Federal .44 Special LSWCHP

[JERRY]

Trying to steer this back on track, the loads sought are for a Charter Arms Bulldog. the gun is lightly built compared to other .44 specials.

 

[Zendude]

hmmmm. I think Im gonna try some backwards loaded wadcutters in .44 spl, many people use to swear by thing in the .38 so ill have to do an experiment. accuracy will suffer I bet.

Does that cause the bullet to tumble on impact, thereby becoming more lethal?

 

[Panzerschwein]

Well, the Buffalo Bore ammo came in today, and I shot 20 rounds of it.

WOW! Worked well! Plenty o' thump methinks. Seemed quite smokey, with some flash and noticeable but easily controllable recoil. Cases just fell from the cylinder, no excess pressure signs at all. Gun was not knocked out of time or anything crazy like that. The gun shot well at the range.

BUT... my gun's cylinder release seemed to want to stick sometimes, requiring a hard push forward on it in order to release the cylinder. So, after shooting, I decided to clean the gun, and also decided to take apart the cylinder release...

BAD IDEA!!!

I won't go into detail, buy suffice it to say that I seemed to have hopelessly lost a couple of the small parts in the cylinder release... that is after spending over and hour and a half trying to get the thing back together!!

I'm calling Charter Arms tomorrow to see how much it will cost to get the cylinder release rebuilt and the lost parts replaced. I feel like an ASS right now... when they say not to take the cylinder release apart on a Charter Arms, DON'T DO IT. Here I thought it wouldn't be that hard to put back together, boy was I wrong! What an ordeal!

Stupid mistake... but I'll gladly pay for it... because I LOVE THIS GUN!!! Without a doubt, I'm going to have to take up reloading .44 special. This gun is just too fun. Will keep you guys updated on this guns second trip to back to the mothership. They took good care of it the first time it went back, I have high hopes for this second trip.

Take care all!

 

[JERRY]

for hard to release cylinders on a charter arms, the culprit is rarely the release itself. the adjusting screw on the face plate of the back of the frame usually needs slight adjusting outwards. no disassembly required. as far as smoothness of the release, you have to remember, you bought a Charter Arms.

 

[gun_with_a_view]

you have to remember, you bought a Charter Arms.

At the same time, remember most of us are not Clint Eastwood trying to get his day made.

 

[Drail]

Removing and reinstalling a Charter cylinder release requires at least three hands and as noted there are small parts that must not be lost and MUST be reassembled correctly. Think very hard about doing this before you start. Charters are really cool little revolvers but they will NOT stand up to heavy loads for long. Trust me on this. If your cylinder release takes a lot of force to open the cylinder then the small "screw" in the breechface has become turned into the frame and will not push the cylinder pin in far enough to release the cylinder. Carefully adjust it with a small screwdriver until it is flush with the breechface when the release is pressed and it works properly. Frequently check EVERY screw on a Charter and watch them closely because they WILL loosen from vibration and back out. Loc-tite is your friend. Keep checking them anyway even after you Loc-tite them. The vibration acts just like an impact wrench. Operating a Charter is a lot like operating a Harley Davidson. Get complacent about checking fasteners and parts will start falling off. I still carry a Charter Bulldog bought in 1987 and it has held up very well but it has never been subjected to heavy loads and gets carefully inspected frequently. If all of this is more trouble than you want to deal with - buy something else. In my opinion there is absolutely no reason to use heavy loads in .44 Spl. (in a Charter or any other revolver). A standard load will work just fine if you place it correctly and won't beat the gun to death or cause you to learn how to fight a flinch. Far too many people today seem to be obsessed with buying and shooting +P loads in a snub revolver. They are completely unnecessary.

 

[Zendude]

Is the recoil on the Bulldog 44 similar to a 357? I found a target model at my lgs but i have not shot a 44 special. I have shot a 44 mag S&W with a lightweight scandium frame and my hand hurt for a week afterwards.

 

[Frank V]

Awwww com'on Cooldill I'll bet NO ONE ELSE here has ever lost a part??
I remember taking a Win. mod. 12 20 ga to my LGS in a cigar box because I took it apart too far!!!!!! Don't beat yourself up most of us (if we'll admit it) have lost a part??
I'm pretty certain CA will make it right again!
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If anyone wants a cream puff load for their CA Bulldog let me know I've got one using Trailboss & a 240 JHP that is a sweetheart to shoot & you could probably subsitute a good cast bullet as well for cheaper shooting. I am able to hit or bounce a golf ball size rock regularly @ 20yds with this load. I don't know what it chronographs & pretty well don't care, it's accurate, easy on gun & shooter, & with Trail Boss you aren't going to double charge it with a light load!!!
The Bull Dog LOVES this load.
Let me know.

