An interesting news story from TN

[c919]

I thought you guys might find this interesting. It's the story of a Memphis man who was fired upon by gang members while painting over gang signs in his neighborhood and returned fire. I'm interested to hear what my fellow THR friends have to say about this one.

Here's the link to the video:

http://www.wreg.com/videobeta/1ef71...News/Graffiti-Fighters-Shot-At-By-Passing-Car

And also a link to a thread on Tennessee Gun Owners about the incident where the man is actively discussing the incident:

http://www.tngunowners.com/forums/n...-my-handgun-self-defense-first-time-news.html


I feel the man was right in protecting himself and is no doubt an honorable fellow for his service to his community. It's definitely good to see him out there cleaning up his neighborhood. If it was my neighborhood, I'd would have been right there painting as well, which leads me to ponder how I would have reacted to such a situation. I, for one, have mixed opinions on this incident.

I would think that this situation could have gone terribly wrong. The civil liability issues presented by this situation leave me wondering what would have happened if he would have struck one of the passengers of the vehicle who had not fired on him. There's alot that could have gone wrong here. I also find it interesting that he is publicly discussing the incident so soon.

I'm interested to hear what you guys think about this. I consideres putting this in Legal or S&T, but I'm curious to hear what everyone's opinions are about the situation as a whole.

 

[AStone]

I have no opinion on this story yet, but am interested,
in part because I grew up less than 5 miles from where it happened.

 

[Manco]

It's too bad that all of those gang members weren't shot dead on the spot. The act of shooting at somebody who was merely trying to clean up their degraded trash makes this incident morally and ethically unambiguous as far as I'm concerned.

 

[c919]

Yeah, they were definitely dirt. I guess this is the world we live in, but it's still just absurd to me. It's a real shame that a man trying to clean up his neighborhood would encounter an attempt on his life over some paint on a wall. It's sad. I'm just really glad he wasn't hurt and plans to keep on with his work in the community. The world needs more guys like him. He's got heart.

 

[JoeSlomo]

I applaud the gentlemen for taking personal initiative in caring for his neighborhood, and for defending himself from violent criminals.

His actions are in keeping with the finest traditions of law abiding American citizens, and I wish him the best of luck in the future.

 

[AStone]

I guess my only concern would be the potential danger to neighbors when firing back.

 

[dec41971]

Depends on whose side of the story you are looking at. If you are the gang, someone cleaning up your graffitti is invading your territory and disrespecting the gang, for which gang has no problem killing you. The punks are 18y/o who can't legally buy handguns but they went one step further try kill some guys for stupid reasons. Good for the guy. He should have shot and killed at least one of them.

If some idiot is firing at you from a car, and you have the means to defend yourself, I doubt you'd be thinking of innocents in the car. Fact is they are not so innocent if you scratch the surface. If these guys were cops, do you think they'd have said oh wait; there might be some innocents in the car? Highly doubt that. They would have returned a volley of fire.

Lock them up throw away the key, society has no need for their kind, and will soon forget them. Their stupid mother trying to cover up for them, but when they go up to a judge they will be blaming her for not having given them their jello, having not made the milk shake right etc, and made them grow up messed up. Anyone in the US take any responsibility for their acts anymore? Seems to me its fashionable to blame your parents, your neighbor, the school system whatever as long as its not you. Sad.

 

[AStone]

If some idiot is firing at you from a car, and you have the means to defend yourself, I doubt you'd be thinking of innocents in the car.

To be clear, my comments of concern were not about the "innocents in the car".

They were about the innocents in the houses on the other side of the car.

If one thinks that one can shoot at a moving car and put all rnds into it with 100% accuracy, then one is deluded.

 

[ArkieVol]

"I would think that this situation could have gone terribly wrong. The civil liability issues presented by this situation leave me wondering what would have happened if he would have struck one of the passengers of the vehicle who had not fired on him."

No problem. All in the car are guilty, the non-shooters just made a bad choice of friends; their choice, their problem. Glad to see the good guys shooting back

Worrying about "the liability issue" is what caused the gang problem to get out of hand in the first place. For many years the gutless city fathers and the police administration ignored, and even denied, that there were gangs in the city.

FORMER Memphis resident

 

[EddieNFL]

If one thinks that one can shoot at a moving car and put all rnds into it with 100% accuracy, then one is deluded.

Some folks here will disagree with you. Not sure how they know as I've yet to get any practice using moving cars.

 

[jonmerritt]

some military traiining involves moving vehicles, inside and outside. You can hit your target.

 

[Defense Minister]

I agree with ArkieVol concerning the liability issues, but feel that it goes a little deeper than city officials simply sugar-coating gang activity.

