Assess the situation: Chicago man with concealed-carry permit killed in shootout with robbers

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Impossible to say anything in particular without a lot more facts. But we can broadly state the following:
  • Guns don't make their user bullet proof;
  • Some criminals/assailants will run just because you display a gun or point it at them or shoot it at them - others will engage in a competitive gunfight with you;
  • Anyone who carries a gun for protection needs to realize that its use may come in a contested context, where the relative skill and tactics of the people on "the other side" has a major impact on the outcome.
 
Aim1 said:
Tragic. You have access the situation and your odds of success. Maybe 2 suspects is too many. Apparently the good guy did hit both of the suspects in the chest.

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https://nypost.com/2019/09/23/chica...carry-permit-killed-in-shootout-with-robbers/
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The story is poorly written. It looks like Gholston, the victim, killed one of the attackers. The other suspect got away, condition unknown. Another unrelated victim in the barbershop was hit twice in the leg.

The two people "hit in the chest" were Gholston and one of the perps. Both died.
 
Get more CCW in more inner cities and and the mess would self correct.

Tragic about the victim, my thoughts go out to his family. At least he died fighting the vermin. Chicago is a mess. Just random violence against people who have to live in those neighborhoods. Pathetic that they harp about assault weapons every day and ignore a body count that exceeds that of Afghanistan.....
 
This is a reminder that a lethal hit and an instant stop aren't the same thing.

Tragic loss for the father and one of the reasons I own soft body armor. If I lived in Chicago I would EDC my vest, it's cold enough to get away with it and it's what would have saved this man's life.
 
Tragic. CCW may be a right, but it isn't a gaurantee that the armed, honest man will win. It should be kept in mind that it's better not to be where things go sideways than have to rely on a gun.
I'm not saying the deceased here made a mistake; I don't know that.

I'm saying, if I know a violent riot is happening at the corner of Maple Street and Fifth Avenue, I'm going to be far away from that place.:what:
 
Deanimator said:
The owner of a popular Chicago police blog thought that the victim should have just submitted
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Even that depends on the circumstances. If there are three guys who have guns pointed at me at 10' or less and think they are the kind to actually pull the trigger, and I've been caught flatfooted with my gun still in its holster at that point, I'm probably not going to try to quick-draw them... even though I'm reasonably quick and don't mind target transitions. I'd be hoping for a distraction and a moment to make a move to a slightly better position.
 
Unfortunately sometimes the bad guy(s) win.

Years ago I worked the night shift at a local convenience store. I rarely saw a Police Officer drive by and company policy was no firearms. However stores like this are called “stop and rob”’ for a good reason so I carried a Detonics .45 under my smock. My plan was too give the robber(s) whatever they wanted but if they told me to go into the backroom there was no way I was going to comply. I was going to draw my 45 and try to shoot them regardless of my odds of surviving. Maybe the victim felt the same way.
 
ATLDave said:
Even that depends on the circumstances. If there are three guys who have guns pointed at me at 10' or less and think they are the kind to actually pull the trigger, and I've been caught flatfooted with my gun still in its holster at that point, I'm probably not going to try to quick-draw them... even though I'm reasonably quick and don't mind target transitions. I'd be hoping for a distraction and a moment to make a move to a slightly better position.
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Which is why situational awareness is important. Let the other guy try to fight his way out of a bad situation.
 
BSA1 said:
Unfortunately sometimes the bad guy(s) win.

Years ago I worked the night shift at a local convenience store. I rarely saw a Police Officer drive by and company policy was no firearms. However stores like this are called “stop and rob”’ for a good reason so I carried a Detonics .45 under my smock. My plan was too give the robber(s) whatever they wanted but if they told me to go into the backroom there was no way I was going to comply. I was going to draw my 45 and try to shoot them regardless of my odds of surviving. Maybe the victim felt the same way.
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Good plan. It might be risky to shoot it out when they get the drop on you at the register, etc. but being a hostage goes badly far, far too much. Really badly. You couldn't put some of the stuff in horror movies and be believed. Don't be a hostage, ever.
 
huntsman said:
He was outside and followed BGs inside? Was it his shop? If he wasn’t in danger being outside(after BGs went in)then I question his injecting himself into the situation inside
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He was confronted outside by two men with guns.
Father of two Derrick Gholston, 43, was standing outside Crispy Cuts barbershop in the city’s South Side on Saturday night when two crooks pulled out weapons and demanded his property, the Chicago Sun-Times reported.

The suspects then stormed the shop to rob it — and that’s when Gholston pulled out his legally owned handgun, sparking a shootout with the men, the report said.
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One could’ve possibly bypassed him (seeing that his buddy was robbing him) when Gholston pulled out his pistol and shot the first and then engaged the other.
 
Steve S. said:
Carrying a handgun gives you a chance; zero chance just does not sit well with me.
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The anti-gun totalitarian responise:
  1. Armed robbery is a "tax".
  2. The crackhead/meth head/junkie robbing you needs your money more than you do so he can buy... crack, meth or heroin.
  3. You must have done something to "provoke" the robber.
  4. You don't need to defend yourself because you can trust a tweaker waving a weapon in your face to display good judgment, clear thinking and basic human decency.
  5. You can't shoot a strong arm robber because you don't know that he intends to murder you... until he does.
 
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If you show up to a fair fight you didn’t plan well enough.

If a fight finds you, make sure you have the upper hand before you strike.

It’s a tragic loss but this is the highest price that can be paid when one carries, with intent, a weapon of death. To carry for defense, implicitly means it will not be a one sided fight.

Tactics aside, tragedy aside, this very event aside, we carry to dissuade evil from occurring. Evil can still get us though.

I’m not going to armchair quarterback this event from the safety of my home and my locked doors.
 
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