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Erratic shots?

kmw1954

Member
Joined
Jun 24, 2018
Messages
3,616
Location
SE Wisconsin
Been shooting our winter local league and am noticing a pattern I am not sure how to correct. At all distances I seemed to have developed a flaw to were when I am missing they are generally to the left and low. This is all being shot from a bench using a Harris bipod and a rabbit ear rear bag. Very seldom am I missing right. Other times I can place 5 shots inside a 1" dot at 100yds.
 
Low right indicates shooter error/ tracking error and not single point wind.
@Varminterror has good input on bipod shooting.
OK yet again these are consistently going to low left and is not wind related. Has to be something in technique.

Yes he has been helping me with this rifle for a couple of months now. He was assisting when I ran into the Hornady brass problem weeks ago. I can't say enough about just how helpful he has been.

This tend is a recent development from just the past few months as I was hardly able to shoot all last summer due to work and a family issue.
 
IMG_0721.jpeg This wind chart is dedicated to barrels with a right hand twist and wind from a single direction. The arrow indicates direction while the circle is the point of impact. These are generalizations and subject to wind speed as well. ( meaning you could get blown off paper in the wind is strong enough)
Good shooting to you.
J
 
OP has been seeing some low left strikes relatively consistently from week to week, and relatively scaling with distance from 100 - 300. It's not occurring for ALL groups, as it would if it were a zero offset error or for consistent wind errors, and he's shooting some of his competition targets as round robin, some as sequential shot groups, so it's kinda odd.

The OP and I have already discussed excessive grip pressure, trigger management, and excessive shoulder or cheekweld input against the stock (shooter errors which either pull the pistol grip outward or push the buttstock outward). We also discussed wind, since he's shooting on the same range at the same direction - but the varying shot sequence format and relatively inconsistent response doesn't really seem to fit wind - and the direction isn't really consistent with wind rose response.

@JFrank - of note, he's striking low LEFT, down and out almost on a 45* line, so the wind rose doesn't really explain his offsets (whereas a ~10 o'clock wind WOULD explain low RIGHT groups).
 
Nice can you PM me a copy of that? Yes, only these misses are generally going to the 7:30-8:30 area of the target. Also wind direction has no bearing on this as it happens with winds coming from any direction. This is showing up in both league and practice targets.
 
The OP and I have already discussed excessive grip pressure, trigger management, and excessive shoulder or cheekweld input against the stock (shooter errors which either pull the pistol grip outward or push the buttstock outward). We also discussed wind, since he's shooting on the same range at the same direction - but the varying shot sequence format and relatively inconsistent response doesn't really seem to fit wind - and the direction isn't really consistent with wind rose response.
Trust me I have now started to pay more attention to these areas as you suggested. I have noticed at times I still struggle with position behind the scope. Seems to move from day to day at times. Have tried different riser heights and even that seems to change at times.
 
OP has been seeing some low left strikes relatively consistently from week to week, and relatively scaling with distance from 100 - 300. It's not occurring for ALL groups, as it would if it were a zero offset error or for consistent wind errors, and he's shooting some of his competition targets as round robin, some as sequential shot groups, so it's kinda odd.

The OP and I have already discussed excessive grip pressure, trigger management, and excessive shoulder or cheekweld input against the stock (shooter errors which either pull the pistol grip outward or push the buttstock outward). We also discussed wind, since he's shooting on the same range at the same direction - but the varying shot sequence format and relatively inconsistent response doesn't really seem to fit wind - and the direction isn't really consistent with wind rose response.

@JFrank - of note, he's striking low LEFT, down and out almost on a 45* line, so the wind rose doesn't really explain his offsets (whereas a ~10 o'clock wind WOULD explain low RIGHT groups).
My opinion is the same as many wind readers , that low impacts are not wind induced rather shooter error if consistent. And perhaps tune related depending on many aspects but I’d have to see the targets to make any further comments.
@kmw1954
Post some targets to get better feed back.
 
