Cylinder won't open, HELP!
- Thread starter Bo
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Boats....
+1
Not surprising, given some of the issues revolving around the S&W design.
Having said that, I collect S&W revolvers and have come to expect them to shoot loose. Loctite and a proper tool made for this purpose and used to surround the extractor rod ( there are two sizes) and you are on your way to correcting the problem. As stated above, be sure to use at least three empty cases to support the extractor star and not allow it to torque in tightening.
Giz
+1
Not surprising, given some of the issues revolving around the S&W design.
Having said that, I collect S&W revolvers and have come to expect them to shoot loose. Loctite and a proper tool made for this purpose and used to surround the extractor rod ( there are two sizes) and you are on your way to correcting the problem. As stated above, be sure to use at least three empty cases to support the extractor star and not allow it to torque in tightening.
Giz
Really this is the most frustrating thing about it. Having paid to have it fixed only to not have it work again. Problem is I just know if I walk in there with it again they'll argue it's been out of their shop for so many months, and I've put so-and-so many rounds through, they wouldn't know what I've done with it. Plus having had prior experience with this gun shop, it's the kind of place I'll have trouble getting the time of day since I'm under 45.
I tried turning the rod myself again just now and again no luck. When I get the time/money/nerve, I'll likely just send it to S&W direct. It needs a few other small things buffed up anyway.
Guillermo
member
Absolutely
The anvil-like weight makes it where nothing can rattle loose
everybody sing!
Like a rock
The GP-100 and the 686 are within a half ounce of one another at like barrel lengths. The SP-101 is actually shootable with full house .357 Mags in it.
No one depending on a current production Ruger DA revolver is ever going to possibly die for a screwed in part coming loose at an inopportune moment.
"Like a rock" is when a loose ejector rod keeps your cylinder from opening. Or when the cylinder crane merely falls out, or when the strain screw takes off for parts unknown. Or the bolt screw gives up the ghost.
The design of Smith wheelies is archaic, and sometimes it shows at the worst possible time.
I own Colts, Smiths, and Rugers. The only ones I trust to hold together in the normal course of firing without excuses are my KGP-141 and SP-101. The Colt DS and Model 38 are range toys at best.
No one depending on a current production Ruger DA revolver is ever going to possibly die for a screwed in part coming loose at an inopportune moment.
"Like a rock" is when a loose ejector rod keeps your cylinder from opening. Or when the cylinder crane merely falls out, or when the strain screw takes off for parts unknown. Or the bolt screw gives up the ghost.
The design of Smith wheelies is archaic, and sometimes it shows at the worst possible time.
I own Colts, Smiths, and Rugers. The only ones I trust to hold together in the normal course of firing without excuses are my KGP-141 and SP-101. The Colt DS and Model 38 are range toys at best.
Guillermo
member
Hey Boats,
It was a little joke.
I have owned Rugers. Still have 1. Like them fine.
They are my favorite cast iron weapons.
Seriously
Not sure what is so archaic about a Smith and advanced about a Ruger but okay…
Shoot what you want and enjoy it.
-none of my Smiths have locks
-And since you are happy to buy a new Ruger and immediately send it off to have the gravel removed from the trigger, why can't you do the same with the Hillary Hole on a Smith (or use a little locktite)
It was a little joke.
I have owned Rugers. Still have 1. Like them fine.
They are my favorite cast iron weapons.
Seriously
Not sure what is so archaic about a Smith and advanced about a Ruger but okay…
Shoot what you want and enjoy it.
-none of my Smiths have locks
-And since you are happy to buy a new Ruger and immediately send it off to have the gravel removed from the trigger, why can't you do the same with the Hillary Hole on a Smith (or use a little locktite)
71Commander
Member
In my Smiths, the ejection rod is used for extraction only, not lock up. I have detents for lock up.
Hawk
Member
Beats me.
According to the schematic there might be a spring but I did mine "muzzle up" and nothing of interest happened.
See:
http://www.brownells.com/aspx/ns/sc...?schemid=595&m=15&mn=Smith+&model=K-Frame+19+
'Course the S&Ws are a mystery to me. In the case of the crane retainer, springs come and go based on the "dash" number or the boiling point of mercury or something else.
The fact that Brownell's doesn't identify the part on the model 19 but does on the model 640 might indicate that the part exists on the 640 (which is the one I thread-locked) but may not exist on the model 19 (which I don't have one of) or it might be something else altogether, like they ran out of the part or someone failed to name it when the got to the 19.
Whatever the reality may be, it's a voyage of discovery and great fun provided you embark upon it with the revolver over a tupperware container. If no container available, avoid disassembly over a shag carpet particularly in a darkened room. Parts will burrow after they bounce.
If the above does not fill you with confidence at least I gave you a bump.
I did it. That's usually a safe indication that it may be attempted by anyone.
Ah, but if you look up a particular model in your copy of Standard Catalog of Smith & Wesson, you will find a list of the various dash numbers for that model, and what they represent. That includes the cylinder retention system or screw. Various changes were not made on all models at the same time.