 

[c919]

I totally agree from a moral standpoint. Those guys were trash and all involved were guilty whether or not they pulled the trigger. Period.

But.... The law probably wouldn't see it that way.

Think about it this way. Kid 1 shoots at you from the passenger seat, you return fire striking kid 2 in the back seat. Sure, you didn't know that kid 2 was unarmed, you were returning fire at a car full of people who tried to kill you.

The prosecutor would have some fun with this one. "Kid 2 was a great kid who tried to stop kid 1 from shooting. Kid 2 did nothing wrong and was shot and killed just because he was in the wrong place at the wrong time." It's ridiculous but hey, we've heard worse than that before.

I just don't think that the law (in Memphis) would see it as justifiable if anyone but the shooter was shot. I mean this is one of those prime situations where the law makes excuses for this sort of trash.

 

[meytind]

I don't know how it is in TN, but in a lot of places where there are a lot of drive bys, the law finds everyone in the car guilty of attempted murder/murder whether they actually fired or not.

 

[ol' scratch]

violation of THR rules removed

Part of the problem with this world IS intolerance of others' religion. More people have been murdered due to some religious dogma throughout history than for any other reason.

Keep your religion at home, or send your kids to a religious school--you have that right.

To point at one single thing as being the sole cause for societies ills doesn't make sense. Blaming lack of religion makes even LESS sense.

You mention we wouldn't need 'right to carry' if Biblical principles were taught in the home. Did crime just magically dissappear in the 'good ol' days?' When were the good ol' days when crime didn't exist? I have not been able to locate any such time.

 

[Oscar 14]

Bottom line 1: Religion has nothing whatsoever to do with it.
Bottom line 2: Someone shoots at me I'm shooting back. Start worrying about someone who might be beyond the BG and you're liable to die while trying make up your mind if you should defend yourself.

 

[Nick5182]

I give him kudos. He's trying to clean up the vandalism and they start shooting at him, I would have done the same thing and probably emptied my gun.

 

[Buck Snort]

Some folks here will disagree with you. Not sure how they know as I've yet to get any practice using moving cars.

What ya do, see, is to move the barrel of the gun and keep your sight picture on the vehicle as it moves. It ain't rocket surgery!

 

[Buck Snort]

I agree with ArkieVol concerning the liability issues, but feel that it goes a little deeper than city officials simply sugar-coating gang activity. non-THR comments removed

Well, I've already gotten into trouble with my references to religion on this website! I'll just say you don't need religion to teach personable responsibility, many secularists do it on a regular basis.

I'd like to add that it'd be really helpful if the 50 state legislatures would legalize the carrying of a loaded shotgun whilst painting over gang graffitti.

 

[TCOV]

If the neighbors would come out shooting the drivebys would not bother that neighborhood anymore.

 

[AStone]

What ya do, see, is to move the barrel of the gun and keep your sight picture on the vehicle as it moves. It ain't rocket surgery!

Come on, people. You can't be serious. The average shooter - like the guy in question here in Memphis - is unlikely to have the training to hit a target inside a moving car with 100% accuracy every time.

One of the rules of gun safety is, make sure you know what's behind your target (so if you miss, or in case of over-penetration, you don't kill somebody behind it). In a moving car scenario, how is it possible to know what's behind the target as it's buzzing past houses at 30 - 50 mph?

Really.

I'll just say you don't need religion to teach personable responsibility, many secularists do it on a regular basis.

Amen.

And with that said, we should steer away from religion here or risk the padlock.

 

[Mike J]

I'm with Buck Snort. You could take turns on who does the work & who watches. Two guys with 12 gauges could have tore that car to pieces.

 

[Hann]

I agree on the religion comments. Some folks want to control your life through social policy and government, other folks want to control your life through religion and so called morality. They are the same exact thing to me, people sticking their noses where they don't belong. I have no problem with either point of view, I am a true patriot, I believe you have the right to your views and to live your life as you see fit within the law.

...

To comment on the article, I'm glad that guy is taking a stand against gangs. I think he put it well when he said if you're going to shoot at me first you might as well stay home because I'll choose my life over yours every time.

 

[Skillet]

"I would think that this situation could have gone terribly wrong. The civil liability issues presented by this situation leave me wondering what would have happened if he would have struck one of the passengers of the vehicle who had not fired on him."

There's one really good way for the other passengers to avoid the possibility of getting shot in the car. Don't get in the bloody car

But really, he had every right to fire back.

 

[Hann]

I agree 100%. Don't get in the car. If you put yourself in that situation you better be prepared to deal with the consequences. If you participate in a drive by shooting you better be ready to face the fact that people like the guy in the video have had enough and are going to shoot back with the intention of hitting you.