Krag-Jorgensen Rifle?

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Corpral_Agarn

Corpral_Agarn

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Hello All,

I found a Krag-Jorgensen rifle in a gunshop the other day. Looked pretty clean. Full rifle length stock. They wanted $895 and I am feeling tempted. Really tempted.

As best I can tell it is one of these:
[Wikipedia]:
M1898 Rifle, generally much like M1896, but with a wide range of minor changes, including reconfiguring the bolt handle recess to simplify receiver manufacture, reversing the operation of the magazine cut-off lever, and (beginning in 1901) providing windage adjustment on the rear sight.

I am looking for general information on these fascinating rifles as well as any information on reloading 30-40 Krag. I think that the most interesting thing for me about these rifles is that loose rounds magazine. That is really unique.

Thanks and I appreciate the replies!
 
That might be a good price. One of the most overpriced gunshops in Houston has a rack full of them most for $1,300+, couple less than a grand. I would love to add one to the collection myself, however the prices seem to have risen lately.



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If you like old guns, I think they are pretty classy and interesting rifles. Id check the bolt carefully, I recall that one of the loading manuals mentioned (NRA?) that a some of the bolts they checked had cracks by the locking lug. They hadn't let go, but were slowly going towards having problems if cracks by the locking lug could be interpreted as such. Having one magnafluxed or other non-destructive testing may be worthwhile.

I recall it being described that parts could be checked by de-greasing, then dipped in gasoline, then wiped down, and waiting to see if gas seeped out of any cracks that were too small to easily notice. I may have the method incorrect, someone else may have a better way to describe it.
 
Malamute said:
If you like old guns, I think they are pretty classy and interesting rifles. Id check the bolt carefully, I recall that one of the loading manuals mentioned (NRA?) that a some of the bolts they checked had cracks by the locking lug. They hadn't let go, but were slowly going towards having problems if cracks by the locking lug could be interpreted as such. Having one magnafluxed or other non-destructive testing may be worthwhile.

I recall it being described that parts could be checked by de-greasing, then dipped in gasoline, then wiped down, and waiting to see if gas seeped out of any cracks that were too small to easily notice. I may have the method incorrect, someone else may have a better way to describe it.
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Good info on the cracks, Malamute.

That's something I will need to look into.

It looks like ammunition is going to be a struggle at this point. after a quick search, I cannot even find brass.
 
The DCM modified tons of these rifles and sold them to NRA Members. I always wanted a Krag saddle carbine. I bought an old DCM and modified it to look like the late issue carbine Models complete with the bar and saddle ring. It of course does not have the "C" serial number.
Just a tip. Use sized .303 British brass in place of the .30-40 brass for reloading.
 
May be some brass available on the leverguns forum, I know several guys shoot 30-40s there. One guy has been thinning some supplies down, he may have some brass hed turn loose of.

Didn't know that about 303 brass.
 
They are interesting rifles. Ammo isn't going to be widely available off the shelf but you will find it at a few gun shops. Ammo and brass are easily available online. Without pictures or a description of the bore its hard to estimate price. I bought a 1898 Krag rifle with an exceptionally clean bore about 3 years ago for around $800. Pretty straight forward to reload for. Many parts are available from S&S. Just a bit of silly Trivia; check out the rifle that Sargent Shultz carries around on Hogans Heros. It's not a 98 mauser, it's a Krag... lol The box magazine on the side is unmistakable.
 
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Smoothest bolt action out there and the funnest rifle I shoot. Given the design and metallurgy constraints, issues with which Malamute explains well above, the 30-40 is no powerhouse in the Krag, but that long neck cries out for BIG LEAD. You need to size to the throat rather than grooves. Mine likes .311" but they can run as big as .314 if they've had a hard life. If the Lyman 311284 over 22 grs 4227 doesn't shoot well for you, I would be very surprised.

The second largest Boon & Crockett elk, only surpassed in the last 10 years, was taken with a Krag, and Elmer Keith remarked on the preference for the Krag among hunters pre WWII, presumably for their ability to deliver those big 220 grs bullets. In modern actions like my Ruger No 3, the 30-40 can be loaded to hot 308/factory 30-06 levels and is an ideal single shot action cartridge.

