im an anti w/ questions

[abdrdude]

James.Welcome to the High road. I thank you kind sir for coming to this forum with an open mind. It is my sincere hope that you have found the responses enlightning. I also hope that perhaps the members of this wonderful forum have persuaded you to become a firearms enthusiast.Please consider at least trying out this sport with the same open-mindedness that brought you here. It is in my humble opinion that if more people would look at guns with the same attitude that you have shown,our world would be a better place.
Fellow THR members... Excellent job with this thread. I plan to use many of your well versed arguements in future discussions in the never ending battle of our Right to Keep and Bear Arms.Thanks to all who spoke.Scott

 

[Mr. Goodglock]

Hi James,

For diversity record, I am a Thai/Male. Thailand may used to be the most gun friendly country, their use for self defense is really in need here according to the crime rate and the LE efficientcy. I also am a LE and I know the LE limit well. However, the present government is initiating a severe gun control law and many people feel the threat of being victim to the criminals as it is clear that gun control doesn’t put guns out of criminal hands. Even if all criminals doesn’t have gun they can murder the selected victims just as easily. We are setting up the first RKBA association here. We have a lot of shooting association but not the one to reclaim our rights. Just ask yourself simple question, what would you do under attack?

Wish you good tool not luck.

 

[Norwegian]

For what it is worth...shooting as a sport is one of the most demanding regarding consentration....as a matter of fact in that respect the handling of firearms over time might make you a calmer person then one who do not .

 

[Baba Louie]

Wow.

I am humbled by the written thoughts posted above.
Simple and concise.
What Rich started and Oleg continued...
Quality and quantity in a very short time span.

James, my take on the subject is simple. I was indoctrinated into the culture as a youngster.

My father taught me responsibility and self control, and the joy of life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness in a very simple manner.

Other's have mentioned history, I have to ask you; why was "The shot heard round the world" fired on April 19, 1775 at Concord bridge? Why did Paul Revere ride the night before? Besides all of the other reasons, what one pivotal event caused us to become "Americans"?

This culture is certainly not for every-man. Many "americans" abuse and mis-use the tool/device/weapon daily for their own reasons, others would have us throw all of our firearms into the bottom of the ocean or regulate us and our ability to defend our lives, enjoy our sports, hobbies, etc., out of existance.

The price of freedom (however you define that), eh?

And it's not just "Americans". There are wise men and women over the globe represented here; Germany, Austrailia, Russia, Malaysia... and more.

Many, who are put off by firearms due to whatever reason, find out later that the ownership and use thereof is... a hoot, a challenge, a joy, something to share with other's whose friendship they cherish.

You'd be hard pressed to find a better group of individuals
Ahhhh, but the politics and P.R. that go along with that responsibility and self control... there's the intrigue. Read the writings of Mr. March. Fascinating. He's a champion, in the truest sense of the word.

Ms Trisha, thank you for your words. A sincere thanks.

James, You're obviously free to do and think as you choose. By posting here, you have shown that you can "Choose wisely". Print out these posts and discuss them with your brother, friends, any anti-gunners you know and judge their responses. It might open your mind yet some more. Please continue to post and ask questions, think thoughts and... maybe play the devils advocate. It certainly spices up life.

Let me also extend an invitation to you... If you're ever in the Las Vegas area, lets go make some noise and punch some holes in paper. My treat.

Adios

 

[Norwegian]

" Wow.

I am humbled by the written thoughts posted above.
Simple and concise. "

You mean mine...please say yes I need a boost

Really I`m SO relaxed when I shot it is unbeliveable , used to give me peace of mind and I hope I`ll start again sometime , well quite sure I will

 

[Idaho]

Range invite

I would extend to James, or any other non-shooter (whether anti or undecided) on an all-expense paid range trip at any time. Generally non-shooters are hard to come by in southern Idaho, but the offer is there.

(No sandbagging by THR members trying to save money!)

 

[RAY WOODROW 3RD]

Great thread!

I can not add a thing to what has been said in the preceeding pages BUT I'll extend the same offer that Idaho and the others have to James and any other lurkers out there reading this post that have never shot before.

If your in New Jersey, I would be honored to take you out to punch holes in paper and enlighten you in "what is it all about" fashion. All it will cost you is your time.

I am a Certified Instructor so you will be in good hands. Send me an email and let the journey begin.

 

[CasualShooter]

Welcome, James.

It's pretty much all been said before -- both eloquently and concisely -- in earlier posts by other THR members; but, I'm impressed.

