is too easy to mess up with if the shot isn't right or the shooter doesn't do everything well enough.
If you don't put in her head that she's going to suffer from recoil in some fashion I bet she could shoot a 308 and not care one way or the other.
Like I told my kids...recoil is a part of shooting, it's going to happen and here is how we deal with it.....
Most kids don't really care about recoil, it's the BOOM they shy from!
My daughters all use 7mm-08's...have since they started deer hunting at the ripe old age of 12. They were popping skwacks at 6 with the 22's, well, doing a lot of popping AT skwacks.... lol
I vote for the 7mm-08, the 243 is too easy to mess up with if the shot isn't right or the shooter doesn't do everything well enough.
interlock
Member
7mm08 v 243 win
ok, I have both 7mm08 and 243 win. I have the ruger in .243 win mk77 mk2 and a remmy model 7 in 7mm08.
Both are ace calibres. I have found that the 7mm is a far more effective deer round than the .243.
loaded with 120 gr sierra pro hunter and a relatively mild load so it is still going at 2800 fps it is a really mild and easy shooting round that will knock deer down dead all day long. load it up to maxers with 145 gr and you have a realy potent hunting round.
loaded low a 7mm08 in a model 7 would be ok for a smaller shooter but the fast heavier loads recoil quite markedly in the little remmy. you can load it down to 100 gr for varmint shooting. (although i use the 120 gr prohunters for fox and deer, same poi, same load, no hassle.)
243 is good at varminting.
ok, I have both 7mm08 and 243 win. I have the ruger in .243 win mk77 mk2 and a remmy model 7 in 7mm08.
Both are ace calibres. I have found that the 7mm is a far more effective deer round than the .243.
loaded with 120 gr sierra pro hunter and a relatively mild load so it is still going at 2800 fps it is a really mild and easy shooting round that will knock deer down dead all day long. load it up to maxers with 145 gr and you have a realy potent hunting round.
loaded low a 7mm08 in a model 7 would be ok for a smaller shooter but the fast heavier loads recoil quite markedly in the little remmy. you can load it down to 100 gr for varmint shooting. (although i use the 120 gr prohunters for fox and deer, same poi, same load, no hassle.)
243 is good at varminting.
Sav .250
Member
My vote would go for the...........243. JMO.
Leaky Waders
Member
OK I wrote down some more websites today with good info...
the first one is for ballistics comparison...the last is recoil comparison.
www.shootingtimes.com/ballistics/ballistic-tables/
and
www.chuckhawks.com/recoil_table.htm
I forgot to add...I looked at 22-250 too for a deer/varmint round...but it seemed too controversial. When looking at the low recoil deer catridge do all guns debate the 22-250 comes up and people love it or bash it.
I ended up with a 7mm-08 featherweight. I don't get to touch it until back from deployment. But, I have a 223 a-bolt too for fur plinking (or moose hunting depending what the latest mall warrior/hunter says ).
the first one is for ballistics comparison...the last is recoil comparison.
www.shootingtimes.com/ballistics/ballistic-tables/
and
www.chuckhawks.com/recoil_table.htm
I forgot to add...I looked at 22-250 too for a deer/varmint round...but it seemed too controversial. When looking at the low recoil deer catridge do all guns debate the 22-250 comes up and people love it or bash it.
I ended up with a 7mm-08 featherweight. I don't get to touch it until back from deployment. But, I have a 223 a-bolt too for fur plinking (or moose hunting depending what the latest mall warrior/hunter says
).R.W.Dale
Member
With that kind of slob Fudd attitude I'd prefer if you aimed at the ground
Arkansas Paul
Member
Another vote for the 7mm-08. People think it's a new cartridge, but it's been a wildcat since 1958 and a commercial round since 1980. Also, it doesn't get any better than a 7mm bullet for deer, IMO. Since you handload, working up a light recoiling load shouldn't be a problem.
Art Eatman
Moderator In Memoriam
I read the "aim at fur" as being applied to varmints. A 55-grain .243, aimed at a prairie dog's fur, makes for red mist. IMO folks are too quick to show off their grumpies.
I've spoiled the day for twenty-some Bambis with my .243. I don't at all argue against the 95- or 100-grain bullets, but I've only used the Sierra 85-grain HPBT. However, I was VERY picky about my shots and I've been doing this rifle stuff for many a decade.
Approximately, a .243 is going to be about 2/3 the recoil of a 7mm08. I have a 7mm08 and am quite pleased with it. I reload for both...
So, for a smallish youngun, I vote for the .243. The main thing is plenty of range time--which holds true for all of us, with whatever cartridge...
