Can I shoot my new Cimarron/Uberti 1851 Navy even though it has a short arbor?

[VMass]

I posted this a couple of weeks back: "If inserted too far, the barrel wedge on my new Cimarron/Uberti 1851 Navy prevents the cylinder from cycling. It has to be backed out almost to the edge of the spring clip before I can cock the gun. My first Uberti 1851 cycles perfectly with the wedge inserted in any position. Any suggestions on what needs to be adjusted/trimmed? Thanks." The overwhelming response was that the Uberti pistol has a short arbor.

My question now is can I continue to shoot my new Cimarron/Uberti 1851 Navy as long as the barrel edge is not inserted too far and the cylinder is free to cycle? My thinking is "enjoy the pistol now and I'll seek a permanent fix later". Thanks for your input.

 

[Titanvk56]

I have before just may get more flash so make sure you have a good seal on chambers. After fix the cylinder may start dragging sooner from buildup depending on gap.

 

[Captain*kirk]

The fix is so simple, only takes a few minutes.
Pull the barrel. Add shims to the arbor until the barrel has .002-.003 clearance between the cylinder face and forcing cone with the wedge driven home solidly with a plastic or nylon mallet. Go shoot.
Grease works well for holding the shims (washers) in place on the arbor end.
There are more permanent/exotic/complex fixes, but this one works just dandy. Just make sure not to lose the washers when you disassemble the gun.

 

[Captain*kirk]

Also may add...yes, you can shoot it. But every shot uncorrected exacerbates the problem and hammers on the wedge slot, wedge, and barrel lug. Set it and forget it.

 

[hawg]

What Kirk said. When the arbor length is corrected the lip on the spring will be all that protrudes. You can pound on it all you want and it won't go any deeper.

 

[Titanvk56]

I JB welded a #6 flat washer to my 1860 to get correct gap. Probably the best fix is to D&T a set screw.

I forgot how much of a small fortune it can take to get back into black powder shooting....doing all my own gunsmithing is a place I can save and learn.

 

[.38 Special]

Yes, the gun can be shot with a short arbor, with no significant damage, for a while - probably. How long is "a while"? I don't know. I've put hundreds of shots through such guns without problem, and later fixed the short arbor with perfect success. Of course, my experience is not universal, and it may well be that some guns can be damaged by such use.

I personally no longer shoot these guns prior to fixing them, and recommend the same practice to everyone else.

 

[Jackrabbit1957]

Seems like the smaller pistols aren't affected as badly or quickly as the big horse pistols, those big guys will have all sorts of issues if not fixed. It just takes longer for the smaller ones to start having problems. Do a permanent fix on it, tune it, shoot it for a lifetime.

 

[armoredman]

Have Jackrabbit1957 fix it - he does wonders with smoke wagons.

 

[45 Dragoon]

I JB welded a #6 flat washer to my 1860 to get correct gap. Probably the best fix is to D&T a set screw.

I forgot how much of a small fortune it can take to get back into black powder shooting....doing all my own gunsmithing is a place I can save and learn.

View attachment 1197726

Don't do the set screw "fix". The arbor should make full contact with the bottom of the arbor hole . . . a set screw reduces the diameter to that of the set screw.

Mike

 

[44 Dave]

Listen to Mike !

 

[Ugly Sauce]

Have Jackrabbit1957 fix it - he does wonders with smoke wagons.

Yes, a good smith can also do some tuning and other improvements while they are doing that. You'll get more than just a correct arbor, and worth every penny. Of course, if you are really poor, just the arbor can be addressed.

 

[VMass]

The fix is so simple, only takes a few minutes.
Pull the barrel. Add shims to the arbor until the barrel has .002-.003 clearance between the cylinder face and forcing cone with the wedge driven home solidly with a plastic or nylon mallet. Go shoot.
Grease works well for holding the shims (washers) in place on the arbor end.
There are more permanent/exotic/complex fixes, but this one works just dandy. Just make sure not to lose the washers when you disassemble the gun.

