I took my pistol for a drive in Texas today

[GunAdmirer]

Today, September 1, 2005, marks the official enaction of Texas HB 823 that allows law abiding citizens to carry a loaded handgun concealed in their vehicle without fear of prosecution. Previously, Texas citizens were under a very poorly defined and subjective "traveling" law.

So, this morning, I took my XD-9 for a little drive just because I could. I never carried one loaded in my car because I was afraid I wouldn't fit the subjective traveling criteria.

I hope to never use it, but am glad to have the right to carry it in my vehicle if I feel I need to for defensive purposes.

My thanks to the Texas legislators who pushed for a clear definition of the traveling law.

 

[Aguila Blanca]

My thanks to the Texas legislators who pushed for a clear definition of the traveling law.

It's probably a meaningless distinction, but my understanding was that they did not clarify the definition of "traveling" at all. They recognized that they weren't able to define it, so they just said if you are in your vehicle you are "presumed to be" traveling.

That's not a "clear definition." It does solve the problem, but rather than defining the term it's a legalistic way of saying "We don't know what we wrote, either, so please ignore it."

 

[MaterDei]

This is a big improvement over the prior confusion, that's for sure.

GunAdmirer, now all you need to do is get your CHL so that when you leave your vehicle you can take your XD-9 for a walk!

 

[GunAdmirer]

You're probably right Hawkmoon.

Here's a link to an explanation of the law by a State Representative:

http://www.tsra.com/HB823_Keel.htm

 

[Standing Wolf]

No law-abiding American citizen should ever need government permission to keep and bear arms.

 

[dolanp]

In theory the LEO will need some kind of indication that you are breaking one of the five requirements to be presumed traveling before arresting you, i.e. innocent until proven otherwise. However the attitude of some people, namely the Houston DA, have clouded this bill a bit.

 

[Gunpacker]

Well, if you are in a car moving, how can you not be travelling? If you are caught behind the wheel of a stopped car, not running, with the keys in the ignition, and drunk, you can bet that you will get a DUI.

 

[boofus]

This is what a LEO friend of mine had to say about the new law. It doesn't mean you can just pack a handgun in a car without a CHL.

I initially heard about this via email and it was presented as though the car was now considered an extension of your residence. WRONG! I consulted the Capt. at my department who is in charge of educating every officer over each year's penal code changes, and he was intimately familiar with this one because of all the misconceptions and the fact that there will in all likelyhood be ALOT of problems. Bottom line is that this merely means that you are presumed to be traveling unless facts and circumstances prove otherwise. In other words, if you are stopped two miles from your house with a load of groceries, well the traveling presumption just went out the window didn't it?

 

[MudPuppy]

I don't live at the grocery store--I travel to and from the grocery store.

traveling: To go from one place to another


I'll also make sure I have a basketball with me at all times.

 

[CentralTexas]

And you hope

if anything bad happens you will be in your car I guess. Get your carry license fer chrise sakes!
CT

 

[M2 Carbine]

"Standing Wolf
No law-abiding American citizen should ever need government permission to keep and bear arms."
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And I should be young, handsome and rich, but that just isn't the real world.

So I have to just settle for just one.

 

[M2 Carbine]

boofus
This is what a LEO friend of mine had to say about the new law. It doesn't mean you can just pack a handgun in a car without a CHL.
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Sometimes LEO's are the last to get the law straight. (I was a LEO)

The grocery thing makes no sense at all.
I've traveled 400+ miles and stopped and picked up grocerys just before completing the trip.

I think, just like when the carry license came in there was a lot of incorrect second guessing and some things had to be spelled out.

The intent of the law is very clear, to allow a law abiding person to carry a handgun in their car.
If that WAS NOT the intent there wouldn't be ANY REASON to change the law from the old Traveler law.

 

[Aguila Blanca]

Boofus, I suggest that you print out a copy of the link in GunAdmirer's post and give it to your LEO friend. You might also suggest that he give it to his department's legal beagle, because it certainly seems plain from what the LEGISLATOR wrote that the intent of the legislature is to NOT have citizens arrested for having a gun in the vehicle.

Even on the way to or from the grocery store.

The law spells out the conditions under which "presumed to be traveling" does not apply, and "driving home with groceries in the back seat" is not one of the exceptions.

It is clear that the legislature intended to eliminate any need for a definition of "traveling." Your LEO friend is still hung up on defining "traveling."

 

[GunAdmirer]

As written, the new law and the explanation by the State Representative linked above is pretty clear.

I haven't had the time or money at the same time to get my CHL renewed. I will.

I talked to my young police officer friend yesterday about the law. He did not know it even existed yet. It will take some time for people be aware of and understand the law. If you were to get pulled over for a minor traffic violation, the patrol officer may not be aware of the new law. You would probably not be prosecuted but, oh, the embarassment and hassle.

Nevertheless, I've got to go out of town this afternoon. I wonder if I should take the Glock or Beretta for a ride today? Just because I can.

 

[Rickstir]

Congrats, don't forget it's seat belt.

Odd thing about the Missouri law is that you have to be 23 to get a CCW permit, but you can have a handgun concealed in your car if you are 21 and can legally possess a handgun. No training, no permit.

Go figure politicians.

 

[Flyboy]

Standing Wolf:

No law-abiding American citizen should ever need government permission to keep and bear arms.

I agree with you in concept, but I'd go further: no freeman needs permission to keep and bear arms. That's not limited to Americans, citizens, or even the law-abiding. Free men don't ask permission to exercise their natural rights.

I would also point out that, even though we don't need permission, our government already gave us all blanket permission.

 

[Rockstar]

Hey Boofus, if that Captain could read and understand the law, he'd probably be doing something else for a living.

 

[ScottsGT]

Hold the phone here...
YOu mean that in Texas you could not have a loaded handgun in your car while going somewhere
Of all places in the US, I thought Texas would allow that! Here in SC, you can have one loaded, but it has to be in either the glove box or console.
Never could get that Raging Bull to fit in my small glovebox

 

[MudPuppy]

No, you've always been able to take a handgun with you if traveling. That was subjective and some prosecutors would nail people anyway.

New law just shores that up, further defines it. And some prosecutors will nail people anyway.

Need to send in the paperwork.

 

[setxcypress]

According to the sections I just read on the state's main site, you are traveling if you are in your car and have nothing else that prohibits you from owning a weapon.

Here is the text of the law copied from
http://www.capitol.state.tx.us/cgi-...&BILLTYPE=B&BILLSUFFIX=00823&VERSION=5&TYPE=B

BE IT ENACTED BY THE LEGISLATURE OF THE STATE OF TEXAS:
SECTION 1. Section 46.15, Penal Code, is amended by adding
Subsection (i) to read as follows:
(i) For purposes of Subsection (b)(3), a person is presumed
to be traveling if the person is:
(1) in a private motor vehicle;
(2) not otherwise engaged in criminal activity, other
than a Class C misdemeanor that is a violation of a law or ordinance
regulating traffic;
(3) not otherwise prohibited by law from possessing a
firearm;
(4) not a member of a criminal street gang, as defined
by Section 71.01; and
(5) not carrying a handgun in plain view.

My favorite part,

SECTION 4. This Act takes effect September 1, 2005.

The rest just deals with judicial proceedings and how this bill is not retroactive.

Eat your livers, Brady Campaign!

 

[rhubarb]

My thanks to the Texas legislators who pushed for a clear definition of the traveling law.

You should know just for your own bemusement that the law was co-sponsored by Democrat Senator Juan Hinojosa along with Republican Representative Terry Keel. I reckon that's the way they do things here in Texas. That's why our current president and former Texas governor is Demopublicratican.