I've spoiled the day for twenty-some Bambis with my .243. I don't at all argue against the 95- or 100-grain bullets, but I've only used the Sierra 85-grain HPBT. However, I was VERY picky about my shots and I've been doing this rifle stuff for many a decade.
Approximately, a .243 is going to be about 2/3 the recoil of a 7mm08. I have a 7mm08 and am quite pleased with it. I reload for both...
So, for a smallish youngun, I vote for the .243. The main thing is plenty of range time--which holds true for all of us, with whatever cartridge...
Well thanks for teh comments and keep them coming. AS far as shooting goes I won't be to worried about range time, she starts indoor rifle in few days. I am still al little torn, everyone makes valid points.
For varmint I shoot .22-250, alond with a Stag Arms Varminteer. Deer I shoot a .30-06. She shoots .22 often, and will increase with the junior shooting team at the range. My 6 year old son is shooting 2" groups at 50 yds with a 10-22, and she does better, but doesn't have the patience he does.
I am not worried about new reloading stuff as it will pay itself off in the end, but I want her to be comfortable pulling the trigger. Here in ND you can have shots from 10 yds, to 150, as she will be limited by good ol' dad. I thought about letting her use the .22-250, but feel it is a little light, although I did take a doe at 350 with it, i don't reccomend it. She will do some varminting, p.dogs more than anything.
Now do I gor remmy 700 or a tikka, please don't suggest the howa or vanguard, as she thought they were way to heavy. I am not a fan of savage either, so that is out.(tried them, and just don't like the fit and finish.
For varmint I shoot .22-250, alond with a Stag Arms Varminteer. Deer I shoot a .30-06. She shoots .22 often, and will increase with the junior shooting team at the range. My 6 year old son is shooting 2" groups at 50 yds with a 10-22, and she does better, but doesn't have the patience he does.
I am not worried about new reloading stuff as it will pay itself off in the end, but I want her to be comfortable pulling the trigger. Here in ND you can have shots from 10 yds, to 150, as she will be limited by good ol' dad. I thought about letting her use the .22-250, but feel it is a little light, although I did take a doe at 350 with it, i don't reccomend it. She will do some varminting, p.dogs more than anything.
Now do I gor remmy 700 or a tikka, please don't suggest the howa or vanguard, as she thought they were way to heavy. I am not a fan of savage either, so that is out.(tried them, and just don't like the fit and finish.
cougar1717
Member
If it were me, I wouldn't labor over this choice. You already have dies and components for .243 Win. It is a dual purpose caliber, which is a quality that you listed as being important. There is a wide range of bullet weights available for it. I would just stick with it, load 65gr-75gr bullets for varmints and 87gr-100gr bullets for deer.
I am by no means discounting the 7mm-08, but with a bullet range of 100gr. -175gr, I would not consider it to be a varmint caliber due to the lack of lighter bullets. With a larger caliber and heavier bullets than the .243, the 7mm-08 is more suited for deer hunting, but seems to lack the versatility that the .243 Win provides.
I am by no means discounting the 7mm-08, but with a bullet range of 100gr. -175gr, I would not consider it to be a varmint caliber due to the lack of lighter bullets. With a larger caliber and heavier bullets than the .243, the 7mm-08 is more suited for deer hunting, but seems to lack the versatility that the .243 Win provides.
Thanks, Art. I couldn't have said it better. You aim on the animal as far out as you can. Thats why you sight in the way I said and the way the next fellow backed me up with the ballistic data:
Conversely, sighting in at 100 yds makes no sense, at least where we are from. Very novice advice. With that kind of advice the poor girl would be put at a severe disadvantage out here. I guess if they are going to be hunting in forests that would be different. They're talking coyotes though, which means open country to me. One rifle, one fast load for both: sight in 1.5 inches high at 200 yds. You don't know how many coyotes and deer I have seen dumped by a man with a 6mm Rem. shooting this way.
By the way, if she misses the heart by 0.85 inches high @ 100yds. because of this sighting method, with a 243, the deer is dead anyway. Dear Lord, I don't even know why I try.
