Layoffs at the Arms (Remington)

[dh1633pm]

Rumor in the local area is a bunch of employees will be let go at "The Arms" (Remington Arms) this next week or so. As many already know there was a large furlow over the summer for most employees except Marlin. Marlin operating full tilt.

 

[mdThanatos]

Remington has been struggling, the plant in Huntsville has not been as successful as everyone hoped it would be. Remington had to renegotiate with the city and give up some of the tax incentives. While I am not the biggest Remington supporter, I do hope they stick around.

 

[D.B. Cooper]

The free market at work. Make junk. Sales drop. Company folds.

 

[redneck2]

In the 60’s when I was really getting into shooting, Remington was pretty much the mainstay. Had many really good Remington guns over the years

 

[dh1633pm]

Marlin is working full time. It could be a ship first, fix later method of quality has taken hold there. The rank and file worker might agree but management would never. Who knows. My last 700 I purchased last fall was of excellent quality. So who knows.

 

[George P]

The free market at work. Make junk. Sales drop. Company folds.

Trying to compete with Chinese crap where folks make $1/day is hard when the buying public thinks about dollars over loyalty

 

[Riomouse911]

Sadly, it’s not Chinese bolt guns that drove Remingtons reputation into the dirt. Other companies found a way to make affordable guns that work well (Savage, T\C, Howa) unlike Remingtons try, and their flagship offerings fell short of expectations due to bean-counter mentality foisted on them by the buyout (700, 870 express, that lousy R51 pistol, etc.)

In the gun biz; once you lose a solid reputation by going “on the cheap” it takes a long time and a lot of work to earn the trust of shooters back.

Cerebus doesn’t have a long time, nor did they think about how critical shooters are when cost cuts are made that affect the quality of their products (55 years later and we’re still bitching about Winchester’s 1964 decisions!)

Stay safe.

 

[Steve S.]

Mature company with a complacent management and labor group; zero creativity and everyone just passing time to retirement - it eventually happens to every company.

 

[hdwhit]

George P wrote:
Trying to compete with Chinese crap where folks make $1/day...

Stop repeating an ancient fiction.

Get up to date.

Industrial labor in eastern China now makes the same or MORE than most workers in the United States.

 

[D.B. Cooper]

Industrial labor in eastern China now makes the same or MORE than most workers in the United States.

I'm sorry. I don't usually do this, but in this case, you'll have to prove your facts to me, using reliable, unbiased, peer-reviewed sources, before I believe that. And don't tell me to "look it up." It's your claim, you prove it. Otherwise, it flies in the face of too many years of common knowledge to be believed.

 

[D.B. Cooper]

Sadly, it’s not Chinese bolt guns that drove Remingtons reputation into the dirt. Other companies found a way to make affordable guns that work well (Savage, T\C, Howa) unlike Remingtons try, and their flagship offerings fell short of expectations due to beam-counter mentality foisted on them by the buyout (700, 870 express, that lousy R51 pistol, etc.)

In the gun biz; once you lose a solid reputation by going “on the cheap” it takes a long time and a lot of work to earn the trust of shooters back.

Cerebus doesn’t have a long time, nor did they think about how critical shooters are when cost cuts are made that affect the quality of their products (55 years later and we’re still bitching about Winchester’s 1964 decisions!)

Stay safe.

I was already thinking about Winchester before you posted this. I, for one, am really sick and tired of the race to the bottom with all of this cheap-o crap that gun manufacturers are turning out. I miss the days of finely crafted, high quality, American made products.

 

[NMachine]

Fit and finish be what it may. Modern firearms manufacturers can consistently produce rifles that perform much more accurately than 30+ years ago. I remember being satisfied with 1.5-2 moa rifles years ago. Fact is with modern manufacturing technology, 1 moa is the norm in accuracy, even in the most budget friendly platform. I say take the good advancements in manufacturing, and enjoy accuracy potential at a budget price.

 

[Jeb Stuart]

I was already thinking about Winchester before you posted this. I, for one, am really sick and tired of the race to the bottom with all of this cheap-o crap that gun manufacturers are turning out. I miss the days of finely crafted, high quality, American made products.

Do not understand why your are "Sick and Tired of the race to the bottom." Just simply buy a higher priced gun that you feel has more quality. Should be no big deal, Plenty of them out there that would love to have your money.
And your opinion that they are "Junk" is just that opinion. I have no dog in this fight, do not own one, but go to the range on a regular basis and many folks love them. And you may own a gun others think is "JUNK". Maybe it is time to start respecting others decisions.
"Have some respect for other owners, no matter what they choose to buy, even if it is not made by your favorite manufacturer. It doesn't mean you have to agree with their decision, it merely means they have the same choices you do and decided to go a different way.",

And I doubt any members on this forum actually have insider information of why they are laying off. Maybe it is something as simple as it is August and Production is down in the industry. Rumors and more Rumors. The Gun forums thrive on it.

 

[dh1633pm]

Lets get back on track. Remington has had its share of problems. From the hasty release of a handgun to GC issues. The 700 I purchased as a fine example of their work. Marlin has certainly started to get its act together. There is room in the market for lots of firearms both low end and high end. The bottom line is a lot of people in an already depressed area are probably going to be let go. Some have work there for years. My Grandfather and Uncle both retired from the Arms. I wish them the best. We firearms purchasers, want quality products that we don't have to ship back to the factory. Even for a recall. Doesn't matter how well they are supported if they need support all too often.

