Debating morons, need help

[The Viking]

OK, so at the moment I'm debating a moron on a swedish forum, where he claims that A) Mercury filled rounds are not a myth, and B) That a high velocity round (.50 BMG) merely passing you at a distance of a few inches will kill you/rip your arm/leg/head off.

So, therefor, I need the results witnessed by The Highroaders. I realize none of you are stupid, therefor the mercury filled bullet is likely untested, but I know several of you guys and gals have .50's. So come on, can you give me results from shooting .50 BMG on various targets?
Anything that will debunk the mercury filled bullets BS is appreciated too.

 

[alellis]

At the risk of getting on your wrong side.

I think you could use your time much more constructively than debating these matters with people who don't really want to know.


al

 

[tater_salad]

Im going to assume .50BMG means .50cal heavy machine gun? In the military that is a common 'rumor' that if one of those rounds passes close enough to you but doesn't actually 'hit' you, you will still have some soft tissue damage. I say rumor because I've never personally witnessed it, so I can't say for sure. I know the 0331's (Marine machinegunners) toss that around though.

 

[The Viking]

I'm just looking for some (more) facts to throw in his face. But it looks like it might not be necessary, a bunch of other people have joined the fray

 

[shermacman]

Facts?!
We don't need no steenkin' facts!

 

[Sleeping Dog]

.50BMG means .50cal heavy machine gun?

"Browning Machine Gun", IIRC.

True, if one of these rounds passes close to you it will cause soft-tissue damage. Seeing a pile of un-fired rounds will cause blindness. Reading about the round will cause IQ points to fall away from brain cells. .50BMG is an accursed projectile.

Just kidding of course. A close shot, if it hits something near you, will likely cause bladder and sphincter malfunctions, resulting in a higher-than-normal laundry load. That's the only damage that "close" causes.

Regards.

 

[stevelyn]

Don't debate morons. It only makes your head hurt and the moron still remains a moron.

 

[Byron Quick]

I can't give specific instances, but I've heard of a few people who have survived being hit by a .50BMG.

Mercury bullets? They are real For I made some after reading "Day of the Jackal" when I was a teenager. The supposedly deadly explosive effect did not occur when tested on watermelons. Regular hunting ammo outperformed my admittedly jury rigged rounds. Looking back on it...it's a wonder I didn't hurt myself doing that idiot stunt. I probably did absorb some mercury.

I put some 200 grain .35 Remington rounds in the vise on a drill press and drilled into the bullet a preset distance. Then I put a drop of mercury in the hole. Sealed it with a dab of epoxy. After the epoxy dried, I used a small rasp and emery boards to fair up the epoxy to the original contours.

Mercury bullets are fiction dreamed up by an author who doesn't know much about firearms.

 

[The Viking]

Mercury bullets? They are real For I made some after reading "Day of the Jackal" when I was a teenager. The supposedly deadly explosive effect did not occur when tested on watermelons. Regular hunting ammo outperformed my admittedly jury rigged rounds. Looking back on it...it's a wonder I didn't hurt myself doing that idiot stunt. I probably did absorb some mercury.

You tested on watermelons, just like in The Day Of The Jackal? Care to tell more about the results? Remember what kind of bullets you modified, and what kind of ammo that performed better?

 

[griz]

How does a 50 punch holes in a paper target without shredding it?

On second thought, don't debate morons. It might be contagious.

 

[JoeG52]

Just don't.

 

[Yanus]

Never argue with a fool. It accomplishes nothing and it annoys the fool.

Yanus

 

[Old Fuff]

I think part of the problem is that in Sweden relatively few people have any actual experience and know little about firearms. What knowledge they have comes from fictional sources and questionable news media reports, but they believe it is true. The same could be said about some people in parts of the United Kingdom, or for that matter, the United States.

So why debate with such individuals? Well if the exchange is on a public forum it gives our side a chance to shine some light on the subject and expose some myths. While the other party in the debate may have a closed mind, others who are following along may not.

So from this perspective, what Unarmed Shooter is doing is good, and he should be encouraged to continue.

 

[mec]

Also, a .45 automatic is so powerfull that if one hits you on the tip of the finger, it will spin you like the knob on an outhouse door.

I applaud the epistemology of actually making a mercury filled bullet. That's looking in the camel's mouth and counting the teeth. A while back, I got an opportunity to shoot a 50bmg rifle. The target was a litre seven up bottle full of water. I expected instant separation into hydrogen and oxygen. Made a solid hit from about 100 yards with standard ball and the bottle fell over. We ran down there and the bottle was lying on its side with some of the water still in it .50" hole through both sides. We shot one of those iron clamps they use to fasten railroad rails to the cross ties. The base of the bullet was flush with the iron. didn't go through but was kind of neat anyway as the sawhorse it was suspended from fell over.
We also used to put pistol primers in the hollow points of keith bullets. Theywould go pop if you hit steel or concrete but otherwise-nothing. Also drilled out .22 hps and filled them with firecracker powder. Same thing, Hit something hard and they would pop -hit anything else and they worked about like the lead azide bullets the idiot used to shoot Reagan and Brady-that is they didn't go off.

