Friend wants to buy a gun - possible problems?

[Cyanide_357]

I have a friend that wants to buy a gun... he just turned 21, so he wants to buy a pistol - he is not prohibited from buying a gun ... ie, no problems w/ the 12x questions on the atf form.

This is the possible problem... he currently works and lives in Kentucky, but his drivers license and insurance are from Ohio (insurance is ohio w/ ky address). His drivers address does not have is current address - but is new (re-issued in june/july when he turned 21).

I believe this will cause problems as to identifying his state of residence - and prevent him from purchasing a firearm.

The question is, what state (if any) should he purchase from? I assume Ohio, since thats what his ID is from. And will there be any problem w/ buying in ohio, claiming ohio residence, and putting down an address in ky? I've expressed my concerns to my friend, and have told him that I believe he will have problems. He unfortunately is willing to just put down his address as the same on his drivers license, which isn't current - and I have expressed my concern about putting non-current/false information on the atf form.

Any suggestions &/or insight to the situation.

Cyanide

 

[Old Fuff]

Some additional information would be useful, such as:

How long has he lived at his current address? Is he renting or what? Is it his intention to be where he is for the foreseeable future, or only for a short time? Is he a student, out of work but looking, or employed. If employed, for how long?

There are alternatives to a Drivers Licence, although the dealer is supposed to see a photo I.D. with a Kentucky address. The ideal thing would be for him to apply for a Kentucky drivers licence or I.D. card

What you are really looking for is some kind of official photo I.D. with his Kentucky address.

 

[thorn726]

works and lives in Kentucky, but his drivers license and insurance are from Ohio (insurance is ohio w/ ky address).

why not get legal and switch over the license and insurance.

i hate people doing that all the time. you're in my state, pay for my roads, sorry.
trying to avoid costs is a lame excuse, and could invalidate the insurance should he ever actually need it.

i dont think the police look too kindly on folks who dont want to disclose their real addr either

 

[Henry Bowman]

Yep. Get a new DL. Doesn't cost that much.

 

[kbr80]

i dont think the police look too kindly on folks who dont want to disclose their real addr either

Well, we cant have that, can we.


Get a new dl, or go to ohio and purchase.

 

[BryanP]

In most states you are legally required to get your license changed to your new residence within a certain (relatively short) period of time anyway. Currently I don't think he can legally fill out a 4473 in either state.

Have him get his license updated to reflect his new residence. Problem solved.

 

[Cyanide_357]

Info:

Has lived in ky for over 90 days - i'm fairly sure of this
Same w/ where he works
Just lives & works in ky - not going for higher education.

I told him to just buy a ky ID card at the minimum - license for realistic purposes - but he doesn't want to listen to me : ask me for advice/help - but don't accept the advice as given :

The 4473 form says state of residence is the state you have resided in for the past 90 days. And there are the simular situation with ky laws i'm sure. So technically, by claiming to be an ohio resident, he would technically be putting false information down. Not to mention if the used the address on his ohio license.

Unfortunately, I don't really believe he will listen to me... so what I'm really hoping to get is a go or no-go on the legality of the situation. Which I believe is a no-go.

Like I said, i've told him to go to the dmv and either get his license done in ky (I think he doesn't want to pay out the $25 or so - his words) or at the minimum, buy a ky ID card.

Cyanide

 

[Phoenix_III]

No-Go for all of the reasons mentioned above. If he LIES and puts down FALSE INFORMATION on the form, he does so at his own peril. Will he be caught? Most likely not. If he uses the firearm in self defense, ever has it stolen, etc, if the history of the arm/forms comes up, it could 'in theory' be a problem.

No-Go. Get a State Issued ID without surrending your DL is possible, but pay for the roads where you drive. =)

 

[Aguila Blanca]

A gentleman I used to work with was fond of saying "I prefer to tell the truth. That way I never have to remember what I told the other guy."

In that light, here's a novel suggestion ... why not claim as his state of residence the state in which he resides? If his paperwork isn't squared away on that, here's a perfect reason to get it squared away.

 

[pete f]

i have no trouble with what you want to do, but do not buy into his trouble. even tho in many places ( not sure of your laws) a private sale is just that private.

if you decide to sell to him get a xerox of his DL and all other approptiate data and i would get a plate number on his vehicle too.

I honestly think that doing this would make you safe from legal repercussions. but a man who does not want to get a new license makes me wonder why?

Now i have sold one deer rifle to a kid from Illinois who was going to college here and was on a Ill scholarship. but according to my state his college id was suitable id for me to accept him as a resident. I KNOW he was not a FOID holder from ill. but that really did not matter to me. I acted as he was a state of mn resident from his college id . ( I knew the kid for two years before i sold it to him) so this was not a stranger to stranger sale .

