BJPZOO
Member
I am glad I dont live there!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
California does it again: passed the ammo bill.
- Thread starter PinnedAndRecessed
- Start date
- Status
Mr.V.
Member
Actually, you were right all along. They added ammo serialization. My apologies for not appreciating your clarevoyanceMindwip said:
.No_Brakes23
Member
I voted with my feet. Still paying for a CRPA membership, though. Maybe that will help some.
I wanted to "Stay and Fight", but my protecting my family was more important, and Cali's asinine cost of living made that move an even easier decision, despite my wife and I giving up two lucrative careers in Real Estate.
Good luck for those of you still there.
The extreme left of the Dem party is something that should have died a natural death like communism, but Repub flub-ups and bigotry keep it alive. it is amazing to me that the Libertarian party doesn't have a larger presence in Cali. As pointed out earlier, 2a rights are hardly the only ones in danger in the Orwellian hell that once great Eden of California is becoming.
I wanted to "Stay and Fight", but my protecting my family was more important, and Cali's asinine cost of living made that move an even easier decision, despite my wife and I giving up two lucrative careers in Real Estate.
Good luck for those of you still there.
The extreme left of the Dem party is something that should have died a natural death like communism, but Repub flub-ups and bigotry keep it alive. it is amazing to me that the Libertarian party doesn't have a larger presence in Cali. As pointed out earlier, 2a rights are hardly the only ones in danger in the Orwellian hell that once great Eden of California is becoming.
Here's an interesting philosophical question. Should California ever turn itself around with respect to firearms and otherwise, would it not be justifiable to deny the return of people who left. Of course this could not be done legally, but why should those who decided to give up the fight enjoy the rewards gain by those who stayed.
Keith Wheeler
Member
Huh? So be expressing my personal liberty to get the heck out of Dodge (or San Diego) and live my life the way I choose I'm a "traitor" to the "cause" of freeing California?
I don't think so. I mean, let's put it another way.
Since you probably didn't fight on d-day, do you deserve the "rewards" of not being forced to speak German by a national socialist country?
Can'thavenuthingood
Member
AB 352 Microstamping and it appears Serialization has not yet passed to the Governors desk. It is in the Assembly and has been voted on twice yesterday. The last vote was about midnight with 39 Yes and 37 No. It is up for reconsideration and can be voted on again at any time.
Assembly is to reconvene @ 10:30 AM thursday, 31 August for last day of session.
Most of the guys from calguns.net have been up all night calling. So here's your chance to get into the action and help stomp this thing into next year.
Vick
--------------------------------------------------------------
AB352 failed again just before midnight. This time by a vote of 39 yes to 37 no. THE BILL MAY BE VOTED ON AGAIN SO KEEP UP THE PRESSURE.
Assemblyman Leland Yee changed his vote from "YES" to "NOT VOTING." (as good as a "No" vote for defeating a bill)
It would be good if folks would also call him at (916) 319-2012 and THANK HIM FOR NOT SUPPORTING AB352.
They have adjourned for the night, they reconvene at 10:30 AM. G'night. (yawn)
Mike
Assembly is to reconvene @ 10:30 AM thursday, 31 August for last day of session.
Most of the guys from calguns.net have been up all night calling. So here's your chance to get into the action and help stomp this thing into next year.
Vick
--------------------------------------------------------------
AB352 failed again just before midnight. This time by a vote of 39 yes to 37 no. THE BILL MAY BE VOTED ON AGAIN SO KEEP UP THE PRESSURE.
Assemblyman Leland Yee changed his vote from "YES" to "NOT VOTING." (as good as a "No" vote for defeating a bill)
It would be good if folks would also call him at (916) 319-2012 and THANK HIM FOR NOT SUPPORTING AB352.
They have adjourned for the night, they reconvene at 10:30 AM. G'night. (yawn)
Mike
EddieCoyle
Member
I just called. I hope this does not pass. If CA passes this bill, MA will be next.
Flintlock Tom
Member
How many votes are required for a "majority" in the Assembly?
bg
Member
It would need 41 to pass I believe. My long dist bill is
in a hurt now, but it's of little matter when it comes to
something as serious as this. We out here in Ca MUST
keep up the fight.