" 1.5 @ 200 is pretty good.
approx balistics-
3100 fps
Range Impact
0 -1.5
25 -0.21
50 0.85
75 1.66
100 2.22
125 2.5
150 2.51
175 2.22
200 1.62
225 0.71
250 -0.54
275 -2.14
300 -4.1
Tony "
Also it goes without saying that you aim for the right spot on a deer. When I typed aim at fur I meant aim on the animal. No holdover needed if you sight in properly.approx balistics-
3100 fps
Range Impact
0 -1.5
25 -0.21
50 0.85
75 1.66
100 2.22
125 2.5
150 2.51
175 2.22
200 1.62
225 0.71
250 -0.54
275 -2.14
300 -4.1
Tony "
Conversely, sighting in at 100 yds makes no sense, at least where we are from. Very novice advice. With that kind of advice the poor girl would be put at a severe disadvantage out here. I guess if they are going to be hunting in forests that would be different. They're talking coyotes though, which means open country to me. One rifle, one fast load for both: sight in 1.5 inches high at 200 yds. You don't know how many coyotes and deer I have seen dumped by a man with a 6mm Rem. shooting this way.
By the way, if she misses the heart by 0.85 inches high @ 100yds. because of this sighting method, with a 243, the deer is dead anyway. Dear Lord, I don't even know why I try.
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Leaky Waders
Member
You're almost in the sam position as me then:
1) multiple 22's
2) varmint caliber your 22-250 vs my 223
3) bonafide deer caliber your 3006 vs my 270 (I have a 3006 too in an 1895 for plinking).
On another board, some people had made the comments that they bought a 7mm08 and never grew out of it. That made a lot of sense to me.
In other words, people tend to grow out of the 243 as a deer rifle when they can shoot more mass.
Seasoned hunters pick 7mm08...it's not just a kids/ladies gun. And, with reduced recoil (if you can believe the 50% reduction) then the numbers should be the same as your 22-250 or a 223 bolt action.
I'm really curious what you'll pick..caliber,rifle,scope.
1) multiple 22's
2) varmint caliber your 22-250 vs my 223
3) bonafide deer caliber your 3006 vs my 270 (I have a 3006 too in an 1895 for plinking).
On another board, some people had made the comments that they bought a 7mm08 and never grew out of it. That made a lot of sense to me.
In other words, people tend to grow out of the 243 as a deer rifle when they can shoot more mass.
Seasoned hunters pick 7mm08...it's not just a kids/ladies gun. And, with reduced recoil (if you can believe the 50% reduction) then the numbers should be the same as your 22-250 or a 223 bolt action.
I'm really curious what you'll pick..caliber,rifle,scope.
Its a tough call, I know. I came for advice, and I got alot of good advice, and I thank everyone who responded. Now here's a question for all of you that have the woman in your life or new hunter out there, what are they shooting, and how do they handle the round?
Arkansas Paul
Member
My wife is headed to the woods with me this year for the first time. I thought about the two calibers you mentioned as well. I wanted something light recoiling because she's 5'4" and 105 pounds. I think I'm going to load some light rounds in my .30-06 and shoot them to see if that works. In the Speer manual, they claim to have a reduced recoil round. If I think it's too much for her, I'll probably get a 7mm-08 barell for my Optima Elite. If anyone has any experience with the reduced '06 loads, please post and let me know. Thanks.
She can't use your 22-250 for varmints/predators? Then you could get her the 7mm-08, which is a better deer rifle, and shoot managed recoil ammo or load some reduced recoil ammo yourself. I have a 243 and a 7mm-08 and the 7mm-08 just flat out kills deer quicker. I bought a Model 7 youth in 7mm-08 as well for my GFs son to hunt with and I've been doing barrel breakin and sighting in with the managed recoil ammo and its not too bad. Probably recoils like a 243, has short-medium range energy and bullet mass comparable to 30-30 with flatter trajectory and better sectional density. Should be good for 200 yards for deer at least. I think with the new managed recoil ammo, or with reloaded reduced loads, the young inexperienced hunter is no longer relegated to using marginal cartridges for deer hunting just because they have low recoil. The 243 is a compromise cartridge and is at the low end of the range for deer hunting. It is probably best suited for use by experienced (and ethical) hunters who know how to pick their shots and exactly where to place the bullet. It leaves less margin for error.
wyohome
Member
My wife asked if she could hunt deer with me this year. I am very excited about having my best friend as a hunting partner again, when I was a kid my dad filled that role. She had never fired a centerfire rifle until today, when she shot 4 of my .308s. I loaded 125 Gr. Ballistic Tip Noslers ahead of 46.5 Grains of W748 and magnum primers. The result was a very manageable recoiling round that I think will be adequate for deer. She shot pretty well, which told me that it wasn't too much for her. After firing a Kimber Longmaster Classic, a custom 788 Remington, an old 760 Remington, and a first year Model 88, she chose the 88, it hasn't killed a deer since my dad last hunted with it 25 years ago.
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