 

[The Viking]

I think part of the problem is that in Sweden relatively few people have any actual experience and know little about firearms. What knowledge they have comes from fictional sources and questionable news media reports, but they believe it is true. The same could be said about some people in parts of the United Kingdom, or for that matter, the United States. So why debate with such individuals? Well if the exchange is on a public forum it gives our side a chance to shine some light on the subject and expose some myths. While the other party in the debate may have a closed mind, others who are following along may not. So from this perspective, what Unarmed Shooter is doing is good, and he should be encouraged to continue.

Thing is, on this forum, there are a number of people who are very knowledgeable about firearms. One current discussion covers the topic "I'm thinking of buying another rifle, any suggestions?" the suggestions are all very well informed, and due to our laws, most of them suggest the most all-round rifles they can think of.
And, if you are over the age of, say 30, chances are that you have some experience with firearms from the armed forces, since back then, like EVERYBODY was to do some training.
Seeing that this particular guy claims to "have seen things" in the course of his career, and the BS he spouts, makes me think he´s just an Armchair Commando. Yes, they are somewhat common here too, since everybody needs to be cool in front of the ladies when they go to the local bar/pub, and therefore claims to have been a Coastal Ranger, or Paratrooper, or Ranger. Medics, truckdrivers, Quartermasters, cooks etc. are scarce, if you are to believe everyone...eh, now I got a little OT.
Anyway, Sweden has quite a large number of hunters, and weapons to equip every one too. There are a few other who have chipped in against another moron, who claims that a buddy (The everpresent "buddy o' mine" ) took dow a deer simply by missing it with a few centimetres. Broken back from shockwave he said.
The biggest issue of mine with this is that I cant stand BS-ing. Not in any bloody way will I tolerate it. I don't own any firearms yet, I don't have much experience with them either, but I have a huge amount of common sense. That can be a powerful weapon against the forces of stupidity.
BTW, thanks for encouraging me

 

[mete]

Old Fuff, Sweden [they do hunt there] and Switzerland have spent much time and effort to design "humane " bullets for their military. Interesting since neither country goes to war and the Swiss at least are prohibited from selling ammo outside their country !!....Many different bullets have been made including mercury filled , a primer in the hollow point to make expansion more effective . That they are not in commercial production tells you they don't work. On the other hand the premium bullets on the market today are very effective, consistant .'The Day of the Jackal" was a fine book and movie .However the mercury bullet was put in there for effect .I remember seeing the movie and the gasps of shock from the audience when the melon was hit -I just laughed ! A high velocity fragile 22 hollow point would have done the same thing .

 

[thatguy]

You need help debating morons?

A 50BMG doing damage with a miss: Myth.

As someone noted, these are shot at paper targets all the time and leave nice holes in the paper. If there was all this energy surrounding the bullet the whole target would be shredded.

 

[hkmp5g17]

Never argue with a drunk...... or a moron. :banghead:

Anthony

 

[MikeIsaj]

Don't waste your time debating with morons. They're morons! They'll never get it, either because they don't want to, or are too stupid. That's why we call them morons!

 

[Darth Ruger]

I've heard plenty of doozies in my time. Back in my Army days, there was this guy in my platoon in Germany who insisted the covert ops guys had this special laser-guided nuclear-powered 'bunker buster' .50 bullet that would pass completely through an M1 Abrams tank and the resulting pressure "will liquify you and suck you out the hole!"

I still get a laugh every time I think about that guy.

 

[kirkcdl]

Why use mercury and risk poisoning yourself when plain old water has the same non-compression property?For those unaware,you cannot compress water,one cubic inch will always be,in its liquid state,one cubic inch regardless of the amount of pressure it's under.Theoretically,if you fill a hollow point with water and seal it,the water will cause the hollowpoint to expand in an explosive manner on impact.Never tested it myself,but the water would be safer...

 

[The Tourist]

I think 'debate' is a lost art, it died sometime around 1972. Since then, you either agree totally and completely with the guy who started the thread or you get branded a troll and trouble maker by actually disagreeing with the initial concept.

You could try yelling louder.

I used to debate on a knife forum. Now there's a waste of bandwidth. If you said something like, "I like Striders," some brain-donor would shoot back (in all caps and in bold face), "Why do you hate Spyderco?" It would immediately degrade into a personal attack.

If a more liberal member of the board was flamed, and you asked for decorum, you were immediately branded a "liberal lover." Then, of course, there were two dozen posts that ran something like, "My uncle died at Omaha Beach to secure freedom for you communists' liberty, and you trash his memory!"

Debating had died, and in its place we got a "shoot the messenger" system. I regret that there was a time that a skill debater could take either side of an argument, and deftly win. It was fun.

I've found that on any board you name (no matter how many thousands of members have registered), perhaps five guys are worth answering. The rest of them can't even spell, even when they're butchering their own syntax.

 

[bogie]

At 100 yards (point blank range) a .50 BMG will punch an approximately 1/2" hole through fragile paper. Reach your own conclusions.

You can fill stuff up with mercury, but it ain't gonna work any better.

 

[Solo]

OK, so at the moment I'm debating a moron on a swedish forum, where he claims that A) Mercury filled rounds are not a myth, and B) That a high velocity round (.50 BMG) merely passing you at a distance of a few inches will kill you/rip your arm/leg/head off.

Ask him for his credentials.

 

[The Viking]

Ask him for his credentials.

Good idea, but people are already questioning him, and he has left the debate too...