 

[Jeb Stuart]

Lets get back on track. Remington has had its share of problems. From the hasty release of a handgun to GC issues. The 700 I purchased as a fine example of their work. Marlin has certainly started to get its act together. There is room in the market for lots of firearms both low end and high end. The bottom line is a lot of people in an already depressed area are probably going to be let go. Some have work there for years. My Grandfather and Uncle both retired from the Arms. I wish them the best. We firearms purchasers, want quality products that we don't have to ship back to the factory. Even for a recall. Doesn't matter how well they are supported if they need support all too often.

Maybe the whole thread is off track. But agree, I hope the best for all the employees of all manufacturers. It is a volatile age for gun ownership. Many want to close them all down.

 

[redneck2]

I miss the days of finely crafted, high quality, American made products.

Uhhhhh....don’t agree with that. If not, there wouldn’t be a Walmart selling Chinese products in every decent size town in America

When is the last time you saw a “what’s the best quality.......” versus “where can I find the cheapest......” thread? There are a few, but it isn’t a race to the bottom in quality, it’s a race to the bottom in price. Palmetto is a perfect example.

If you want a well made American rifle, buy a Kimber. I suspect for every Kimber sold there are a dozen Savages sold

Savage is an example of an acceptable (to some shooters) level of quality at an acceptable price point. I suspect that’s what Remington was striving for, but they fell out the bottom. You’re right that it will take a long, long time to rebuild their reputation

The sad thing is that I’ve had several Remington 700’s that were excellent to incredible shooters. Wouldn’t buy one now when CZ’s do so well at the same price point

 

[dh1633pm]

Whats the best versus what one can afford (or even what one wants to afford) is an excellent point redneck2.

 

[huntsman]

Millennials don’t want traditional pump guns, bolt actions, they want the guns that show up in the games they play and in the CGI movies they watch.

 

[il_10]

Millennials don’t want traditional pump guns, bolt actions, they want the guns that show up in the games they play and in the CGI movies they watch.

We're also in our 30's now, so I'd reckon we're close to the biggest buying demographic. It doesn't do a corporation much good to put out an inferior product and hope that nostalgia will keep their sales up...

 

[dh1633pm]

The millennial's may want what they want, but those of us older and more established have the funds.

 

[Jeb Stuart]

Millennials don’t want traditional pump guns, bolt actions, they want the guns that show up in the games they play and in the CGI movies they watch.

Man, you hit the nail on the head. High Round Count, High end Military combat weapons to include shotguns, Tacticool anything. The time when a single shot rifle is a thing of the past. No more becoming one with the gun, taking your time, getting to know the wind, the sun etc. A era when a teen will own a 1,000 dollar cell phone. And it is getting worse.
Don't have to go far to find one. Just come to my local indoor Pistol range and you will find many shooting a ton of ammo out of a AR. Normally as fast as they are allowed.

 

[Texas10mm]

I was already thinking about Winchester before you posted this. I, for one, am really sick and tired of the race to the bottom with all of this cheap-o crap that gun manufacturers are turning out. I miss the days of finely crafted, high quality, American made products.

But you want it for $350, correct? What you want is still available. But you need to adjust your budget.

 

[earlthegoat2]

Accuracy is a highly over rated attribute in firearms these days and an ever lowering bar of threshold of quality as manufacturing technologies and techniques have improved.

I love Remington firearms and own quite a few. (all built before I was in my teens) Unfortunately for their future, there is a plethora of used market items that are generally better in quality and appearance. Yeah, maybe not as accurate but I don’t see much difference between 1.5” and 1” @100.

 

[D.B. Cooper]

Man, you hit the nail on the head. High Round Count, High end Military combat weapons to include shotguns, Tacticool anything. The time when a single shot rifle is a thing of the past. No more becoming one with the gun, taking your time, getting to know the wind, the sun etc. A era when a teen will own a 1,000 dollar cell phone. And it is getting worse.
Don't have to go far to find one. Just come to my local indoor Pistol range and you will find many shooting a ton of ammo out of a AR. Normally as fast as they are allowed.

But wait! No, no, no! You can't say that! You have to "respect their decision." You think their guns are tacticool, but that's your opinion. Plenty of them think your gun is an old fashioned fudd gun.

PS: I agree with you. My son won't shoot my 1911, the 10/22 I bought him, nor anything else, but he'll shoot my plastic 9mm. Go figure.

 

[D.B. Cooper]

But you want it for $350, correct? What you want is still available. But you need to adjust your budget.

Not necessarily. I don't generally look at $300 guns unless it's something I'm going use in a disposable role. I know that quality costs. But when even a thousand dollar Ruger has MIM parts on it, when even a thousand dollar Smith & Wesson revolver has a sleeved barrel, when an $800 rifle has the same plastic trigger guard as the $400 version...

This is why I say it's a race to the bottom. The guns we're buying don't have the same quality as the guns my father bought, but, even considering inflation, the guns today are costing as much or more. I can understand and go along with using modern materials for various benefits: composite stocks are usually lighter and tend to remain straighter than wood, carbon fiber to save weight, stainless steel for corrosion prevention, etc., but most of what we see in guns today has only two affects: reduced production cost, increased profits.