For more information, Poyer's book:

https://www.amazon.com/American-Krag-Rifle-Carbine/dp/1882391314
 
Exactly which Krag is important. There's one on Gunbroker that's not getting much attention(12 bidders) and is currently below the minimum bid. Finish is mostly gone though.
Takes more than just sizing a .303 and the case will still be a bit short. A Brit is 2.222" long. A Krag is 2.314" long.
"...Ammo and brass are easily available online...." Nope. Ammo and brass is only made "seasonally" with no mention of when that season happens. Graf's is currently showing their brand at $42.99 per 50. None listed at Midway. No loaded ammo at either.
 
Wasn't aware that there was a problem finding it lately. Lots of older ammo is not continually produced but only made in runs. It (loaded 30-40 ammo) will be available again. It's not like ammo makers have discontinued it for good.
 
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Listen to Dog Soldier, I did and saved a ton on reloading brass. I worry about confusing it with my other 303 brass (the ones for my Enfields), but a sharpie does wonders.

I purchased an old cut down Krag on Gunbroker and got one with a nicely rusted and pitted bore. I kept it and said to myself, let the buyer beware. The rest of the rifle wasn't too bad. After a year of checking and checking again, I found a nice replacement barrel. Took rifle and new barrel to the gunsmith and a month later, had a nice cut down Krag with a 1903A3 front sight. A little help from Dog Soldier on brass and I had a shooter. Even cut down models are fetching a good price these days.
 
My dad carried a full length Krag during the 1947 deer season. That winter he had it cut back and a receiver sight installed, and gave it to me. My first deer rifle; I turned eleven before the next season.
 
Malamute said:
If you like old guns, I think they are pretty classy and interesting rifles. Id check the bolt carefully, I recall that one of the loading manuals mentioned (NRA?) that a some of the bolts they checked had cracks by the locking lug. They hadn't let go, but were slowly going towards having problems if cracks by the locking lug could be interpreted as such. Having one magnafluxed or other non-destructive testing may be worthwhile.

I recall it being described that parts could be checked by de-greasing, then dipped in gasoline, then wiped down, and waiting to see if gas seeped out of any cracks that were too small to easily notice. I may have the method incorrect, someone else may have a better way to describe it.
Click to expand...


It used to be common to lap the lug so that the emergency lug made contact. Probably still a good idea if you plan to shoot it much.

Another option is to load it with mild cast bullets - easier on old steel - plus your shoulder will thank you - that steel butt plate isn't very comfortable.
 
I have a late 98 Krag rifle with a 1903 cartouche. Horrible bore. Can smoke a clay pigeon at 100 yards almost every time. Very bad pitting in the bore but clearly visible rifling the entire length. I think the latter is more important.
 
Here's my '98 Krag along with a '95 7x57 Mauser I used for a Spanish-American War exercise.

393430616.jpg


The rifle is a joy to shoot and loaded to Krag pressure, the cases will last just about forever. Which will take some of the sting out of paying for them, heh?
My rifle likes the 180 grain Remington factory rounds OK, but it really loves reloads using 220 grain, full patch bullets salvaged from the split necks of 1920's Western ammunition.
-----krinko
 
Corpral_Agarn

That sound like a pretty decent price on the Krag, provided it's in decent condition. My Model 1898 Krag is one that I refurbished from being a parade/drill rifle from some Veteran's organization for many years. It was bright chrome plated (lots of local chrome plating shops back in the day), and had a thick coating of varnish on the wood. I deplated nearly all of the metal parts be soaking them in Hoppe's No. 9 for a couple of weeks, polishing them by hand, and then having them blued by a refinishing shop. The wood I refinished myself, lightly sanding the surface till the varnish was gone, staining the wood (on advice from an old friend of my father I came up with a pretty good match for the original stain color), and sealed it with several coats of tung oil. Left the bolt in the white as I read somewhere that's how they came originally and I think it turned out looking fairly nice. Still need to find a leather sling for it to complete the rebuild. Still have some Remington factory ammo for it. All in all a very satisfying rifle to work on during the winter months.