 

[Panzerschwein]

LOL! Thanks for helping me feel better, Frank. I too, have taken a Model 12 shotgun apart. Not the most intuitive piece of machinery around!

I called Charter Arms today, and they told me it will be no problem to fix and I probably won't even be charged for the couple of small parts that I lost trying to get the thing back together. I'm boxing the gun up and plan to get it to the FedEx office this evening.

 

[Panzerschwein]

Is the recoil on the Bulldog 44 similar to a 357? I found a target model at my lgs but i have not shot a 44 special. I have shot a 44 mag S&W with a lightweight scandium frame and my hand hurt for a week afterwards.

Well, the Buffalo Bore loads I shot yesterday through my Bulldog (2.5" bbl +- 20 oz in weight) had plenty o' thump, but I was pleasantly surprised. They weren't too bad, not at all painful. I do have a nice set of Pachmayr rubber grips on the gun though.

I think with standard ball or lead rounds, a .44 Target Bulldog wouldn't be at all uncomfortable to shoot. These guns pack some power in a small package, and with that comes some recoil... but I think in the larger and heavier Target Bulldog, it won't be too much of an issue.

 

[Zeke/PA]

Just recently, I picked up a S&W Model 29 4 inch for the sole purpose of shooting .44 Specials.
I loaded up some .215 grain cast , and some jacketed hollow points and the pistol ain't bad to shoot at all.
I like the .44 Special and I've also shot it in my Super Blackhawk with success.
I think the Charter Arms Bulldog would be an excellent daily carry piece.

 

[gun_with_a_view]

I think the Charter Arms Bulldog would be an excellent daily carry piece.

I am more interested in dependability than I am longevity when it comes to guns. A gun is merely a simple machine with which to launch projectiles. As such, guns are subject to IRS depreciation allowance when used in a business. They have an engineered life which varies widely among gun owners. Whether you have a business or not, use them up and trade them in on new stock to maintain full readiness. And don't look back. It could be your life at stake.

 

[Frank V]

Cooldill

I'm staying tuned to hear how CA handles your gun. I'm hearing good things about their customer service.

I'm another who thinks they are a nice carry gun but don't shoot heavy loads in them often. I do have one load that's almost a starting load in the manuals with a 210gr cast RNFP that clocks over 800 in the CA. It's a bit snappy, bug would make a great trail load.

 

[Panzerschwein]

UPDATE:

Got the gun shipped off yesterday, should arrive back at the factory in a few days.

In the meantime, I bought 5 boxes (100 rounds) of Corbon 200 grain DPX ammo after seeing several recommendations for it. It's an all copper hollow point, full power but no warnings about using it in a Bulldog. Seems to have excellent properties and should expand well and penetrate, in all my research it looks like the best load for me:

http://www.hipowersandhandguns.com/Corbon 44 Special DPX Report.htm

I will only shot enough through my Bulldog to verify function and point of aim. Will use the rest for carry ammo.

I'll keep everyone posted on my Bulldog's second trip to Charter Arms. This time, it was 100% my fault but if they fix it up as well as they did the first time, I wouldn't be surprised! It's been a pleasure dealing with this company so far.

 

[JERRY]

Cooldill, be sure to line up several water jugs back to back and let us know how that round does from the 2.5" bbl. pix are always welcomed.

 

[RealGun]

Well, since you are shooting a .44 cal. bullet I would not worry for a second about expansion. I have been loading shooting and carrying the .44 Spl for many years, most of those in a Bulldog Pug, and I don't lose any sleep over whether it expands or not. If you put it where it needs to go it doesn't need to expand. If you don't - it won't matter. The reason the Blazer Al cases are sticking is mostly due to the rough chamber finish. They can be polished so that all cases will extract easily. Blazer is also available with a brass case.

The hollow point cartridge is not performing unless there is good expansion. Bullet weights are adjusted to get the necessary velocity to expand the bullet and maximize the wounding effect. The idea is to do more than punch big entry holes. A small 44 Special is pretty presumptuous and should be quite fierce to shoot.