Thanks for your input. I got a suggestion on my first post to use a #10 stainless steel lock washer as a shim. Ordered some and they're on the way. If they work, I suppose I've found a permanent solution (since I ordered a dozen of them).

 

[VMass]

I JB welded a #6 flat washer to my 1860 to get correct gap. Probably the best fix is to D&T a set screw.

I forgot how much of a small fortune it can take to get back into black powder shooting....doing all my own gunsmithing is a place I can save and learn.

View attachment 1197726

Dang. I ordered some #10 split washers to do the job based on a recommendation on this forum. Oh well, if they're too big I can get some #6 washers. It's not like they cost a fortune.

 

[45 Dragoon]

Dang. I ordered some #10 split washers to do the job based on a recommendation on this forum. Oh well, if they're too big I can get some #6 washers. It's not like they cost a fortune.

You want a "solid" connection not a spring. A split washer is a single coil spring.

Mike

 

[Ugly Sauce]

Dang. I ordered some #10 split washers to do the job based on a recommendation on this forum. Oh well, if they're too big I can get some #6 washers. It's not like they cost a fortune.

No hardware store close by?

 

[Titanvk56]

I got them at Ace Hardware.

 

[Jackrabbit1957]

Mike is right about the lock washer, Uberti played with the spring at the end of the arbor idea and found it accomplished nothing. They went back to business as usual. They also tried making the arbor and barrel lug a very tight fit, to the point of being very difficult to separate the two parts, again it failed to get the desired results. That area needs to seat with full contact between the bottom of the hole and the end of the arbor.

 

[Titanvk56]

It seems like they should make the end of the arbor the same contour/shape as whatever they used to make the hole with. The bottom of my arbor hole is slightly dished out and I initially tried pancaking a BB but could not get flat enough. Maybe should have tried some lead shot.

 

[Ugly Sauce]

It seems like they should make the end of the arbor the same contour/shape as whatever they used to make the hole with.

That might take some serious hand fitting and filing to get that to fit right. And that I'm sure is the reason the arbors are off, the extra expense to have Tony fit the arbors or arbor length to the barrel. Although I would think most people would pay extra for having a pistol that came out of the box set up right. I would.

 

[Jackrabbit1957]

My most common fix is spacers but I do weld material on them on occasion. The end is then contoured to fit bottom of the hole. There's some older pistols out there that have as much as a 3/8 difference and require some creativity to fix.

 

[.38 Special]

That might take some serious hand fitting and filing to get that to fit right. And that I'm sure is the reason the arbors are off, the extra expense to have Tony fit the arbors or arbor length to the barrel. Although I would think most people would pay extra for having a pistol that came out of the box set up right. I would.

I often wonder about that. As far as I can tell, nearly everyone expects these things to be unreliable, inaccurate, and essentially useless, and only bought one because it was cheap and looked cool. They might bring it to the range every once in a while, but mostly it's just for looking at, and maybe shooting at bad guys on TV.

As far as I am concerned, there's no real reason a quality, reliable percussion revolver should cost any less than a quality, reliable centerfire revolver. The relative handful of us who know what the things really are capable of are happy enough to spend the money and/or time, but I wonder if there are enough such folks for it to be worth the effort for a company like Uberti.

 

[hawg]

I often wonder about that. As far as I can tell, nearly everyone expects these things to be unreliable, inaccurate, and essentially useless, and only bought one because it was cheap and looked cool. They might bring it to the range every once in a while, but mostly it's just for looking at, and maybe shooting at bad guys on TV.

As far as I am concerned, there's no real reason a quality, reliable percussion revolver should cost any less than a quality, reliable centerfire revolver. The relative handful of us who know what the things really are capable of are happy enough to spend the money and/or time, but I wonder if there are enough such folks for it to be worth the effort for a company like Uberti.

Probably not as their price point is already higher than Pietta.

 

[.38 Special]

Probably not as their price point is already higher than Pietta.

From either brand, I figure $600 or so as a base price for a gun which could be expected to be reliable and useful out of the box. I'm just not sure they'd sell very many at that price, considering the low expectations most people seem to have for such guns.

 

[hawg]

I wouldn't give that for one no matter how good it was.