The four Assembly Members below have so far voted
NO on AB 352.
HCI is running phone banks trying to convince
4 Assembly Members to change their vote to yes.
Here they are.
Name -------------------- Sac office ------- Local office
Joseph Canciamilla ------ (916) 319-2011 --- (925) 372-7990
Shirley Horton----------- (916) 319-2078 --- (619) 462-7878
Gloria Negrete McLeod -- (916) 319-2061 --- (909) 621-2783
Tom Umberg ----------- (916) 319-2069 --- (714) 285-0355
If any of you out there could afford it, maybe you will
call each of these Assembly Members, thank them for
voting NO on AB 352 in the past, and ask them
if they would continue to do so today, the 31st.
It only costs a few cents, and a minute or so of
your time.
THIS IS IT. This is the last day for business up in Sac
for the legislature.
Thanks to the NRA and Mike Haas for the heads up over
at Calguns.
in a hurt now, but it's of little matter when it comes to
something as serious as this. We out here in Ca MUST
keep up the fight.
The four Assembly Members below have so far voted
NO on AB 352.
HCI is running phone banks trying to convince
4 Assembly Members to change their vote to yes.
Here they are.
Name -------------------- Sac office ------- Local office
Joseph Canciamilla ------ (916) 319-2011 --- (925) 372-7990
Shirley Horton----------- (916) 319-2078 --- (619) 462-7878
Gloria Negrete McLeod -- (916) 319-2061 --- (909) 621-2783
Tom Umberg ----------- (916) 319-2069 --- (714) 285-0355
If any of you out there could afford it, maybe you will
call each of these Assembly Members, thank them for
voting NO on AB 352 in the past, and ask them
if they would continue to do so today, the 31st.
It only costs a few cents, and a minute or so of
your time.
THIS IS IT. This is the last day for business up in Sac
for the legislature.
Thanks to the NRA and Mike Haas for the heads up over
at Calguns.
Can'thavenuthingood
Member
This from Mike Haas up at Sacramento, said to spread this far and wide.
From Paul Payne: THE LAST DAY
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Paul's in direct communication with Ed at the capitol and can only occasionally post/email. he asked me to communicate the following.
Mike
-----------
To All:
Your efforts remind me of a couple of my favorite excepts from Shakespeare's HENRY V
================================================
Once more unto the breach, dear friends, once more........................
We few, we happy few, we band of brothers;
For he to-day that sheds his blood with me
Shall be my brother; be he ne'er so vile,
This day shall gentle his condition;
And gentlemen in England now-a-bed
Shall think themselves accurs'd they were not here,
And hold their manhoods cheap whiles any speaks
That fought with us upon Saint Crispin's day.
================================================
This is the last day of this two-year legislative session.
No one can say that the NRA Members' Councils of California didn't take the fight to the legislature, because we did.
No one can say that the NRA Members' Councils of California weren't organized and effective, because we were -- and are.
No one can say that the NRA Members' Councils of California didn't push until the end, because we will.
No one can say that the NRA Members' Councils of California weren't on the offensive in 2006, because we have been and have two pro-gun bills (signed into law) to prove it.
And no one can say that Ed Worley and I, and the NRA leadership, is not extremely proud of your efforts, because we are!
No matter what happens today, you have fought for the Second Amendment and the NRA and make us all proud.
The legislature is now back in the Capitol and we are in the final hours. Anything can happen. Last night, your efforts (led by Ed's direction) held AB352 on the Assembly Floor on multiple votes. It will be back today!
We will focus our efforts for maximum efficiency.
Please call the following legislators and ask them to OPPOSE AB352!
Name -------------------------- Sac office
Joseph Canciamilla ----------- (916) 319-2011
Shirley Horton---------------- (916) 319-2078
Gloria Negrete McLeod ------- (916) 319-2061
Tom Umberg ----------------- (916) 319-2069
Leland Yee ------------------ (916) 319-2012
IMPORTANT NOTES:
- Tom Umberg switched his vote to a "YES." Urge him NOT TO SUPPORT AB352
- Leland Yee switched his vote to a "NO." Urge him to continue to OPPOSE AB352
- The others have not supported AB352. THANK THEM and urge them to continue to OPPOSE AB352
<<< CIRCULATE THIS MESSAGE TO ALL GUN OWNERS SO THEY CAN HELP IN THIS EFFORT >>>
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Last edited by mikehaas : 08-31-2006 at 11:36 AM.