And if one has a copy of Jerry Kuhnhausen's The S&W Revolver - A Shop Manual, they will find specific instructions (including illustrations) on how to handle the ejector rod problem - as well as many others.
The Old Fuff sometimes becomes frustrated in having to answer the same questions over and over, and ponders if he too should write a book. But there is no reason to think it would be better read that the ones cited above.
Those that tinker with their guns are like kids with a new computer/video game. They read the instructions last, if at all...
And if one has a copy of Jerry Kuhnhausen's The S&W Revolver - A Shop Manual, they will find specific instructions (including illustrations) on how to handle the ejector rod problem - as well as many others.
The Old Fuff sometimes becomes frustrated in having to answer the same questions over and over, and ponders if he too should write a book. But there is no reason to think it would be better read that the ones cited above.
Those that tinker with their guns are like kids with a new computer/video game. They read the instructions last, if at all...
Hawk
Member
Ah, but the grasshopper found the schematics and I'm sure you'd agree that a numbered part without a label can be disquieting in the same manner that an unconsumated asterisk is.
And your apprentice was just funnin' on the engineering changes - they are reasonably clear. Also, in the defense of us young 'uns, sometimes we post when we should be working and that bulky old Standard Catalog is at home.
Nonetheless, we accomplished our ends and bumped the thread.
If I might make a request - if you do write a book, make it available in PDF format to allow for electronic searching. Finding that one word reference in book 2 (which is actually the same book) to strain screw "trimming" in Kuhnhausen could have been easier. It doesn't even have an index of the type used in Brownell's gunsmith kinks.
But we press on regardless.
And your apprentice was just funnin' on the engineering changes - they are reasonably clear. Also, in the defense of us young 'uns, sometimes we post when we should be working and that bulky old Standard Catalog is at home.
Nonetheless, we accomplished our ends and bumped the thread.
If I might make a request - if you do write a book, make it available in PDF format to allow for electronic searching. Finding that one word reference in book 2 (which is actually the same book) to strain screw "trimming" in Kuhnhausen could have been easier. It doesn't even have an index of the type used in Brownell's gunsmith kinks.
But we press on regardless.
You have not yet memorized the entire contents of the two mentioned books??? 
What do you do in your spare time?
In your Smith & Wesson Shop Manual, go to Book II, pages 61 through 64. It lists various sad conditions that can happen to a S&W revolver, with proposed solutions. That may get you started, but beyond this there isn't a clue. Also the book doesn't cover the more recent changes, in particular the MIM lockwork. I've found it interesting that no one has written a shop manual to cover these revolvers, and I don't intend to be the one who does.
I haven't looked, but I understand that S&W will download current owner manuals in .PDF format, and maybe if they did things right, an exploded view drawing with part numbers might be included.
Some part numbers for the various dash numbers within a particular model are listed in Brownells' and Numrich Gunparts' print catalogs.
You aren't supposed to be buying newer guns anyway....
The Old Fuff of course, won't touch a gun unless it pre-dates automobiles...
What do you do in your spare time? In your Smith & Wesson Shop Manual, go to Book II, pages 61 through 64. It lists various sad conditions that can happen to a S&W revolver, with proposed solutions. That may get you started, but beyond this there isn't a clue. Also the book doesn't cover the more recent changes, in particular the MIM lockwork. I've found it interesting that no one has written a shop manual to cover these revolvers, and I don't intend to be the one who does.
I haven't looked, but I understand that S&W will download current owner manuals in .PDF format, and maybe if they did things right, an exploded view drawing with part numbers might be included.
Some part numbers for the various dash numbers within a particular model are listed in Brownells' and Numrich Gunparts' print catalogs.
You aren't supposed to be buying newer guns anyway....
The Old Fuff of course, won't touch a gun unless it pre-dates automobiles...
Hawk
Member
Those days are evidently gone. The manuals these days are of the "one size fits all" variety.
However, a downloadable revolver parts list is available. It has no pictures but the "view" numbers sometimes coincide with the schematics on Brownell's web site. When they're off they're close enough one can sort it out - a parts listing for a strain screw shown as "55" may appear on Brownell's schematic as a "60".
One assumes that these minor discrepancies would probably disappear if one actually forked over the 15.00 for the printed S&W parts book. We cheap bastages will have to make do with one eye on a parts listing and another on a not-quite-matching schematic.
What I learned today: the 686 came in a round butt configuration - the strain screws are different. I was unaware that "L"s came in round - while no doubt in the SCoSW, as you've noted, I've not memorized the thing yet - no doubt other surprises await.
I also learned that S&W is pretty painless to deal with when one has a molested strain screw and that one can mention "686" without someone insisting it be sent it for an "M" to be added.
Pretty happy, as campers go.
The strain screws for the square-butt K, L, and N frames is slightly longer then the one for the respective round-butts. Pre-war and early post war strain screws have a different thread then the later ones.
If you are as cheap as you say,
buy the longer square-butt screw and shorten if you use it on a round butt configuration.
The Old Fuff knows this because he's even cheaper they you are...
If you are as cheap as you say,
buy the longer square-butt screw and shorten if you use it on a round butt configuration.The Old Fuff knows this because he's even cheaper they you are...
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