 

[MICHAEL T]

I like my old CA Bull dog Can pull on ejector rod and swing open cyl. As I remember years back Cooper complained about the cyl release bothering his thumb. Removed it and suggested the ejector rod as the answer.

A 44 spl is a lot different that the 38 you use for comparisons. Weight is biggest difference . So what if the 130 gr opens to 50 cal I rather hit them with a 200gr or more all 44 cal. expanding or not.

That FBI 12" is nonsense . Boarder Patrol doesn't agree with .They say 10" and they have a lot more gun fights a year.Than those Suit and Tie desk Jocks.

I am afraid your going to find that even the DPX (my number 1 choice in a SD bullet) May not expand properly from that short barrel. CA should have stayed with a 3" Just as easy to carry and might be just enough to make a HP work.

 

[Panzerschwein]

I like my old CA Bull dog Can pull on ejector rod and swing open cyl. As I remember years back Cooper complained about the cyl release bothering his thumb. Removed it and suggested the ejector rod as the answer.

A 44 spl is a lot different that the 38 you use for comparisons. Weight is biggest difference . So what if the 130 gr opens to 50 cal I rather hit them with a 200gr or more all 44 cal. expanding or not.

That FBI 12" is nonsense . Boarder Patrol doesn't agree with .They say 10" and they have a lot more gun fights a year.Than those Suit and Tie desk Jocks.

I am afraid your going to find that even the DPX (my number 1 choice in a SD bullet) May not expand properly from that short barrel. CA should have stayed with a 3" Just as easy to carry and might be just enough to make a HP work.

Um, no.

Did you read the High Powers and Handguns article I posted? It did excellent from a 3" tube... I HIGHLY doubt it would do much worse from a 2.5" tube. It's a fast moving bullet, full power .44 special.

Not some people's cup of tea from a Bulldoggle, but I believe it'll do super well.

 

[Frank V]

Cooldill

Thanks for the update & the link to the Corbon test.
That does look pretty impressive. I'm going to keep my eye out for some.
Thanks.

 

[Panzerschwein]

Cooldill

Thanks for the update & the link to the Corbon test.
That does look pretty impressive. I'm going to keep my eye out for some.
Thanks.

No problem! I got mine off gun broker, only place I could find any.

Looks like the same seller I bought mine from has more for sale.

 

[Panzerschwein]

I like my old CA Bull dog Can pull on ejector rod and swing open cyl. As I remember years back Cooper complained about the cyl release bothering his thumb. Removed it and suggested the ejector rod as the answer.

A 44 spl is a lot different that the 38 you use for comparisons. Weight is biggest difference . So what if the 130 gr opens to 50 cal I rather hit them with a 200gr or more all 44 cal. expanding or not.

That FBI 12" is nonsense . Boarder Patrol doesn't agree with .They say 10" and they have a lot more gun fights a year.Than those Suit and Tie desk Jocks.

I am afraid your going to find that even the DPX (my number 1 choice in a SD bullet) May not expand properly from that short barrel. CA should have stayed with a 3" Just as easy to carry and might be just enough to make a HP work.

Michael T, I found this thread where the Corbon .44 special 200 grain DPX load was fired from a Taurus .44 special with 2" bbl in calibrated gelatin w/ 4 layers denim (FBI test):

http://www.stoppingpower.net/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=11370&SearchTerms=44,special,dpx

Penetration was almost 13" and expansion was over .70 caliber. Should be a little more effective than a through-and-through ball or wadcutter round, while minimizing risk to bystanders (however small that might be). Compared to the S&W 642 I carry now, using Speer Gold Dot Short Barrel .38 special +P 135 grain rounds (top load for caliber), I calculated this .44 special load would produce a wound track volume approximately 60% larger than said .38 special load. It should also do this with less muzzle blast/flash and even less noise than the various .357 magnum snubs firing hot loads.

I haven't been able to find this type of performance from any other .44 special load when fired from a short barreled revolver. Quite impressed, and glad I snagged the rounds of Gunbroker. Like I said, I got five 20 round boxes for a total of 100 rounds. I know the Bulldogs aren't meant for extensive shooting with full power loads like this, so I'll be shooting one box to varify POA and to judge recoil etc. etc. and will use the rest for carry and very occasional practice ammo.

Will keep everyone posted, someday soon when I get my Bulldog back from Charter Arms I'll have to do a detailed range review. Stay tuned!

 

[Frank V]

Thanks Cooldill.
keep us informed as to the progress with CA & your Bulldog.
They actually are pretty nice little guns!