You started something with your post. I thank you for that and hope you will continue to respond.

In short, it's not just about guns. It's about Freedom - Individual Freedom - with responsibility.

 

[A. Partisan]

I have not read all of the posts. I'm sure I'll repeat some of the opinions and ideas already expressed. I strongly believe in "A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms,shall not be infringed."
I believe that some politicians would love to see that right taken away. Little by little that right is being taken away. Just my opinion. I have owned at least one gun or another for the past 32 years and never took it seriously. 9/11 changed all of that for me. I have bought a few more guns and shoot them several times a week now. I punch holes in paper to sharpen my skills. I hope it doesn't happen, but if the time comes I will be able to defend my family and myself. Besides I forgot that it's good therapy.

 

[Freedspeak]

From Florida I offer the same, if your in the area, a day at the range and a chance to meet the people who shoot.

 

[Big Mike]

James,

Welcome to THR!

For info on handguns and statistics, I would recommend you read this book: More Guns, Less Crime , by John Lott Jr.

I had the opportunity to listen to him talk in person at a book store in Las Vegas a couple years ago. He is an economist who looked at factual emperical data as it relates to crime and use of handguns.

My wife was a former anti until she heard him speak and read the book. Thankfully she is a logical woman and knowledeable of statistics and data, having been a grad student at the time. She was amazed at how he had been programmed to think all sorts of things about handguns that just aren't true.

Hope this helps and keep reading and posting. I have learned much since posting on The Firing Line and THR!

Be well! Mike

 

[bfason]

For info on handguns and statistics, I would recommend you read this book: More Guns, Less Crime , by John Lott Jr.

Lott's newest book is _The Bias Against Guns_ (2003, Regnery Publishing, Inc.). I actually found it more accessible than his earlier work. By Chapter 4 in _ More Guns_, the reader encounters tables of data of "National, county-level, cross-sectional, time-series evidence" with explanations such as this sentence. "The percentage reported in parentheses is the percent of a standard deviation change in the endogenous variable that can be explained by one-standard-deviation change in the exogenous variable. All regressions are weighted least squares, where the weigting is each county's population."

This book is not what I would recommend to an anti or an undecided unless he were an academician.

_The Bias Against Guns_ relies on statistics gathered by the Center for Disease Control and the Bureau of Justice Statistics to show that the media consistently lie about guns, but the numbers are presented in a straight-forward way that avoids terms such as "multivariate regression analysis."

 

[Art Eatman]

More recommended reading: "Under the Gun" by Wright, Rossi and Daly. Univ. of Fla. Press. Available at Amazon.com.

This 1985 book preceded most of the works usually referred to, today. These three statisticians analyzed Florida's gun control laws and crime rates. They interviewed prisoners in the Florida State Pen at Raiford...

Their primary conclusion was that there is no correlation between gun control laws and crime.

They admittedly began as gun-neutral to mildly anti-gun, insofar as personal opinions. While they didn't achieve epiphany , they essentially lost interest in guns as an issue in crime.

Art

 

[luxone]

Welcome James (I'm pretty new myself)

is everyone out there really so paranoid that the government is going to come along one day, become a corrupt dictatorship, and kill everyone who opposes it?

In short, I feel like the 2nd amendment is what keeps our government from being the type that you describe!

 

[jwmoore]

Wow, what an incredible thread... Y'all have just added one more member to the High Road. Thank you,

~Wesley

 

[LiquidTension]

I guess it's about time I contributed something to this thread.

While the reasons that I own guns are many, the order that I usually cite them in goes:

1) Because I can
2) Because I enjoy shooting
3) Self defense (defense of others falls under this)

Of course there are many more reasons, but most of them have already been stated by other members. One that I don't often talk about to non-gunnies is the feeling of absolute...bliss...I have when I leave the range. I'm never more relaxed and calm than when I finish a shooting session. Kinda odd considering the loud noises and sometimes bone-jarring recoil experienced during such sessions, but I'm sure I'm not the only one that just feels GOOD during and after shooting.

I have been in a situation where I needed a gun and did not have one, and it is not something that I intend to relive. I carry every day now. I'm not afraid to go about my day without my gun, but I find it kind of silly to have the ability to carry it but leave it at home instead (like my dad). Other members have brought up the seatbelt analogy, and it is the same thing. You don't put on your seatbelt when you're going to get in a wreck. If you don't use it all the time, it doesn't work. Until I fully develop my psychic powers I think I'll stick to my 1911. Having a gun does not make you invincible (unless you're Steven Segal or some other movie star), but it does give you a MUCH higher chance of surviving a potentially deadly situation than if you are unarmed.

