How to legally stay alive,UK

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rusty bubbles

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This looks like the right thread to ask- I live in England, and as you prolly know- ALL weapons , including nail clippers , are absotively banned -you can go to jail for carrying a pocket knife-seriously!

This also means that you cannot defend yourself against low lifes, burglars,
rapists, or muggers etc.

Pepper spray? I hear you say;Nope,forbidden by law-
The Government has really done a number on us.

But that's not the worst bit- half the population think this situation is a good thing, and applaud the Gov. "Guns are dangerous", they bleat

But every day, tv reports shootings and stabbings.

The unpalatable truth that the anti gun sheep ignore is that you are required to just roll over and die , since self defence is illegal.

So you see my dilemma-I cannot legally defend myself or my family-because I will go to prison if I injure in any way a BG- Farmer Tony Martin spent 5 years in the slammer for shooting an intruder.

I 've racked my brains to think of a way to protect me and mine, yet stay out of jail.
What would you guys do -(Don't say "Emigrate!"- I'm too old now,for that!)
 
Stout walking stick, or get a lanyard and hook your keys to one end and melt the other end in a ball. When you carry your keys leave the "ball" hanging out of your pocket. If needed you can grab the ball, pull the lanyard out and strike someone with a keyring full of keys. The ball keeps the lanyard from slipping out of your hand. My wife is from Scotland and we travel to the UK several times a year.
 
My husband is from England (London) and has been here almost 5 years now. He does carry and is loves it. We are constantly amazed by the narrowminded views over there. I don't think there is anything to do. They tell you what to do or not to do and that is your only choice. I used to be against anyone and everyone owning guns but then I realized if I cross paths with the "bad guy" one day I want to be able to protect myself.

Good Luck!
 
RB,

We've had long discussions about this with Fosbery and Boomstick, your fellow countrymen. Take a look at - http://thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=183743&highlight=britian&page=3 for ideas.

Remember that we've been killing and maiming each other for thousands of years before firearms came along. That means what's at hand has been used to lay our brothers low for longer than Mr. Colt tried to put them on a level killing field.
 
There are no laws against owning dogs in the UK.

Get yourself a good stout Shillelagh walking stick made out of blackthorne, or if that's a bit too "Irish" for you, how about a solid umbrella?
 
Get yourself a good stout Shillelagh walking stick made out of blackthorne

Wouldn't a bobby then accuse you of carrying a "bludgeon" or whatnot?

If memory serves, some UK members had mentioned that the cops take a very dim view of folks trying to get clever and carry canes and the like to use as possible weapons.
 
Wouldn't a bobby then accuse you of carrying a "bludgeon" or whatnot?
If memory serves, some UK members had mentioned that the cops take a very dim view of folks trying to get clever and carry canes and the like to use as possible weapons.

Well, if he does carry it and whacks a few chavs one day, I highly recommend that he sits down on the curb immediately thereafter and massages his aching knees (with a suitable witness looking on) ;)
 
I wouldn't worry too much about shooters, that appears to be mostly drug related black on black. Strangely this phenomenon only developed after legal handgun ownership was banned.

Out in public, your options would be limited to non-dedicated devices, basically a mini maglite and a cane. If you're a young guy, it would be sensible to effect a limp when cops are around.

Inside your home, your probably better to just call the cops unless someone is in imminent danger, in that case, use something like a fire poker that could be expected to be around the home. Generally a burglar won't attack unless cornered.
 
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Blade_Zero you obviously haven't been to London, England. I haven't either but my husband (who yes is from there) says London is one of the worst areas. I don't agree with your comment about catoragizing who does the shooting or your last comment either. I don't think they love being told what to do or else why would he be here asking for options.

Rusty Bubbles I hope you get more help than this.
 
"You English are a funny lot, you just love rules and being told what to do. It looks like you have a law prohibiting almost everything."

You're right about being told what to do-bit it wasn't always so repressive-
When I was a boy, England was a free country-not the Orwellian nightmare it is now. it's "Bandit Country"-(You name it, they've banned it)
 
I knew a bloke over there who carried a round faucet handle like you find on an outdoor spigot (for some reason I can't think of the proper name). It was large enough to slip a few fingers through and was like a set of brass knucks.
 
Wow! I'm sure whether the English try to do that or not it's far from an immediate method. He wants something now not ten years down the road.
 
For our new members -

Here in non-firearms we deal with a lot of questions related to when carrying a gun isn't practical or permitted and what our options are for self defense. Poking members about the restrictions they live under (remember many in the U.S. live in cities with nearly the same restrictions as the U.K.) doesn't contribute to the conversation and should be kept out of the conversation.

He lives in the UK. He doesn't like that his country has disarmed the honest and would treat someone who defended themselves like criminals. He's not moving nor is he looking to roll over and pee on his belly. Got it? So, knock it off or suffer the consequences.:fire:
 
No way to change the law, Gunbabe- much as I would like to- Britain is a divided, even broken society,-and you know what they say about "A house divided"

Love to see "NRA Life member"
 
The problem is not only gang or drug related. Here are some incidents that I remember:

1) A guy and his girl-friend were on the bus, going home. A goblin sitting a few rows behind them, made lewd suggestions to the girl and also threw hot chips at her. The boyfriend told him to cut it out and the goblin stabbed the boyfriend, who died shortly thereafter.

2) A homeowner saw a group of teens vandalizing his car outside his house. He stepped outside and told them to cut it out. They knocked him down and beat him up. He died from head injuries.

