Emailed Remington about accuracy issues, let’s see what they say..

[243winxb]

http://www.chuckhawks.com/practical_accuracy.htm I find this to be true. Groups are always smaller on the internet.
For real accuracy results, follow the American Riflemen Magazine where they fire 5- 5 shot groups for a test. Many rifles . do not average MOA.

 

[243winxb]

http://www.chuckhawks.com/practical_accuracy.htm I find this to be true. Groups are always smaller on the internet.
For real accuracy results, follow the American Riflemen Magazine where they fire 5- 5 shot groups for a test. Many rifles . do not average MOA.

 

[MtnCreek]

I did get an email back from hart barrels, looks like they can get it all done, just looking at about 8 months!

If you decide to go this route, call Accurate Ordnance 678-219-0096. They will likely be able to turn it around in a month or two. I'd have them skim bed it too. Buy a cheap hardcase to ship it in, wrap that in tape, box it up and ship. They will ship it back to you, directly to your address. FWIW, I have a nice rifle built by them that shoots lights-out, but I've been spending more time lately shooting a cheap savage that I rebarreled and a tikka ctr that I bought for a good bit less than your 700. Money doesn't always buy love. LOL.

Edit: The smart move may be to post it on gunbroker and get soemthing else. Answer any questions truthfully. Odds are it will shoot better than whoever buys it. Flame suit on...

 

[Picher]

If you discover parallax at the range you want to shoot, it's possible to reduce or eliminate it for group testing. The reason that scopes have parallax problems at certain ranges is because scope reticles can only be eliminated for specific distances. This is especially noticeable at higher magnification. Parallax is mainly due to light rays entering the objective at the edges have to bend more than those entering nearer the lens center, so scopes with adjustable objectives or parallax adjustment knobs can eliminate parallax.

A simple way to minimize parallax (in scopes without adjustments) is to cut a disk to fit the objective lens, then cut a hole in the middle, about 1/3 the diameter of the disk. Apply tape to hold the disk in place while you fire groups. The image will be darker, but parallax will be minimized and groups may shrink.

I usually just back off from the eyepiece and center the image in the black surround, but that takes extra care with each shot.

 

[Picher]

It usually shoots pretty rounded groups but I have had a few double grouping issues. Sometimes it will shoot 2 in the same hole , and 1.5 over 3 touching. The best group it has ever shot was when I made a mistake and loaded 5 grains over max while testing reloader 22. The 5 shot group was .5". It was too hot though , it registered almost 3000 fps with a 212 grain bullet! The barrel does not touch i sanded it a bit and I've checked it what seems to be a couple thousand times! Lol

The barrel doesn't have to touch the barrel channel for it to be affected. A minimum of 1/16" clearance is needed to eliminate bouncing.

Are the scope mount bases set in high-strength Locktite? Also, base screws threads should have removable (usually Blue) Locktite. Base screw torque should be 18-20 inch-lbs, according to "Fat Max" instructions.

 

[Picher]

http://www.chuckhawks.com/practical_accuracy.htm I find this to be true. Groups are always smaller on the internet.
For real accuracy results, follow the American Riflemen Magazine where they fire 5- 5 shot groups for a test. Many rifles . do not average MOA.

My sub-MOA rifles don't always shoot MOA, due to range wind/mirage conditions, my patience, ammo situations, etc. The same applies to writers testing rifles/ammo. Sometimes, I get a little suspicious of writers groups, especially when there are powder burns on the targets. LOL

 

[Bayourambler]

Got an email from Remington.
"The results you are experiencing are not typical of the Sendero line. Please use the link below to initiate a repair request for your rifle:

ccm.remington.com

Thank you,
Remington Consumer Services"

 

[Nature Boy]

I get a little suspicious of writers groups, especially when there are powder burns on the targets. LOL

That's why I don't post many pictures of my pistol groups. I had a really good one going that I wanted to show off on THR but the target caught fire and burned up before I could snap a pic

 

[Llama Bob]

This whole thread makes me very glad my hunting rifles are m70s

 

[Sunray]

You're expecting as great deal of a commercial hunting rifle. The price of any commercial hunting rifle does not guarantee 1 MOA accuracy. Regardless of the brand. Commercial hunting rifles do not require 1 MOA accuracy.
"...a good day it will give me 1.5” groups..." That mean it's not consistently producing 1.5" groups? Part of that can be the operator.
"...did you try a different scope?..." That won't fix any accuracy issue or accuracy expectations. A scope will not improve accuracy of a rifle that isn't accurate already.