From Paul Payne: THE LAST DAY
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Paul's in direct communication with Ed at the capitol and can only occasionally post/email. he asked me to communicate the following.
Mike
-----------
To All:
Your efforts remind me of a couple of my favorite excepts from Shakespeare's HENRY V
================================================
Once more unto the breach, dear friends, once more........................
We few, we happy few, we band of brothers;
For he to-day that sheds his blood with me
Shall be my brother; be he ne'er so vile,
This day shall gentle his condition;
And gentlemen in England now-a-bed
Shall think themselves accurs'd they were not here,
And hold their manhoods cheap whiles any speaks
That fought with us upon Saint Crispin's day.
================================================
This is the last day of this two-year legislative session.
No one can say that the NRA Members' Councils of California didn't take the fight to the legislature, because we did.
No one can say that the NRA Members' Councils of California weren't organized and effective, because we were -- and are.
No one can say that the NRA Members' Councils of California didn't push until the end, because we will.
No one can say that the NRA Members' Councils of California weren't on the offensive in 2006, because we have been and have two pro-gun bills (signed into law) to prove it.
And no one can say that Ed Worley and I, and the NRA leadership, is not extremely proud of your efforts, because we are!
No matter what happens today, you have fought for the Second Amendment and the NRA and make us all proud.
The legislature is now back in the Capitol and we are in the final hours. Anything can happen. Last night, your efforts (led by Ed's direction) held AB352 on the Assembly Floor on multiple votes. It will be back today!
We will focus our efforts for maximum efficiency.
Please call the following legislators and ask them to OPPOSE AB352!
Name -------------------------- Sac office
Joseph Canciamilla ----------- (916) 319-2011
Shirley Horton---------------- (916) 319-2078
Gloria Negrete McLeod ------- (916) 319-2061
Tom Umberg ----------------- (916) 319-2069
Leland Yee ------------------ (916) 319-2012
IMPORTANT NOTES:
- Tom Umberg switched his vote to a "YES." Urge him NOT TO SUPPORT AB352
- Leland Yee switched his vote to a "NO." Urge him to continue to OPPOSE AB352
- The others have not supported AB352. THANK THEM and urge them to continue to OPPOSE AB352
<<< CIRCULATE THIS MESSAGE TO ALL GUN OWNERS SO THEY CAN HELP IN THIS EFFORT >>>
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Last edited by mikehaas : 08-31-2006 at 11:36 AM.
No_Brakes23
Member
Well, that's a rotten attitude, since I don't want my tax and commerce dollars going to finance a corrupt Orwellian stain on our nation's honor, you think I shouldn't come back?
Don't worry, despite having a great deal of love for California, the cost of living will keep me away. Being a notary public signing people's refinance paper work in California was a huge eye-opener. Good house in a safe neighborhood near anything resembling civilization? $650k if you are lucky. $300k for a house in the middle of the desert? $500k for a house with methlab neighbors? No thanks, even if Cali was 2a heaven, I wouldn't be coming back.
But your craptastic attitude is a huge part of what has ruined that state.
BTW, have you spent at least one term of enlistment sworn to defend the Constitution against all enemies, foreign and domestic? Do you think that those who haven't need to leave the country or perhaps not be allowed to enjoy Constitutional freedoms?
Quite the contrary. If blame can be laid on anyone besides the liberals who pass insane legislation, is is with every single person who has thrown up their hands and left. At the end of the day these things come down to numbers and every person who has left has weakened things for those of us that are determined to change this state.
Quite the contrary, its my attitiude and the attitude of those like me that managed to defeat the microstamping bill last night. If more of you would hvae stayed its possible that such a bill would have never even passed the senate.
No, actually I have devoted my career to upholding the constitution. And no I wouldn't suggest that those who havent leave the country. However similar to the way that soldiers look upon people who have used the freedoms so costly fought for to denigrate the military and what they stand for, I will look upon those who left california when the going got tough only to return when things are nice and ripe, with disdain and disgust.