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Nice can you PM me a copy of that? Yes, only these misses are generally going to the 7:30-8:30 area of the target. Also wind direction has no bearing on this as it happens with winds coming from any direction. This is showing up in both league and practice targets.
You can take a screen shot if you like, I posted the wind chart for your benefit , I never said that was the issue. Please re -read my post before discounting it.
 
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Which of these you prefer will depend upon you subscribe fully to spin drift or not.
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BUT... Low Left at the 45* you're shooting likely is a shooter mechanical input - so we have to pick, does your zero have a low left offset and sometimes you punch with your hand and push it up to center, OR is your zero good and sometimes you jerk/squeeze with your hand or push with your shoulder to shove some of your shots low left?
 
, I posted the wind chart for your benefit , I never said that was the issue. Please re -read my post before discounting it.
I know that and appreciate the help, I have not see that chart before which is why I asked. Also understood your meaning and was just trying to elaborate and clarify what I was seeing and what I understood that it is more a mechanical error than an environmental cause. I'll be the 1st to admit my technique has flaws. Just ask the guys I shoot with.

Now why is it that I still get the impression that you are still angry with me from the other forum and the other issue?
 
As for the scope zero. I out of habit take sighters before I start a session and can normally see which way the scope may be off, high, low, left, right and make corrections with subsequent shots being consistent. Always afraid of over-correction. Mostly my zero orientation is off slightly left or right.

It is these low left shots that consistently come out of nowhere. Most of the time I can call a high, right, left.

Bipod is removed after each session and attached at the beginning of each.
 
I know a couple things simply because I’ve made every error a shooter could possibly make, so with that in mind I’ll state that the wind rose is strictly for single point wind , meaning that multiple direction/ swirling or mounds down range can all effect wind and quite possibly send rounds in any direction, although inconsistent.. as pointed out yours seem consistent low left and in my experience is the driver. Recoil management issues show up more as vertical while out of tune rifles throw shots in all directions.
Of course there are always exemptions and posting targets are the best way to analyze along with wind flag notes of conditions.
- might add that I try not to give advice ( I leave that to the more experienced) rather just share an experience IF I’ve had to deal with the particular issue.

Good shooting to all.
Best wishes
J
 
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J, I fully understand your point on advice and advice that is experience based as to opinion based. Reason I do not give reloading advice or suggestions as to what to use. Though in this case I appreciate your experience and can take it as knowledgeable related experience. I know your experience level with this is much, much greater than mine. So I can always listen and as always if there is something I do not understand I am not afraid to ask questions.

We could probably have a very good discussion on many things shooting if we were sitting together face to face.

I will look to see what I can find for recent pictures that demonstrate what is going on.
 
Week 4 Cold Bore_Kevin W.jpg
20240127_122957.jpg
20240120_134915.jpg

These are the last 3 weeks targets, top being the most recent. Distance;1st 100yds, 2nd 300yds, 3rd 200yds.

1st picture bottom row 3 circles are 5 shots ea. all or nothing. Miss one that sub does not score. ea. sub 30 points. The next two targets are IBS Official Hunter targets. 2nd picture was 300 yds. So without looking at group size and just POI when all were dead hold.
 
all distances I seemed to have developed a flaw to were when I am missing they are generally to the left and low
At least your failures are consistent even if not repeatable on demand. Would taking the bipod out of the equation and shooting strictly off bags be an option, or has it been tried?

Are you able to shoot at all with your non-dominant side?
 
Could be one hell of a lot of swirling wind OR ..I’ll go out on a limb a suggest the rifle is out of tune just enough to cause over correcting while shooting. It doesn’t take being off by much powder , or seating changes to enter the scatter node. I’d have to see the tuning ladders to give more input but i don’t see consistent low left impacts.
 
You mean the buttplate is against a sandbag?
i shot F class with front bipod and the stock ON a sandbag, the butt shouldered. Lots of attention to uniform shoulder contact to avoid “shoulder mirage.”
 
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