 

[Skylerbone]

My guess is that the OP's scope has some means of parallax adjustment as nearly every 34mm scope does and if not, it's not likely more than 1/4" off at 100 yds. (Assuming that is the test distance).

My general belief is that any new rifle not capable of at least the occasional MOA group has one of three issues: loose optics (I think that's been eliminated here), a true factory defect or a recoil sensitive shooter. In .300 Win Mag my mind will always jump to the latter unless I am aware of a shooter's history of shooting with fairly stout recoil. If the OP confirms his .375 H&H shoots .7xx consistently then I'd say defect.

 

[joed]

Have you taken the scope off and checked the scope base? Also, who installed the scope?

I went through this with a 700 vs awhile ago. Groups were just not acceptable for me. When I took the scope off I found the rear base had worked itself loose. It now shoots some nice groups.

Trigger? Stock trigger and have you adjusted it?

 

[joed]

Good luck, that' why I buy savage

I had a $900 Savage 12 VSS that shot 1.5" groups and a 10fp in .223 that couldn't feed the next round 30% of the time. It's not just Remington, they all can put out a bad one.

 

[Bayourambler]

This thread has taken a turn, I'm out. Anyone who thinks a certain company can make rifles ,(or anything for that matter), and they ALL turn out great, is foolish.

 

[Skylerbone]

Bayou, I don't mean to question you, only those things we do not know. I mean absolutely no offense by what I wrote, it has simply been my experience that many a first-time .308 owner who was excited to test his new rifle wound up with a pained look over recoil, including my cousin at 6'3", 275 lbs. Despite decades of martial arts and 5 black belts he didn't want to shoot more than 8 rounds. I put 10 through it and went back to my 30-06s which were each fed 25 that day.

.300 Win. Mag is no friend to the shoulder for anyone and one qualification toward trying to assess what's going on is your level of experience with heavy recoil. Anticipation alone can wreck a group, and yes I know that from personal tribulation. I do hope it gets sorted out without more money being spent and a wish you luck in your dealings with Remington.

 

[Bayourambler]

Bayou, I don't mean to question you, only those things we do not know. I mean absolutely no offense by what I wrote, it has simply been my experience that many a first-time .308 owner who was excited to test his new rifle wound up with a pained look over recoil, including my cousin at 6'3", 275 lbs. Despite decades of martial arts and 5 black belts he didn't want to shoot more than 8 rounds. I put 10 through it and went back to my 30-06s which were each fed 25 that day.

.300 Win. Mag is no friend to the shoulder for anyone and one qualification toward trying to assess what's going on is your level of experience with heavy recoil. Anticipation alone can wreck a group, and yes I know that from personal tribulation. I do hope it gets sorted out without more money being spent and a wish you luck in your dealings with Remington.

Non taken. The sendero is so heavy it really isn’t bad on recoil . I have no shame , I wear a PAST recoil strap on my right shoulder and it is really comfortable. Like I said ,I shoot my buddy’s 300 Weatherby Vanguard and shoot it under inch groups. Now that thing is NOT fun to shoot, but I set my mind to it and do well with it. We lead sled also sometimes just be be sure.

 

[MidRoad]

Got an email from Remington.
"The results you are experiencing are not typical of the Sendero line. Please use the link below to initiate a repair request for your rifle:

ccm.remington.com

Thank you,
Remington Consumer Services"

That's good to hear. Glad they're going to at least look at it .Let us know what they do for you. Good luck

 

[LoonWulf]

Got an email from Remington.
"The results you are experiencing are not typical of the Sendero line. Please use the link below to initiate a repair request for your rifle:

ccm.remington.com

Thank you,
Remington Consumer Services"

Thats both good to hear and dosent really surprise me. From what ive seen of the most recent 700s, and heard from the local store guys ive talked to, remington has been steadily doing better over the last couple years at not putting out utter crap, and when something gets thru fixing it.
at least on their more premium lines, not sure what they would do with a 783.....

 

[Bfh_auto]

If Rem doesn't fix it. Look into stiffening the forearm. This tends to be a problem with plastic stocks.