Regarding carrying a gun, I, like many others on this board, have been asked if I was expecting trouble. My response was the same as most others': "If I expect trouble somewhere, I DON'T GO THERE. The gun is for the trouble I DON'T EXPECT."

James, I do have to warn you about something as far as guns go, especially if you plan to read this board with any frequency. Guns are like drugs - very addictive. Before I started reading this board (and The Firing Line and FAL Files before it), I only owned 1 gun (hunting rifle). After hanging out on said boards, my collection has grown to several pistols and longarms. One more word of warning - avoid the picture threads if you want to save money! I should listen to my own advice, but I'm an addict and I love every second of it

 

[Thundercleese]

Welcome to THR, James.

2 little gems :

"If the 2nd amendment is the first to go, the 1st will be the second".

"When guns are outlawed, only the government will have guns."


Edited for clarity

 

[buttrap]

Hmmmm....

 

[Moparmike]

I checked this thread again (for the billionth time) for "Hmmm..."? ***?

 

[RandyB]

Hello James,

Welcome to the High Road. Stick around for a while. We do not get many like you around here and the fact that you felt comfortable enough to post is great. A wee bit about my self. I'm 34, Married, one child, and work as a Licensed Mental Health Counselor and Emergency Medical Technician. I have had a Concealed weapons Permit since the age of 21. I hunt (and gather), fish, etc. and enjoy the outdoors. I am a volunteer for Search and Rescue, cave rescue, amatuer radio, emergency management , and skywarn (most likely forgot one or two) and am very civic minded. My work in the mental health field has convinced me of the right and need to protect myself and even more so my family. I situation I might be able to run from is not one that I could run with my wife and daughter. I grew up shooting muzzleloaders at the age of 7 and didn't shoot a gun of modern design until I was 10-12 years old. I still prefer to hunt with black powder weapons, but also enjoy shooting modern shotguns, handguns, rifles, including "military assault style" weapons. Is it something I do every day, not hardly. I don't have the time, in fact I own two custom made rifles that I have had for a year and have never shot. My point being in all this rambling is that if you asked me why I own a gun(s) and gave you one answer, I would be missing the point. Their are as many reasons why I own firearms as the reasons I have a car and why I have more than one kitchen knife in my silverware drawer. Good luck on your research and I hope that you will see that most folks who are firearms owners are not evil or psychotic and in fact honest, productive, law abiding citizens.

 

[RandyB]

Just had another brain fart and thought I'd share my 2 cents worth. The government cannot control our society and make us safe. Where would it end? Ok gun 1st. What about knives? I mean look as some of those Rambo machete types. Looks deadly? Hmm kind of like an M-16.... Of course 10 inches of steel rambo/kitchen/butcher knife doesn't matter if you are on the recieving end. What about baseball bats, golf clubs, gasoline, fertilizer, my 1/2 ton truck? All of these things can kill and especially the gas/car/and fertilizer can kill alot more people quicker than any assault weapon.



and ditto on the taking out for a shooting session here in southern Indiana.

 

[CasualShooter]

James,

Don't know if this has been said yet; but, arms (gun) control is not new. Centries ago before gun powder was invented the object of arms control was the banning of other weapons, i.e., swords, cross bows, etc.

The founding fathers were knowledgeable of history. They were aware of the disarming of the citizenry by other governments through the ages... and they very deliberately wrote their guarantee into the Bill of Rights to prevent such disarming of the people of the U.S.A.

 

[CasualShooter]

Another thought ...

I carried a badge and gun as a reserve police officer with full arrest powers in a major U.S. City for 13 years (no pay - just gratis - Community Service). Point is, I know from experience that the police can't be there when you need them most of the time.

And the fact is, the courts have repeatedly held that the government is not responsible for your personal protection - Only YOU are responsible for your OWN protection! Now, if the government denies you the means with which to provide that personal protection, whatcha gonna do when your life, or that of your loved one(s) is threatened? :banghead:

 

[Mr. Goodglock]

Just a bit more to my post. I forgot to type "IN ASIA" before..... Thailand may use to be the most gun friendly country. Now I am participating in the establishment of the first RKBA association in Thailand. We have several shooting association for certain kind of competition but apparantly they don't have RKBA mandate.

Regard.

 

[Griff]

Welcome, James

This has been some of the most engaging reading I've done in a long time. Why not share it with some friends?

Why, one could almost write a term paper with the information presented here...