 
Smooth action, adequately strong for the .30-40 cartridge, good capacity for a hunting rifle. Like a leveraction, the magazine can be topped off with loose rounds.

Not as quick to reload in a gunfight as a Mauser with stripper clips. So the Krag lost out as a military rifle to the Springfield '03 but still has a lot of history behind it.

I made a point the last few gun shows to admire the Krags, both original issue and classically sporterized, on display. Have to fight that temptation.



ADDED: Locally I have heard people praise the 200gr to 220gr .30-40 Krag round for shooting big carp in the Clinch River. Heavy slow bullets penetrate water without breaking up. Bullets at 2500 fps up hit the water like hitting solid resistence and won't reach the fish. (I had wondered about the old movie The Sharkfighters 1956 why the guards carried M1 Carbines and not M1 Garands - Scott County fishermen say the 1900 fps .30 Carbine penetrates deeper in water than the 2700 fps .30-06, but the 1900fps .30-40 Krag 200gr to 220gr bullet is best.)

Fish shooting on the Clinch River became such an unstoppable tradition, it is granted an allowance in the Virginia game laws.
"4VAC15-320-150. Shooting Certain Fish in Clinch River in Scott County.
"It shall be lawful for any person holding a current license to fish to shoot suckers, redhorse and carp with a rifle, during the hours of sunrise to sunset, from April 15 to May 31, both inclusive, in the waters of the Clinch River within the limits of Scott County; ..."
 
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bannockburn said:
Corpral_Agarn

That sound like a pretty decent price on the Krag, provided it's in decent condition. My Model 1898 Krag is one that I refurbished from being a parade/drill rifle from some Veteran's organization for many years. It was bright chrome plated (lots of local chrome plating shops back in the day), and had a thick coating of varnish on the wood. I deplated nearly all of the metal parts be soaking them in Hoppe's No. 9 for a couple of weeks, polishing them by hand, and then having them blued by a refinishing shop. The wood I refinished myself, lightly sanding the surface till the varnish was gone, staining the wood (on advice from an old friend of my father I came up with a pretty good match for the original stain color), and sealed it with several coats of tung oil. Left the bolt in the white as I read somewhere that's how they came originally and I think it turned out looking fairly nice. Still need to find a leather sling for it to complete the rebuild. Still have some Remington factory ammo for it. All in all a very satisfying rifle to work on during the winter months.



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Very nice !!!
 
Alright, so I am going to have to go check it out again.

Once I get the 30-40 brass its just a regular 30 cal bullet right? same as a 308?

I will admit I am rather a novice when it comes to reloading.

Thanks all!
 
Dog Soldier said:
The "Parkhurst" stripper attachment was added to a few in 1898 American Krags. The Krag was fast to load never needed strippers.:)

http://jamesdjulia.com/item/lot-102...hurst-stripper-clip-loading-attachment-38202/
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That is not what the US Army thought. Two faults they found with the rifle after the debacle at San Juan Hill was it was under-powered and slow to load. They tried to fix both problems and could not satisfactorily do so. End result was the Springfield M1903. While it might be fast enough to load for a deer hunter, it fails when compared to the stripper clips of the Mauser and those other rifles that followed.


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Corpral_Agarn said:
Alright, so I am going to have to go check it out again.

Once I get the 30-40 brass its just a regular 30 cal bullet right? same as a 308?

I will admit I am rather a novice when it comes to reloading.

Thanks all!
Click to expand...

Yes, it should use any standard 30 cal .308" diameter bullets.
 
Acera said:
That is not what the US Army thought. Two faults they found with the rifle after the debacle at San Juan Hill was it was under-powered and slow to load. They tried to fix both problems and could not satisfactorily do so. End result was the Springfield M1903. While it might be fast enough to load for a deer hunter, it fails when compared to the stripper clips of the Mauser and those other rifles that followed.


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Click to expand...

Under powered certainly. But could you please provide reference for the claim of slow to load? The Krag regularly won speed shooting competitions in Norway that required multiple reloads against stripper clip fed rifles.
 
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