 

[1911austin]

I believe (read NOT sure) in Texas you can buy a gun with out of state identification if you provide proof that you live in Texas. I think it is mainly done by military personnel and college students. Examples of proof would be utility bills or a lease agreement under his name. I would just tell him to explain his situation to the gun store. They should know what is legal in your state

 

[LAR-15]

Private Sale.

 

[hksw]

I had a similar, but not identical, situation I had resolved yesterday. I had moved from SE OH to NE OH earlier in the year and didn't renew my DL until yesterday. Having filled out a few 4473s in the past, I knew the address on the DL as compared to what is written on the form could be a problem if they do not coincide. So I bit the bullet and got a new one yesterday to get a gun today (Taurus PT111 Millennium Pro, SS upper).

Reading the signs at the BMV while waiting to get my new DL, it was noted on one that new residents should update their DLs within 10 days. I officially moved in 01/05. I was waiting to get berated by the guy at the counter but all he said was (paraphrase), 'Why don't you just wait until your expiration date on you birthday in 2006? It would be cheaper.' Apparently when you renew your DL in OH, you don't reset your expiration date, you keep the old one. So next birthday in 2006, I gotta pay for another DL. Oh well, the things I do for guns.

As noted by others, not being accurate (truthful) on your 4473 is SERIOUS.

 

[dolanp]

I was under the impression that they weren't supposed to sell to you if the ID's address did not match your state and current address.

 

[Cyanide_357]

Thanks for all of the replies.

I pretty much new the answer to my questions prior to posting them.

I want to clairify one thing though... this is NOT a private sale, and I will not aid in his purchase in any way.

Truthfully, I do not understand why he will not purchase a new KY drivers license or at least a ky ID card. (instead of buying ky tags, license, & insurance - he went to ohio to renew his tags & dl). I believe it has something to do w/ $ - which he doesn't have much of.

Would it be possible for him to purchase in Ky, using his ohio DL for ID, if he showed proof of residence in ky? Such as a utility bill or something?

Truthfully, in his hardheaded ways, I believe he would just buy one in ohio, claim to have ohio residence, and put down the address on his drivers license. :banghead: Which I have explained to him is a very bad idea, and one I do not approve. As normal, there are just some people you can't reason with.

Cyanide

 

[Aguila Blanca]

Bail out.

Just tell him to do whatever he wants, and that you would prefer not to know.

 

[Greg L]

Frankly I don't know why anyone (on either side of the aisles) would want to claim the spineless duo RINO's as their Senators......

He needs to go through the paperwork or you need to step FAR away.

 

[moby clarke]

Cyanide_357

Tell you "friend" to grow up and be an adult. If he claims to be law abiding, then he has to follow all the laws, not just the ones that are to his liking. Plus, if he is not able to do the right thing, what makes him sure he is mature enough to own and use a gun correctly?

 

[hksw]

http://www.ca7.uscourts.gov/tmp/LS0OAXI5.pdf

It will be interesting to see if your friend decides to commit a felony on his very first purchase of a handgun.

 

[jnojr]

I thought it was legal for people to buy guns in contiguous states?

 

[gezzer]

Pistol may only be bought in your state of residence.

I am a dealer, he would not buy a pistol from me "His ID" does not match his residence state. I am not creating a felony selling to him PERIOD.

Tell him to get his act together.

 

[hksw]

Trying to fix link.

 

[Wayne D]

Tell him to grow up and quit lying to save a few bucks. If he's that cheap he probably won't spend the money to buy a gun anyway.

 

[hotpig]

{Now i have sold one deer rifle to a kid from Illinois who was going to college here and was on a Ill scholarship. but according to my state his college id was suitable id for me to accept him as a resident. I KNOW he was not a FOID holder from ill. but that really did not matter to me. I acted as he was a state of mn resident from his college id . ( I knew the kid for two years before i sold it to him) so this was not a stranger to stranger }


Talk about a no win situation. If you sold to him as a Il resident with no FOID you did wrong. If you sold to him as a out of State resident you did wrong. Hopefully nothing will ever happen to him or the gun.

 

[Otherguy Overby]

Addresses.

I've three valid addresses and two are valid residences.

Technically, according to the BATF, I can purchase a handgun in either state of residence.

HOWEVER, actually finding an FFL who would go along with this for a handgun purchase might be problematic. As has been mentioned they really do prefer valid in state ID.

Long guns are not so much an issue.

There's no crime, unless you put false info on the 4473.