The person who has nothing for which he is willing to fight, nothing which is more important than his own personal safety, is a miserable creature and has no chance of being free unless made and kept so by the exertions of better men than himself.
Is a 3 car garage and a couple of rifles worth your freedom?
KMBRTAC45
Member
Got this e-mail this afternoon.
'Microstamping' Bill Defeated by California Assembly
(CNSNews.com) - A bill before the California Assembly that would have mandated the "microstamping" of semi-automatic handguns was defeated Thursday night. The measure (AB 352) would have given cartridges fired from those guns a unique imprint, which gun control advocates say will help police solve crimes. Second Amendment supporters, however, say the bill is another attempt to burden gun manufacturers and restrict gun sales in California. "We are thankful that common sense and sound public policy prevailed," said Lawrence G. Keane, senior vice president and general counsel for the National Shooting Sports Foundation, trade association for the firearms and ammunition industry. "This legislation would have forced an unproven, costly and easily defeatable technology upon both firearms consumers and taxpayers, and would have resulted in a ban on all ammunition in California," said Kean. See Earlier Story
'Microstamping' Bill Defeated by California Assembly
(CNSNews.com) - A bill before the California Assembly that would have mandated the "microstamping" of semi-automatic handguns was defeated Thursday night. The measure (AB 352) would have given cartridges fired from those guns a unique imprint, which gun control advocates say will help police solve crimes. Second Amendment supporters, however, say the bill is another attempt to burden gun manufacturers and restrict gun sales in California. "We are thankful that common sense and sound public policy prevailed," said Lawrence G. Keane, senior vice president and general counsel for the National Shooting Sports Foundation, trade association for the firearms and ammunition industry. "This legislation would have forced an unproven, costly and easily defeatable technology upon both firearms consumers and taxpayers, and would have resulted in a ban on all ammunition in California," said Kean. See Earlier Story
Jim Diver
Member
This from the NSSF
Firearms Microstamping, Bullet Serialization
Defeated in California Assembly
Major Victory for Industry
Legislation before the California Assembly (AB 352) that would have required microstamping of firearms and bullet serialization of all ammunition was defeated last night by a vote of 38–34. As a testament to the collaborative efforts of the National Shooting Sports Foundation (NSSF), National Rifle Association, California Association of Firearms Retailers and the California Rifle and Pistol Association, the Assembly refused a request by bill sponsor Assemblyman Paul Koretz for reconsideration of the legislation.
AB 352 would have mandated the use of unreliable, patented, sole-sourced technology to microstamp firearms. Perhaps even more troubling, the Attorney General would have been given the power to require bullet serialization of all ammunition, a mandate that would have resulted in a ban on ammunition sales throughout the state, hurting sportsmen, hunters and firearms enthusiasts.
“We could not be more pleased with the outcome of this vote,” said Lawrence G. Keane, senior vice president and general counsel for the NSSF. “This legislation would not only have forced an unproven and costly technology upon both firearms consumers and taxpayers, but it would have allowed for the banning of all ammunition in California.”
A recent independent, peer-reviewed study published in the professional scholarly journal for forensic firearms examiners proved that the technology of microstamping is unreliable and does not function as the patent holder claims. Furthermore, it can be easily defeated in mere seconds using common household tools, and criminals would be able to simply switch the engraved—“microstamped”—firing pin for readily available, unmarked spare parts.
Opposition to the microstamping and ammunition banning legislation was not limited to the firearms industry; major law enforcement groups and those concerned with higher taxes also voiced concerns. AB 352 would have led to significant price increases for firearms consumers, estimated at as much as $150 per firearm, and all California taxpayers would have been forced to foot the bill for microstamped law enforcement guns.
“We have always said that further research into microstamping, like the study currently being conducted at the University of California, Davis, would be necessary before the legislature considers mandating this very dubious technology,” added Keane. “By defeating AB 352, the California Assembly passed a measure of common sense.”