 

[Poper]

Unfortunately, this is the same logic that saw me throwing good money after bad on a Ruger 77 Hawkeye. Because I knew one man at my range who was lucky enough to get a shooter.

I wish you the best, but I've been down this road before. Best decision I ever made was to sell it and replace it with a Tikka. I've never missed that Ruger.

I did the same thing with a Ruger in .270 Win. The Tikka T3 Lite that replaced it will shoot 1-3/4" groups with 140 grain Bergers at 500 meters. It's now my high power silhouette rifle.

 

[Poper]

Thats both good to hear and dosent really surprise me. From what ive seen of the most recent 700s, and heard from the local store guys ive talked to, remington has been steadily doing better over the last couple years at not putting out utter crap, and when something gets thru fixing it.
at least on their more premium lines, not sure what they would do with a 783.....

I bought a 783 less than a year after they came out because I got it for just over $200. (.30-06) Ugly thing, but shoots surprisingly well.

 

[Orcon]

If Rem doesn't fix it. Look into stiffening the forearm. This tends to be a problem with plastic stocks.

The Sendero doesn't have a plastic stock; it has a fairly stiff fiber glass stock made by HS precision.

 

[Poper]

http://www.chuckhawks.com/practical_accuracy.htm I find this to be true. Groups are always smaller on the internet.
For real accuracy results, follow the American Riflemen Magazine where they fire 5- 5 shot groups for a test. Many rifles . do not average MOA.

1.5 MOA means a rifle that groups within 3" at 200 yards and 6" at 400 yards. This is a very interesting rifle indeed, particularly considering the muzzle blast and recoil of most ultra-long range cartridges. Such rifles are quite scarce in the real world.

Evidently Mr. Hawks hasn't shot a Tikka yet. I have yet to see a Tikka that won't shoot inside 1.5" at 100 yards. There is probably one out there, but I haven't seen one...... Yet.

 

[Bfh_auto]

The Sendero doesn't have a plastic stock; it has a fairly stiff fiber glass stock made by HS precision.

Thanks I'll remember that.

 

[redbullitt]

If you happen to get the rifle back and things do not improve noticeably look into the scope and the mounting setup simply to rule it out. It doesnt matter how good your scope is... things happen, especially if you use your gear hard.

I have personally had serious consistency issues with a Nightforce F1 and a US optics LR17. There were lens problems that were not apparent from the outside. I simply tested everything one variable at a time and finally came to the conclusion that the scope was the issue... Both times the manufacturer found internal lens issues. Once returned the scopes have both been top notch.

 

[WVRJ]

I have owned and shot somewhere in the neighborhood of 25 M700's.I still have 10 of them in different variations.Each and every Remington I have has had the barrel free floated,the trigger tuned or replaced,the locking lugs on the bolt lapped,a Leupold scope in good mounts,the action glass bedded,the barrel kept clean and the action screws torqued at 50 inch pounds.One out of the bunch got a new barrel because it wouldn't shoot any better than 1.5 MOA.Every one of my 700's will shoot the Magic Minute of Angle if I do my part,and some of them are downright wicked accurate.I have seen many things that will affect accuracy,but one of the worst problems they seem to have is bedding.I just had a tough time with a 280 that I put in a Magpul Hunter 700 stock.This stock has an aluminum bedding block,so I didn't do anything to it other than bolt it on.The rifle lost accuracy big time,going from a solid MOA performer(5 shots) to a 2.5 MOA problem child.I cleaned up and roughed up the bedding and skimmed the action and bedded the recoil lug.Put it right back in tune.Many things can mess with a rifle's accuracy,any brand of rifle is susceptible to accuracy problems.My 700FS in 300 Win Mag will put 3 shots in one inch,but it won't do 5.But that's ok for what I use it for.When you take a 2 MOA rifle and do what needs done to make it a 1.5 MOA rifle,it takes work,patience and time.Going to 1 MOA takes a lot more.Going to .5 MOA takes even more yet.I would be disappointed in a $1300 rifle that wouldn't shoot as well as I thought it should shoot,but I would begin the sometimes long journey to get it where it needs to be.My 700 VTR in 308 took from 2009 until 2013 to get it to perform as well as I thought it should.Attention must be paid to the smallest of details,and the man behind the gun has to be in tune as well.700's are great rifles,but they need to be tuned a lot to get them to shoot to their potential.