3) A guy was driving in his car with his girlfriend or sister (I can't remember). They stopped at a light and two goblins walked by on the curb. One of them threw a half-eaten chocolate bar into the car, like it was a trashcan. The driver got out and shouted at the man, who then killed him (either stabbed him or shot him, can't recall).

There have been many cases where a home-owner has come out of his house to stop vandals from damaging his property, and he has been killed. Most are stabbed or kicked to death but there have been shootings too.

The biggest threat to the ordinary man in the street, especially in London and other big cities, is gangs of teenaged puke-bags running around causing mischief. They are really bold and carry sticks and rods in broad daylight. If the cops are called the kids ditch the sticks and nothing can be done. I have seen it right here in my street.
A guy was killed on my street corner by a gang of teenagers. They are dangerous.
 
Thanks all you guys for your kind help- and thanks HO and Babe for going to bat for me- but no offence taken from anyone.

rusty B.
 
Just so I'm not misunderstood, I'm not the one that told you to change it. I've heard enough from my husband how things are there. I think you are just looking for an alternative which shows you are concerned for you and your family trying to find alternatives to as you said "defend myself or my family" which makes you a great family man in my book. I still hope you get at least one legit idea out of all this.
 
ODD JOB, Hey, at least all of the 1) ,2) and 3) died without breaking the law.
My thoughts: which is more desirable? Being in total compliance with some laws or surviving a violent encounter?
I suggest Rusty Bubbles, or anyone else for that matter, do some soul searching and decide where the line will be drawn. I did- a long time ago. There are some situations where staying within the letter of the law is not as important as the outcome of our actions or reactions.
Your first and greatest weapon should be a strong will to survive. Without that, everything else is meaningless. With that, everything around you is a potential weapon.

edited for additional thoughts:
How to legally stay alive,UK?
It might not be possible. You might have to decide between LEGAL or ALIVE.
 
rusty B.,

For us Americans, what's a "semi" and do you have a garden or yard that you maintain? Do you have a car or motorbike and do you do any maintenance on it?
 
Welcome to THR Rusty Bubbles,

Remember that self-defence in the UK IS legal. If you are being or reasonably expect to be attacked, you can defend yourself with reasonable force. If you fear for life or limb, you can kill your attacker whether you stab him or hit him or shoot him. People like Tony Martin only go to jail because they shoot burglars who are running away and refuse to apologise (he could have avoided jail if he wanted to and was not being attacked when he fired).

When looking at self-defence in the UK there are two distinct areas: your home and outside in public places.

At home, I would reccomend you get yourself a shotgun certificate and buy a three-shot (legal mag restriction) semi-auto 12 bore shotgun. A pump action or a double barrel one is fine too, but I'd reccomend a semi-auto myself (many others will disagree, however, it's up to you).

You will need to keep it locked up though. If you only buy the one gun, you can use a wall clamp or a chamber lock with a steel cable attached to the wall. You can also use (and will have to if you get more than one gun) a gun cabinet. Have a look at the different options in a shop and decide which one will allow you quickest access to the gun. As far as I know there's no rule against keeping it loaded, but chamber locks will prevent that. If you want, you can keep it loaded and unlocked, and this is not breaking the law, but you can have you certificate revoked. Some unscrupulous people have even been known to keep their guns unlocked and lying with some cleaning equipment so that, should police come around unexpectedly, they can say they were cleaning it.

Assuming you do keep it locked, I would suggest some kind of other weapon that will be at hand if you don't have time to reach your gun - sword, machete, bludgeon, spear, perhaps even a crossbow (I'm no expert).

Outside your own home, however, you will be unable to carry your shotgun (even if you wanted to). Here's some things off my top of the head which you might carry everyday that can be used as weapons:

Umbrella, cane or walking stick (bludgeon and some umbrellas can be stabbed with)
Sturdy pen or torch (both as striking and piercing weapons but a bright, tactical torch can also temporarily blind and disorientate)
Carabiner (knuckle duster)
Bike lock (flail)
Briefcase (strike with corners)
Rolled up magazine (strike with an end)
Book (hardback, or softback if you put it under tension)
Keys (especially a bunch on a line used as a flail, or a car key with a plastic handle used to stab with)
Roll of coins (strike with)
Wallet full of coins (make sure the coins won't fall out and that they are only in one half of the wallet, it can then be used like a sap)
Cigar tube (strike with)

Almost anything can make a useful weapon. Use your imagination. Remember though that it is an offence to carry ANYTHING specifically for use as a weapon. You must never carry anything for that purpose, but you can think about how you might use things that you carry anyway. Of course, if you decided to start carrying a Surefire torch and a Parker pen, and if you decided to carry an umbrella with a metal point on the slightest chance of it raining that day, they could hardly prove you did so because you wanted those items as a weapon - as long as you don't attack people, obviously.

Remember though that self-defence goes along way beyond neutralising your attacker, it also involves making sure that you never get attacked. Avoid rough areas, keep your eyes and ears open for trouble, take the car or a taxi if you can (even a bike will let you escape from trouble), make sure you puff up and look dangerous if you notice a possible threat, and so on and so forth.

Also consider self-defence classes and work out more (or start doing so).

Hope that helps some, stay safe.

There are no laws against owning dogs in the UK.

Actually there are. You cannot own:

Pit Bull Terriers
Tosa
Dogo Argentino
Fila Brasileiro

For us Americans, what's a "semi"

Semi-detached house. Many (if not most) houses in the UK are actually two houses that share a common wall. See here:

4294702_6.jpg


It would suggest a suburban area.
 
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Another handy "improvised" item you can use is one of those large climbing carabiners as a keychain fob; they keep your keys together, and can be used as "brass knuckles" (well, "aluminium knuckles") if the need arises.
 
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