Firearms Microstamping, Bullet Serialization
Defeated in California Assembly
Major Victory for Industry
Legislation before the California Assembly (AB 352) that would have required microstamping of firearms and bullet serialization of all ammunition was defeated last night by a vote of 38–34. As a testament to the collaborative efforts of the National Shooting Sports Foundation (NSSF), National Rifle Association, California Association of Firearms Retailers and the California Rifle and Pistol Association, the Assembly refused a request by bill sponsor Assemblyman Paul Koretz for reconsideration of the legislation.
AB 352 would have mandated the use of unreliable, patented, sole-sourced technology to microstamp firearms. Perhaps even more troubling, the Attorney General would have been given the power to require bullet serialization of all ammunition, a mandate that would have resulted in a ban on ammunition sales throughout the state, hurting sportsmen, hunters and firearms enthusiasts.
“We could not be more pleased with the outcome of this vote,” said Lawrence G. Keane, senior vice president and general counsel for the NSSF. “This legislation would not only have forced an unproven and costly technology upon both firearms consumers and taxpayers, but it would have allowed for the banning of all ammunition in California.”
A recent independent, peer-reviewed study published in the professional scholarly journal for forensic firearms examiners proved that the technology of microstamping is unreliable and does not function as the patent holder claims. Furthermore, it can be easily defeated in mere seconds using common household tools, and criminals would be able to simply switch the engraved—“microstamped”—firing pin for readily available, unmarked spare parts.
Opposition to the microstamping and ammunition banning legislation was not limited to the firearms industry; major law enforcement groups and those concerned with higher taxes also voiced concerns. AB 352 would have led to significant price increases for firearms consumers, estimated at as much as $150 per firearm, and all California taxpayers would have been forced to foot the bill for microstamped law enforcement guns.
“We have always said that further research into microstamping, like the study currently being conducted at the University of California, Davis, would be necessary before the legislature considers mandating this very dubious technology,” added Keane. “By defeating AB 352, the California Assembly passed a measure of common sense.”
No_Brakes23
Member
That doesn't even make sense. By leaving California, I can afford a nice house, (Far short of a 3 car garage, though,) a few rifles AND I get my freedom.
Tell you what, no ideals are worth making my kids live next to a meth trailer.
Look, I understand the ethos of "If you don't come to Cali, Cali will come to you," and I don't think Cali is a lost cause, but what you don't seem to understand is that I simply could not afford to stay the fight.
I am not talking about opulent mansions with 3 car garages. Housing 2 hours away from my work had already become unaffordable, and I don't feel like saddling myself with an nearly unbearable mortgage to live in a godforsaken rural area hours from anything surrounded by meth users and sellers.
Near the Coast, From Petaluma to Imperial Beach housing is well out of my reach, and the inland area from Yreka to El Centro is utterly absorbed by the Methampetamine Trade. But it broke my heart to leave California. I love to ride my motorcycle and drive my car in the amazing canyon roads of San Diego and Santa Monica. I love living by the Pacific that I have spent the better part of my Marine Corps career serving on. I love standing in snow on Laguna mountain looking down on the rocky desert floor of the Imperial Valley. I love driving 80mph on the freeway and not getting pulled over by CHP. I will miss a lot about California, but I just can't justify staying there in a stagnant never-getting-ahead existance any longer.
Funds alone are what kept me from being in the OLL group this last Christmas. Hell, my last firearms purchase was the end-run Kel-Tec SU-16CA. I didn't move to Washington just to be able to legally own an AR-15, I did it so I could live.
Like I said I will maintain my CRPA membership, and continue to buy from Cali firearms companies, (Like Knoxx and Mesa Tactical,) but my pro-2a vote and my family by necessity have gone elsewhere. If you think that means I shouldn't be welcome back in Cali, then so be it.
PinnedAndRecessed
member
- Joined
- Aug 10, 2004
- Messages
- 1,541
Congrats to you californians. On the 1911 forum one of the posters said that he called his assemblyman's office and the receptionist knew why he was calling before he said anything.
The receptionist said their phone lines had been flooded with calls objecting to the law.
Good for you.
BTW, I just got back from trout fishing in the Ozarks in Arkansas. Say what you will about that state, it sure is beautiful. Caught a ton of trout, too.
The receptionist said their phone lines had been flooded with calls objecting to the law.
Good for you.
BTW, I just got back from trout fishing in the Ozarks in Arkansas. Say what you will about that state, it sure is beautiful. Caught a ton of trout, too.
Blackfork
Member
Police leading the way.
Once again, the Law Enforcement agencies are leading the way in protecting freedom, liberty, and the Bill of Rights they swore an oath to uphold and defend.
The LAST news I THINK I heard is that this got shot down in the California House. It will be filed again.
Bills like this get filed in nearly every state, but usually die in committee. You wouldn't believe the bills that get filed in Texas that the TSRA steers into the garbage can.
Once again, the Law Enforcement agencies are leading the way in protecting freedom, liberty, and the Bill of Rights they swore an oath to uphold and defend.
The LAST news I THINK I heard is that this got shot down in the California House. It will be filed again.
Bills like this get filed in nearly every state, but usually die in committee. You wouldn't believe the bills that get filed in Texas that the TSRA steers into the garbage can.
cbsbyte
Member
To bad for Californians though I am sure most people in the state, including some gun owners are supportive of the Bill. This will also spread to other part of the US, mainly Northeast states whose legislators useally adopt many ideas from the West Coast. New York, New Jersey, Maryland, and Massachusetts will have there own versions of the bill within a few years time. Hopefully we can head them off before its too late.
Creeping Incrementalism
Member
This was already a two-year bill, so hopefully it won't come up for a third time in the next legislative session.
However, there is an ammo bill currently on Arnold's desk that would require ID for ammo deliveries and allow local pre-emption of state gun laws for ammo orders, which coud be very damaging because big cities might totally prohibit home ammo delivery.
PinnedAndRecessed
member
- Joined
- Aug 10, 2004
- Messages
- 1,541
Ndh87 said,
Trust me, you want to help kalifornians to reform their state. Because if they continue to leave, they're liable to come to your town.
Granted, the pro 2nd amendment kalifornians wouldn't be so bad. But both of them have already left. I was one.
For the rest? They come to your town. They were raised with an attitude of entitlement. They insist upon having control of your local politics. And if they cannot? Then they protest. And burn down residential construction projects. And torch SUV dealerships.
They also run through the woods during hunting season, screaming, "Run Bambi, it's man!!!!"
Surreptitious kalifornians have already occupied and conquered Washington State (Seattle), Oregon (Portland), Denver, Nashville, Tulsa, Austin and Atlanta.
It's not a pretty picture.
[tongue-in-cheek = off]
Trust me, you want to help kalifornians to reform their state. Because if they continue to leave, they're liable to come to your town.
Granted, the pro 2nd amendment kalifornians wouldn't be so bad. But both of them have already left. I was one.
For the rest? They come to your town. They were raised with an attitude of entitlement. They insist upon having control of your local politics. And if they cannot? Then they protest. And burn down residential construction projects. And torch SUV dealerships.
They also run through the woods during hunting season, screaming, "Run Bambi, it's man!!!!"
Surreptitious kalifornians have already occupied and conquered Washington State (Seattle), Oregon (Portland), Denver, Nashville, Tulsa, Austin and Atlanta.
It's not a pretty picture.
[tongue-in-cheek = off]
longeyes
member
Stop blaming Californians for socialism.
It's everywhere.
Including the White House.
Wake up.
It's everywhere.
Including the White House.
Wake up.
PinnedAndRecessed
member
- Joined
- Aug 10, 2004
- Messages
- 1,541
Don't be so sensitive.
See the bracketed statement?
"Tongue-in-cheek" means it's supposed to be humorous.
See the bracketed statement?
"Tongue-in-cheek" means it's supposed to be humorous.
ccw9mm
Member
Like most other firearms laws, in practical terms it covers only the law-abiding folks and the guns that get into "the wild" through burglaries. California represents ~12% of the population, so firearms mfrs. are certainly going to take notice. Worst case is: no new sales of newly-mfrd arms will occur in California, prices will skyrocket, and criminals will just ignore all of this. Likely reality: folks will simply keep buying older weapons or get them via other avenues, and criminals will ignore all of this.
- Status